"Lob Rockster
Basically a "real" DVB-S box will see them as data streams; blind scan should find them or as the DS thread points out, putting in V/APIDs will get you the channel directly.

So what box have you that's deficient?"

I have an old box (5 yerars) bought in Turkey complete with Turkish manual, as I said I can't tune in manually the VPID and APID or at least I don't know how to.