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  #121  
Old 16.01.2015, 14:37
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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A short while later a colleague of the customer service assistant, having until this point nothing to do with our discussion, lent in and told me it was my fault for booking with cheaptickets.ch as they’re “shit”. That was too much and I lost my temper. How could it be that this mess was my fault for booking through a third party? What was perhaps most shocking as that once my voices were raised, this other assistant started screaming and shouting at me. He told me “to f**k off” and that I should have some “ respect”. I don’t know about you, but I wasn’t aware working as a customer service assistant in an airport was a position that automatically commanded respect.
I found this part of your account the most astonishing. Was there anything you did or said that provoked this response? In any case, it's not acceptable or professional for a "customer service agent" to swear back at a customer so I'm just curious what could have triggered that level of response.
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  #122  
Old 16.01.2015, 15:00
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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I found this part of your account the most astonishing. Was there anything you did or said that provoked this response? In any case, it's not acceptable or professional for a "customer service agent" to swear back at a customer so I'm just curious what could have triggered that level of response.

Imagination ?
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  #123  
Old 16.01.2015, 15:06
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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That's the wonderful thing about Basel airport, everything is far cheaper on the French side: Parking, Flights, Car hire, even the queues at passport control are shorter. Why anyone uses the Swiss side after being here a while is beyond me.
The French and Swiss sides are clearly separated on the arrivals side, but on the departures side its not even really clear (to me at least) which bit is supposed to be French. And in my experience, nothing at that airport is cheap, no matter where you go, so if you're likely to want something to eat or drink it's often best to bring your own.
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  #124  
Old 16.01.2015, 15:08
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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I found this part of your account the most astonishing. Was there anything you did or said that provoked this response? In any case, it's not acceptable or professional for a "customer service agent" to swear back at a customer so I'm just curious what could have triggered that level of response.
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Imagination ?
Nope, 100% it happened. After being told that this fiasco was my fault for booking with cheaptickets.ch because "they're shit", I lost my temper. I raised my voice and said I wasn't the one accepting bookings from shitty booking agents. To which he replied I should show some "fuggin respect" and that I should take my "fuggin papers" and "f**k off".

I've also never encountered anything like this. I can laugh about it now, but at the time I wanted to remove his spleen. But you're right, completely unprofessional.
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  #125  
Old 16.01.2015, 15:09
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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The French and Swiss sides are clearly separated on the arrivals side, but on the departures side its not even really clear (to me at least) which bit is supposed to be French. And in my experience, nothing at that airport is cheap, no matter where you go, so if you're likely to want something to eat or drink it's often best to bring your own.
Interestingly (or not, it depends how sad you are) the cafe charges different prices for the same stuff depending on whether you access it from the French or the Swiss side. As you can walk from one to the other by going back past the security checkpoint area, and the savings are of the order of 1/3, it's worth the walk if you fancy a pre-departure coffee.
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  #126  
Old 16.01.2015, 15:23
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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To which he replied I should show some " respect" and that I should take my " papers" and "f**k off".
I was just wondering if you had thrown in any f words or any personal insults which could have triggered this retaliation. If not, I would have gotten his/her name and written a formal complaint to the airline about the uncalled for language. A customer representative is supposed to represent the company after all.
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  #127  
Old 16.01.2015, 15:27
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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I was just wondering if you had thrown in any f words or any personal insults which could have triggered this retaliation. If not, I would have gotten his/her name and written a formal complaint to the airline about the uncalled for language. A customer representative is supposed to represent the company after all.
I did all these things, and got an apology from KLM saying they would investigate the matter and forward it to the relevant department, which I assume is code for waste paper basket. They said they were unable to give details of how their internal processes operate.
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  #128  
Old 16.01.2015, 16:08
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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I did all these things, and got an apology from KLM saying they would investigate the matter and forward it to the relevant department
Well if you really want to chase it up you could write a follow-up letter and send a copy to the Ombudsmann. Make sure you state clearly that you have copied the Ombudsman. Depends how strongly you were affected being sworn at. And like all important mail, send it "Einschreiben".
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  #129  
Old 16.01.2015, 16:34
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

shouldn't this thread be "the budget airline that thinks it's a flag carrier"?
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  #130  
Old 14.02.2015, 00:44
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

I've just wanted to post some good experiences I've had with KLM. Booking through their website has always been a challenge for me and my last booking was no exception. Although some issues arose due to various reasons, each person I spoke to in their customer service department was kind, cooperative and even showed goodwill.

I had some issues last year and was frustrated with the customer service I received. However, having spoken to at least three difference members of their customer service staff this week, I can only compliment the employees for showing the respect and knowledge needed in sorting out issues.

Complaints are written quickly but good service often goes unrewarded. With this post, I wanted to rectify that situation a bit.
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  #131  
Old 14.02.2015, 06:23
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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I've just wanted to post some good experiences I've had with KLM. Booking through their website has always been a challenge for me and my last booking was no exception. Although some issues arose due to various reasons, each person I spoke to in their customer service department was kind, cooperative and even showed goodwill.

I had some issues last year and was frustrated with the customer service I received. However, having spoken to at least three difference members of their customer service staff this week, I can only compliment the employees for showing the respect and knowledge needed in sorting out issues.

Complaints are written quickly but good service often goes unrewarded. With this post, I wanted to rectify that situation a bit.

I once used KLM to get over to the USA,. and everything was perfect, from the booking over to on-board-Service






ç************************************************* ******************************




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BA currently has an issue with carry-on as they've introduced "hand baggage only" fares so many people are now taking pretty big carry-on bags instead of checking in a case.

However, BA still allow two carry-on bags (I believe) although the second one has to be small enough to fit under the seat in front (even if there is no seat in front for your particular seat, and hence it has to go overhead anyway).


Reminds me of BOAC, the predecessor of BA for intercontinental routes, and the nickname Better On A Camel

and of course the German Abbreviation of K L M
= Königliche Luft-Matratze
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  #132  
Old 14.02.2015, 13:30
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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KLM isn't so bad once you are boarded, but the Zürich groundstaff (at check-in 2) are rather incompetent

(Very broad generalisation based on 2 experiences where I arrived 2.5 hours early to airport, dog in tow and one human child in tow, only to miss flight because they didn't know how to do the canine check-in. Needless to say they could have cared less that we would miss connection in Amsterdam to catch night ferry back to UK and no possibility to compensate for a hotel. Airports can be very cold at night, and 5 hours feels like 9 or 10.

KLM staff at Schiphol, on the other hand, are very efficient. I think when flying national flag-bearing airlines one misses out on the "familiarity" if the overseas positions are staffed by people having no sense of the culture of the airline they represent.

While the cargo-side of AirFrance-KLM is heavily KLM dominated now, the Pax-side is increasingly AF dominated. AF is 75% of the Company. To me, AF-KL folks at the airport so are representing French culture
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  #133  
Old 01.12.2015, 10:12
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

Another KLM tale just as a reminder to what shits they are.

Mate of mine due to fly from UK to Seoul via Amsterdam. Arrives at the airport in plenty of time. Boards the plane on time. Once on the plane, gets informed that they can't leave due to xyz. 2 hours later, they're still sat there waiting to push back, he realises there's no chance he's going to make the connection in Schiphol. Asks to leave the aircraft to go home and re-book for the following day. Is refused and has to sit there another hour before they finally fly off to Amsterdam. Day and half then spent in Amsterdam on KLM vouchers before flying on to Seoul arriving over a day later than planned.
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  #134  
Old 01.12.2015, 10:18
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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Interestingly (or not, it depends how sad you are) the cafe charges different prices for the same stuff depending on whether you access it from the French or the Swiss side. As you can walk from one to the other by going back past the security checkpoint area, and the savings are of the order of 1/3, it's worth the walk if you fancy a pre-departure coffee.
Did this last week, walked over to the French side and the guy told me the breakfast special combo was only available on the Swiss side. I said it was on his price list on the French side too but he said that's a mistake, I have to go to the Swiss side or pay the Swiss price.

I decided not to argue but just to wait and have my breakfast on the plane. It turned out Easyjet had changed their brand of coffee for something a thousand times more cr@ppy without adjusting the price. So it's really going to be bring my own grub next time.

Mind you, Easyjet breakfast porridge is still very good and priced very fairly. I like to add a drop of whisky.

Just don't try asking for that on a legacy airline.
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  #135  
Old 01.12.2015, 10:19
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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While the cargo-side of AirFrance-KLM is heavily KLM dominated now, the Pax-side is increasingly AF dominated. AF is 75% of the Company. To me, AF-KL folks at the airport so are representing French culture
I used to fly KLM all the time, and they had excellent service.

I've flown Air France twice; they ran out of food both times, were 2+ hours late both times, and had the worst staff I've ever experienced with the exception of the now (unsurprisingly) defunkt Canadian.

AF are firmly at the bottom of my list of airline choices, but I haven't flown KLM since the merger.
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  #136  
Old 01.12.2015, 10:39
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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Another KLM tale just as a reminder to what shits they are.

Mate of mine due to fly from UK to Seoul via Amsterdam. Arrives at the airport in plenty of time. Boards the plane on time. Once on the plane, gets informed that they can't leave due to xyz. 2 hours later, they're still sat there waiting to push back, he realises there's no chance he's going to make the connection in Schiphol. Asks to leave the aircraft to go home and re-book for the following day. Is refused and has to sit there another hour before they finally fly off to Amsterdam. Day and half then spent in Amsterdam on KLM vouchers before flying on to Seoul arriving over a day later than planned.
Pretty shitty situation, yes, but not much the airline can do. I thought that once the doors are shut, they are shut. Same deal when arriving late at the gate. Procedures for all airlines are the same on that point.

Also, if one guy wants to get off, what does that mean for the luggage?

You also don't know if they were waiting for an imminent ok to depart. I don't think you can pin this one on KLM alone. Happy to be educated on that point though.

Personally, I am a bit "meh" about KLM either way. I generally like Schiphol, with the exception of the arse-ache of when you need to go through Schengen on the airside. In my experience adds 45 min the transfer time, so generally I avoid.

I still dislike Swiss and think they rank somewhere between Ryanair and KLM. I've never forgiven them for charging me 700 CHF for a ticket (BSL-Vienna) and then being told I could have a yoghurt OR croissant - but not both... it was when they were trying to go all budget but hadn't quite worked out that means you also need to drop the price.

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That's the wonderful thing about Basel airport, everything is far cheaper on the French side: Parking, Flights, Car hire, even the queues at passport control are shorter. Why anyone uses the Swiss side after being here a while is beyond me.
'Cos we all earn over 120,000 150,000 CHF.
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  #137  
Old 01.12.2015, 10:49
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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Another KLM tale just as a reminder to what shits they are.

Mate of mine due to fly from UK to Seoul via Amsterdam. Arrives at the airport in plenty of time. Boards the plane on time. Once on the plane, gets informed that they can't leave due to xyz. 2 hours later, they're still sat there waiting to push back, he realises there's no chance he's going to make the connection in Schiphol. Asks to leave the aircraft to go home and re-book for the following day. Is refused and has to sit there another hour before they finally fly off to Amsterdam. Day and half then spent in Amsterdam on KLM vouchers before flying on to Seoul arriving over a day later than planned.
Well, it's close to impossible to let people off an airplane once the doors are shut, today more than ever. They would have to unboard luggage and whatnot; it's hardly just 'walking off the plane'. I once spent over 4 hours on the tarmac in Zurich on a Swiss flight, missed my connecting flight in Miami (which I knew would happen) and had to organize a hotel and new flight in MIA when arriving at 10.30pm, no ground staff around to help either. Shit happens - it's not always the airline's fault and after all, they have to bring you from A to B, that is all - when and how that (sometimes) happens is another story.
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  #138  
Old 01.12.2015, 11:32
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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Well, it's close to impossible to let people off an airplane once the doors are shut, today more than ever. They would have to unboard luggage and whatnot; it's hardly just 'walking off the plane'.
I understand that some delays happen totally out of the blue, but in many cases the delays are known and the cabin and ground staff have no illusion whatsoever as to being able to take off on time. Why then do they insist on boarding people anyway and will not break the news to them until the last minute? To me it shows disrespect for the customer.
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  #139  
Old 01.12.2015, 11:53
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

I think you mean cockpit crew not cabin. If there is a slot time it's sometimes possible that a slot opens up and the pushback can happen earlier. If due to late pax etc they miss the slot then they have to wait.
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Old 01.12.2015, 12:00
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Re: Avoid KLM - the flag carrier that think's its a budget airline

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Well, it's close to impossible to let people off an airplane once the doors are shut, today more than ever.
Try lighting up a ciggi in your seat and then see how "close to impossible" it is to let someone off the plane. I get your point though.

Anyhow, the airport is about half the size of Basel, so it's hardly Heathrow. They could have easily disembarked everyone rather than have them wait at the gate for so long. Despite what the airlines tell you, they normally know how long a plane is going to be delayed.
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