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  #21  
Old 06.12.2015, 22:42
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

stlemans groans at Richdog. I had no idea it wasn't a double account.
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  #22  
Old 06.12.2015, 23:32
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

It's a trick to fool you- clever hey
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  #23  
Old 07.12.2015, 00:36
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

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Besides, you probably gave off a condescending air and didn't treat your server as an equal.

!
That must be true though for our little OP friend here...

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Do you know what Tom, that sentence sums it up perfectly and eloquently and applies to pretty much all complaints of this nature. In the UK/US we (for the most part) have a culturally ingrained sense of politeness and fair play which we just take for granted, and we automatically weigh it into our decision making at any given point or normal everyday situation. While the Swiss are in general very polite and decent people, that sense of fairness and social etiquette doesn't seem to exist for the more trivial aspects of daily life like queueing and serving.


Seriously now, do you have any idea how ridiculous and pompous that kind of statement is? In general, not only coming from your mouth....

Last edited by greenmount; 07.12.2015 at 01:03.
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  #24  
Old 07.12.2015, 04:23
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

Ha ha ha ! is that you


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  #25  
Old 07.12.2015, 05:33
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

You sure as hell better not cut the queue in the US. This is one of the things I love about my country:

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/...icle-1.1762538

If I were on the shooter's jury, I'd vote to acquit.

I have to work on my deep breathing to be ready for the line-jumpers in Switzerland. I almost burst a blood vessel the last time I was in the Zurich airport (they were even worse at the Geneva airport).
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  #26  
Old 07.12.2015, 08:37
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

Easy to blame others when you have no bar presence.
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  #27  
Old 07.12.2015, 08:40
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

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easy to blame others when you have no bar presence.:d
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  #28  
Old 07.12.2015, 08:49
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

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.....

For some reason, many Swiss bar staff completely lack the ability to keep an eye on who has been waiting at the bar and making a mental queue of who to serve next. .....
I presume the only reason you were at the bar is you had already spent half an hour sitting at a table waving like a loon trying to get some service then gave up?
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  #29  
Old 07.12.2015, 09:31
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

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Haven't made a light-hearted complaint thread in a while, and while I love this country to the nth degree, in my years here one of my wee gripes has always been...bar staff.

For some reason, many Swiss bar staff completely lack the ability to keep an eye on who has been waiting at the bar and making a mental queue of who to serve next. It's like, despite their eyes flickering across you multiple times as they make their drinks during the 10 minutes you have been waiting to be served, they have just really only seen you for the first time, and ask "Who is next?" while looking at everyone. This inevitably results in some plonk or plonkette who know full well that they have just got to the bar ordering their drinks before everyone else.

This is such a basic skill for any bar man or woman, and I am so used to it in the UK (or UK pubs in CH) that I find it absolutely baffling that it seems to be such a problem in Switzerland. Add to this a trend for staff to look flustered and service to massively degrade in a bar that is only half or less full, and after a while it genuinely becomes an annoyance.

Anyone else experienced this in Swiss bars, or is it only Zürich that has this problem?
Hear hear.
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  #30  
Old 07.12.2015, 09:41
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I've worked in a bar. It's not difficult to make a mental queue and it's a lot quicker. You make eye contact when you're nearly done serving the previous customer to let them know they're next; they're ready with their order and you're not buggering about asking who's next.

If someone tries to jump in, then they're given short shrift.

Oh. And bar staff. Learn to add up in your head. It'll save the double trip to the till.

Last edited by mirfield; 07.12.2015 at 16:30. Reason: Merge two posts into one
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  #31  
Old 07.12.2015, 09:47
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

Also a victim of this practice (lack of practice) here in LU.

To a certain extent it is about your own presence & making it felt/heard, also about the bartenders & other customers absence of awareness of others (namely you) & also & I think this is a biggest factor the Bar tender is himself/herself not a drinker. SHOCK HORROR!

They don't know our expectations as drinkers, they don't know the implicit rules of bar room interactions & pecking orders. These are soft skill best learned on the customer side side of the bar, right?
After all, we here are apparently experts & I guess we mostly sit on the customer side of the bar.

I saw the same behaviour with serving staff in Asia, you make your order for drink or dinner or whatever after chasing them to serve you & then it gets screwed up anyway, even in higher end establishments - I put this down to poor training but also to my belief that these staff are not used to eating / drinking out & as such they don't have a clue what your expectations are.

It would be like me trying to help an astronaut prepare for flight- even if I get the training & pass the course there are aspects of his expectations I am just unaware of...or something.

Little tip: when you have just ordered your last course/last drink for that particular establishment call the bill immediately on receipt of the food/ drink. This way you don't need to hang around 30 minutes after you're finished eating to get their attention & wait for them to bring the bill & process the bill.
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  #32  
Old 07.12.2015, 10:11
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

It has nothing to do with the inability of Swiss service people to do their jobs. They don't care enough. And the reason is the RAV. They know that if they lose their jobs they'll be more than OK for a long time and so the general service level drops so that they don't even have to worry about that anymore.
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  #33  
Old 07.12.2015, 10:29
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

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I presume the only reason you were at the bar is you had already spent half an hour sitting at a table waving like a loon trying to get some service then gave up?
Hah, we had this problem on Saturday Corazon with our group. The bar girl only took part of our order then left to make it, then came back 25mins later to take the rest of the orders (including getting part of it wrong). Then at the end, despite initially promising we could split the bill, she got flustered and kicked up a fuss when she had to split it a few ways as agreed. Pretty clueless, really.

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Little tip: when you have just ordered your last course/last drink for that particular establishment call the bill immediately on receipt of the food/ drink. This way you don't need to hang around 30 minutes after you're finished eating to get their attention & wait for them to bring the bill & process the bill.
Yeah I sometimes do this if I know it's going to be a long wait to get the bill.

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It has nothing to do with the inability of Swiss service people to do their jobs. They don't care enough. And the reason is the RAV. They know that if they lose their jobs they'll be more than OK for a long time and so the general service level drops so that they don't even have to worry about that anymore.
This to some extent is partly true, I think. It's not that they don't care at all as I think it would be unfair to say that, it's just that there is no pressure to perform, or fear of consequences for not providing good service.
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  #34  
Old 07.12.2015, 10:35
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

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This to some extent is partly true, I think. It's not that they don't care at all as I think it would be unfair to say that, it's just that there is no pressure to perform, or fear of consequences for not providing good service.
I think the pressure to perform is everything in service sales. Evidence: the US extreme where tips are all of, or the main part of earnings. In the US (for better or for worse) wait staff are desperate to impress. Tipping in Switzerland is unheard of - they neither want or need your money, they already get paid well and they'll get to your order when they're good and ready thank you very much.
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  #35  
Old 07.12.2015, 10:49
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

Hmm, just sayin' - you do realise that the great majority of bar and restaurant staff, are, well, not Swiss, don't you? and working in a or several foreign languages. But yes, again, I know what you mean overall.
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  #36  
Old 07.12.2015, 10:54
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

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Hmm, just sayin' - you do realise that the great majority of bar and restaurant staff, are, well, not Swiss, don't you? and working in a or several foreign languages. But yes, again, I know what you mean overall.
Just out of interest, on what basis do you say that, do you go regularly to bars in Zürich? The majority of bar men and women I meet in non-Irish pubs are Swiss (or at least, speak good Swiss German, which means they have likely been here many years at the least) and I go to enough Swiss bars in Zürich to get a decent impression of that.
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  #37  
Old 07.12.2015, 11:08
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

You are so right, I am not a frequent bar visitor in Zurich
But I base my comments on bars and restaurants in Lausanne, Neuchâtel and Romandie in general as well as ski resorts we have visited all over. Most are East Europeans- and do a pretty good job overall- but struggle with the language but can't show it.

As said, overall I agree with you- as Mirfield describes, a good UK bartender makes mental notes all the time about who arrived when and tot everything up in their head- brilliant.
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Old 07.12.2015, 11:11
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

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Just out of interest, on what basis do you say that, do you go regularly to bars in Zürich? The majority of bar men and women I meet in non-Irish pubs are Swiss (or at least, speak good Swiss German, which means they have likely been here many years at the least) and I go to enough Swiss bars in Zürich to get a decent impression of that.
Regarding Irish Bars - I do think that Irish Bars are the exception to the rule when it comes to prompt service, generally speaking.

There will of course be exceptions to the exception.
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  #39  
Old 07.12.2015, 11:14
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

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You are so right, I am not a frequent bar visitor in Zurich
That's ok Oldie, since when has a lack of relevant facts or experience stopped you giving an an opinion.

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Regarding Irish Bars - I do think that Irish Bars are the exception to the rule when it comes to prompt service, generally speaking.

There will of course be exceptions to the exception.
Yeah, they are generally experienced UK bar staff and pretty good in general.
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  #40  
Old 07.12.2015, 11:16
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Re: Swiss bar staff awareness when serving drinks...

Yesterday I drove to Zurich and because so many people came into the city, getting a parking place was crazy. We waited in line in a parking place close to the center. The queue was to obvious to ignore it. In front of us was a turkish guy and behind us was a spanish guy (I know because we spoke to them after the incident). A car passed the line and waited on the other side of the parking. The moment a car left, he jumped in front of the turkish guy. He was Swiss. The turkish guy (with two children in his car!!) got out but the Swiss guy just stayed in his car talking through his opened window. He stayed there for 10 minutes until the turkish guy found another place. We waited for another 20 minutes and just when we found a place a Swiss guy tried to get the place. I told him nicely that we have been waiting for 40 minutes but he only left after my wife blocked his access. When he failed he tried to get the parking found by the Spanish guy behind me. He failed again when the wife blocked him. I am not saying that only the Swiss are doing this but it is not the first time this happens to us.
So I agree with Richdog because I work at the airport and I can prove his point with many situations but it would take me too many posts but it happens at the bars and in the shops many times. I do not know why but a Swiss guy said that they take advantage of the fact that because the Swiss are not confrontational, they believe that everybody will go nuts on the inside but will not say anything. If you do say something...they ignore you.


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Do you know what Tom, that sentence sums it up perfectly and eloquently and applies to pretty much all complaints of this nature. In the UK/US we (for the most part) have a culturally ingrained sense of politeness and fair play which we just take for granted, and we automatically weigh it into our decision making at any given point or normal everyday situation. While the Swiss are in general very polite and decent people, that sense of fairness and social etiquette doesn't seem to exist for the more trivial aspects of daily life like queueing and serving.
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