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Old 30.10.2016, 09:55
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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back on track, since it is a Sunday and most people are going to end up here anyways...

OP, give Geneva another shot...the women are very friendly (in cafes and public places) and talk to you, no mater what you look like...unlike in Zurich where you are considered to be mentally diseased if you start a conversation with a stranger.

the money, yeah i agree with you there, its a sacrifice however, there is no reason why you shouldn't spend at least 2 weekends a month outside this dreary place (i know i do).
i tried making friends, but in the end the effort required here is not worth it, when you can trip, fall and loose yourself in a pretty french or Italian girl in the towns across the border.
wish you best of luck, and if you are smart, in 5 years time you will be able to amass enough wealth to leave this place and set up a really good life anywhere else in the world (again, speaking from personal experience here).
Whether he has ever been to Geneva in the first place is questionable. In the OP he says he's heard the night life is better but he's never been and later on in the thread he says he was there but got out as quickly as he could.

These trolls really need to get their stories straight before posting.

It is however quite an entertaining thread.
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  #262  
Old 30.10.2016, 10:32
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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Went in France for two days, met bunch of people (they can barely speak english, but they put effort in it) and have met two nice student girls, who to my surprise invited me to their home. I couldn't comprehend how there can be so much difference for me just by heading 2 hours on north.
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switzerland is a necessary evil to make investments. If it wasn't for that I'd be wasting my life here (which I'm still questioning) and it would be like going voluntary in prison. Most of expats who i do know, and who are in the same age range, don't have any intend to stay here. I recall my first week in CH, when I met a group of german guys, for who I though they were swiss (in that time i wasn't able to differentiate between swiss and german). We got into a talk and somehow I ended with saying:"Maybe it's good to retire here in CH". They all started laughing, and then one of them said:"Dude, one simply doesn't stay in switzerland. At this point you may not know what we're talking about, but you'll see it in a few months why."
Really? Do you really, really think the French and the Germans are less racist/narrow-minded/judgemental/etc etc on average ?

Moaha hahahaha.

But yeah, the grass is always greener...so much truth in these words. If you would live there you'd see it for yourself, but hey...it's nice to have some illusions. Keep them intact, don't let reality alter any of them. It helps.

Last edited by greenmount; 30.10.2016 at 10:47. Reason: typo
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  #263  
Old 30.10.2016, 10:44
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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Really? Do you really, really think the French and the Germans are less racist/narrow-minded/judgemental/etc etc in average ?

Moaha hahahaha.

But yeah, the grass is always greener...so much truth in these words. If you would live there you'd see it for yourself, but hey...it's nice to have some illusions. Keep them intact, don't let reality alter any of them. It helps.
It doesn't matter if the OP is "right" or not about Switzerland, France, or Germany. His perception is greatly at odds with mine, which is not surprising, we are two different people, at two different stages of our lives, presumably with differing aims and desires.

In a similar manner, it doesn't matter if France, Germany, Iceland, or Canada are "better" - given how readily the OP seems to infer the general from the individual I don't think he is going to be happy anywhere.

What a shame.

Switzerland isn't perfect. Neither am I, nor any human I have ever met.
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  #264  
Old 30.10.2016, 10:51
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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It doesn't matter if the OP is "right" or not about Switzerland, France, or Germany. His perception is greatly at odds with mine, which is not surprising, we are two different people, at two different stages of our lives, presumably with differing aims and desires.

In a similar matter, it doesn't matter if France, Germany, Iceland, or Canada are "better" - given how readily the OP seems to infer the general from the individual I don't think he is going to be happy anywhere.

What a shame.

Switzerland isn't perfect. Neither am I, nor any human I have ever met.
....and different backgrounds. One thing to be a Canadian lad in CH and totally different to be a Russian(or whatever else less "cool") one. I give the OP the credit for that...and it's hilarious to see that after all that jazz, EFers don't recognise there's a real problem here. Labels and huge misconceptions attached to some nationalities. Ignorance. Aggressive attitudes.
It doesn't happen to everyone, but it does happen. I know that.
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  #265  
Old 30.10.2016, 11:15
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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....and different backgrounds. One thing to be a Canadian lad in CH and totally different to be a Russian(or whatever else less "cool") one. I give the OP the credit for that...and it's hilarious to see that after all that jazz, EFers don't recognise there's a real problem here. Labels and huge misconceptions attached to some nationalities. Ignorance. Aggressive attitudes.
It doesn't happen to everyone, but it does happen. I know that.
So... you think the Swiss can spot my being Canadian when I go to a club and on the basis of that react more positively? I think not. Until I open my mouth and tell them they haven't a clue, and even when I do tell them they often seem to think that this means that I am either American, or a member of a vast Hockey playing Bear Grylls tribe.

Not being Russian I wouldn't know. Not being Canadian, neither would you.

There is indeed both prejudice and zenophobia here in Switzerland, as there is in most places. Although the details are different, the main thing is how one reacts against, or with it, or at all.
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  #266  
Old 30.10.2016, 11:21
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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But people come and people stay. And genuine seekers of help rarely get a rough ride. As far as this thread is concerned, I'm pretty sure the OP can give as good as he gets - and good on him!

But the spark has gone. Posting numbers are falling month on month. Most of the entertaining members have left or rarely post. There have been a couple of attempts to set up colonies to restore the old spirit, but the grinding, corporation-funded behemoth just rolls right over them, even as it disintegrates itself.

Sometimes I wish it was 2008 again, but I had a crap job in those days so seeing my favourite corner of the internet wither away and die maybe isn't so bad after all.

But I'm still sad.
It is very sad, as Swiss people are so miserable that I have not yet been able to find a similar forum to EF in German about Swiss matters. Even Swiss people post here to get info!

If this forum dies, I don't really know where else to look for advice on CH, despite bullies and snarky comments.
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  #267  
Old 30.10.2016, 11:23
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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It is very sad, as Swiss people are so miserable that I have not yet been able to find a similar forum to EF in German about Swiss matters. Even Swiss people post here to get info!

If this forum dies, I don't really know where else to look for advice on CH, despite bullies and snarky comments.
All Swiss people are miserable? Strange, will need to ask my Swiss friends what their real nationality is then......... Or maybe is it me who doesn´t get what misery is?
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Old 30.10.2016, 11:26
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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For me, the problem is not the difficulty of making friends with Swiss people. But just going about your business as a certain type of foreigner can be a challenge. You will be constantly lectured by old ladies, told off by Migros cashiers and stared at by everyone else. It can really get to you at times. Yes, you can leave if you are not happy but if you have to stay for one reason or another, it is not a lot to expect some decency from other people. Having said that, I, personally lost hope. I am following the strategy of avoid or counterattack now: I snap back at the lecturing type, avoid Migros and stare back at the starers. You should see the expression on their faces when an "Ausländer" does that. It is hilarious.
Never experienced this, to tell the truth. But it might be that, as I cannot yet grasp Swiss German, I smile and nod all the time. Perhaps I have just never noticed stares and lectures!
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  #269  
Old 30.10.2016, 11:28
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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....and different backgrounds. One thing to be a Canadian lad in CH and totally different to be a Russian(or whatever else less "cool") one. I give the OP the credit for that...and it's hilarious to see that after all that jazz, EFers don't recognise there's a real problem here. Labels and huge misconceptions attached to some nationalities. Ignorance. Aggressive attitudes.
It doesn't happen to everyone, but it does happen. I know that.
Indeed. I am glad we have threads like these, not really for the comedy central factor as others pointed out, nor because the overwhelming reactions of posters at the end here praise the life here in unisono, and it is a pretty good, fuzzy Tenerife hols feeling. But because it is democratic to provide a place where people can nag. If we were as pedantic as some posters here are - we would have to "send home" all the nags in the Complaint Corner, n'est pas.

I see some of truth in OP's gripe, loads of trolling, sure..but not enough dishonesty to justify some McCarthy-ian flack he got. Where the attitude he described hurts the most isn't dating or daily little jabs, it is in a professional setting. And I experienced it. Loads of different people do.

I say - be proud of your origines. I am just waiting to acumulate enough skirts to go to work like this

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  #270  
Old 30.10.2016, 11:31
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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In my case (the female version of that)
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  #271  
Old 30.10.2016, 11:33
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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Nice boots!

Tom
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  #272  
Old 30.10.2016, 11:47
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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I see some of truth in OP's gripe, loads of trolling, sure..but not enough dishonesty to justify some McCarthy-ian flack he got. Where the attitude he described hurts the most isn't dating or daily little jabs, it is in a professional setting. And I experienced it. Loads of different people do.
Totally agree with that, MC. That's where it hurts the most. And some other posters have also tried to synthesise these points, it was good to see some people chose to take a moment and make their point here, so often it reflects only one set of backgrounds, life experiences.
I don't expect any symphaty nor understanding from certain folks, it can't be, it's the way it is.
But maybe, just maybe, take a moment before snapping at the other, try to at least understand where they come from. It's not that difficult.
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  #273  
Old 30.10.2016, 11:53
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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Where the attitude he described hurts the most isn't dating or daily little jabs, it is in a professional setting. And I experienced it. Loads of different people do.

I say - be proud of your origines. I am just waiting to acumulate enough skirts to go to work like this
This. Initially I was annoyed a lot by people who, in a meeting, would say "Well, that may be how you do it in America", and I'll admit that more than once I responded "Canada asshole, learn some geography, and just what is your objection to getting it done?" With time the Swiss learned to be less racist... they said things like "That may be how you do it in the German part." or "That may be how you do it in the banking sector".

The key is to recognise that these people aren't national cultural icons, just idiots. I may be blindsided... I've sort of reached the status of "Swiss with a funny accent", but since my accent isn't German, or from a specific canton they can't quite figure out how to circle the wagons to protect themselves.

In daily life I don't encounter much rejection, in spite of the fact that I tend to ask odd questions in a way not normally practiced here (or most anywhere). A couple of weeks ago I stopped at a poulet wagon on my way home. I asked the guy if the smell gets to him. He just stared at me a bit then he started to explain that the chicken is all fresh etc. Then I said, No, the question is, after standing all day long in the smell of roasting chicken, do you go home and think "What I'd really like for dinner is some roast chicken!". He thought it was hilarious... in 20 years nobody had ever asked. In fact, he would prefer his wife's risotto, but she really likes his chicken. Two men exchanged knowing glances about the nature of women, and I went on my way.

Up the skirts!

I mean, you'd look good even without the skirts.

I mean... oh, never mind.
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  #274  
Old 30.10.2016, 11:59
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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But maybe, just maybe, take a moment before snapping at the other, try to at least understand where they come from. It's not that difficult.
Nope, not difficult at all to understand that OP is clearly from under a bridge.

Tom
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Old 30.10.2016, 12:03
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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Really? Do you really, really think the French and the Germans are less racist/narrow-minded/judgemental/etc etc on average ?

Moaha hahahaha.
Yes.

Moaha hahahaha.
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Old 30.10.2016, 12:08
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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Yes.

Moaha hahahaha.
Good luck then........
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  #277  
Old 30.10.2016, 13:01
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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Yes.
.
Good for you then. Which languages do you already speak or are inclined to learn? That's very important. Also, have you looked for a job there? Does it look like you'll find something quickly? Start applying, if only for fun. Have some interviews, see how it goes.
Take some steps, slowly and smoothly, it's not worth living here if you can't find any motivation.
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Old 30.10.2016, 13:24
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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OP -

It's confirmed by several researches btw that People born in Switzerland will tend to be amongst the happiest in the World, and have the best quality of life judged in terms of wealth, health and trust in public institutions.

So, that's the foundation - the rest is up to you, and you alone.
Interesting. I have been thinking about this lately. You always read that the Swiss are happy with their jobs and their lives but I really do wonder: Why do people on the bus everyday look so grumpy? Why do they throw a critical glance at anyone who seems to be having fun including the children?
I came to the conclusion that the people who answer these surveys probably think "money is good, we don't have a war going on, so yeah I guess I am happy". Also we should not forget that the Swiss think they do everything well, so surely their country must be the best.
After all, if you asked an average person if they are satisfied with their life, they will think about their job, their possessions, their environment and give an answer based on that. It is only a small percentage that want more from life and therefore are bound to be disappointed.
To further support my theory I would also add that the colder countries with less sunshine and more economic and politic stability tend to come higher in the happiness surveys. They also have higher suicide rates.
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Old 30.10.2016, 13:46
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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Why do people on the bus everyday look so grumpy?
No idea, as we never take the bus!

Tom
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Old 30.10.2016, 14:10
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Re: 9 months in Switzerland - a honest report.

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To further support my theory I would also add that the colder countries with less sunshine and more economic and politic stability tend to come higher in the happiness surveys. They also have higher suicide rates.
Happiness means different things to different people. Maybe some don't even realise there's a difference in meaning between "content" and "happy".

PS- funnily enough my Swiss friend is neither happy nor content with her job. And she hates her boss. :-)
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