Hi all,

I have been to a couple of concerts with the Tonhalle-Orchester
Zürich and would like to try other venues for a change. How do
the other Swiss orchestras compare, e.g. the ones in Bern, Basel
and Geneva?

Next year, the Berner Sinfonieorchester and the Basel Sinfonietta
will perform works by Ravel and Rimsky-Korsakov, respectively;
I would like to attend. And then there’s the quite famous Orchestre
de la Suisse Romande. What do you think about these orchestras?

Is the dress code similar to that in Zürich? I usually wear a suit,
but while that’s fine at the Opernhaus, the Tonhalle does seem to
have a more casual setting.

Best,
davis

Hi Miles, For the 1st time I went to the Zürich Opera, private invitation with dinner, no black tie required. Just suit and tie. I am middle class but the people around me were kind of high society. I was a bit surprised to notice that many gentlemen around me were wearing mass-produced suits. Ladies were not impressive either, except for the stones. I mean, massive stones.

Food was just Ok and service was not up to standard I was expecting. I can't stand female service wearing black bras under white blouses. And I can't stand male service with funky hair and tattoos.

Down in the opera hall, you could find everything, including people with jeans.

The orchestra was superb and elegantly conducted by Gatti, Cura was Otello. Great singer. Hampson was Iago, never heard him before, he made a brilliant role there.

Very satisfied except for the cckscker of Graham Vick that made everything he could to fckup an incredible opera. These "creatives" put themselves above of the opera they are producing. These wnkrs tend to be gay, socialists and wealthy.
Tanks in Otelo? Desert Storm uniforms? SVP posters? in an opera that sings about the Doge of Venice, sails and masts? This opera is not an atemporal Godot or the likes. It is placed in a fairly specific place and time. These artists! And they are paid so much money to mess around like this!

Had to laugh at this...

For a season or two, maybe 5-8 years ago, it seemed that every production staged at the ZH Opernhaus included gratuitous sprinkling of severed (mannequin) body parts, wheelchairs and quasi-military uniforms, regardless of the plot. After a while it got amusing; we'd play the 'first one to spot the extraneous floating limb wins' game.

Call me a bourgeois traditionalist, but not every opera benefits from such 'edginess'. And actually - it's really no longer 'edgy'.

Wow. Just wow. Your own personal dress code for who can attend an opera? Wow. While some people enjoy the tradition of dressing up for the performances, some don't. There is no dress code; an opera is not a gentleman's club.

Wow. Gay, socialist, and wealthy are all adjectives used as an insult? Wow. You sure throw your net wide. If you don't like watching gay people perform, I strongly suggest you stop attending any classical music concerts, art exhibitions, or theater performances.

Ok, you don't like modern staging, obviously. Well, then don't go to operas with modern staging. The staging is not a giant secret. Check the website of the theater in advance and see if it lists "historical staging." If not, assume you're in for some "creative" staging. Some people travel great distances to see a good modern staging. It's a matter of taste.

Why yes, yes they are. It's called the creative process. Would you prefer your art created according to factory norms? (perhaps...)

I can't describe myself as any of those three, and yet I find that statement tremendously offensive.

Poor show, flavio. Very poor show.

What about having just a little respect for the composer's ideas/intentions? At the end of the day, the genius is Verdi not fckn Vickers.

Don't fall 'victim' of the gay comment, just fckn read it as it is. So, if I say, boxers are normally black, does that make me fall into the racist category?

I once had dinner with the great and late Alfredo Kraus, incredibly talented guy. He told me: "I don't sing anymore at the Met, you know why? Because its a mafia, a mafia where gays and jews get all the right posts and performances". He was not anti-gay, he was not anti-semitic. He was stating the fact that those two groups of people, and especially the intersection of both, were behaving as a mafia fraternity.

Let's leave out stereotyping, and focus on the music and artistic merit, 'kay?

I'm not really a hidebound preservationist - I enjoy modern staging, love the challenge of new interpretions, often find updated productions give a whole new, intriguing meaning to a beloved opera . Afterall, the best works are timeless.

However, my beef with some of the productions I've seen is that the staging seemed unconnected with the work, almost as if the director felt that his vision superceded the music. I find that jarring. Staging - modern, traditional, 'edgy' should complement the work, not fight against it.

But - chacun à son goût, as they say...

My groan has nothing to do with your name dropping, and everything to do with your profane homophobic comments. You seem to realize that your comments are offensive, but you are still practicing willful ignorance. There is no sense in debating the dignity of our fellow humans with someone who has already made up their mind. I hope that one day you'll be able to let go of that hate.



To the OP, sorry for the derail. I'm afraid I can't even give you much good advice, as it seems that your area of interest is mainly 19th century music - which I don't have much to do with. I could give you some recommendations about pre-19th century or post WWII music in Switzerland if you are interested.

What an offensive post. It seems you are more concerned to tell us how superior you are: I have rarely met someone who loves opera and hates homosexuals and liberals.

it seems you are more interested in projecting than asking what you claim to ask in the title

Thanks, 10:30. You are right, my favorite classical music
works were composed in the mid-19th century to the early
20th century.

I thought maybe the EFers in Geneva, Basel and Bern would
know something about these orchestras. Guess not.

Not true Davis, there are a few.
I believe the thread just got a little side-tracked by the offensive nature of one of the responses.

Of course it's a very smart dress code, unless you're attending a day performance.

As for information regarding Swiss symphony orchestras, I would suggest you start with the Victoria Hall in Geneva:
http://www.ville-ge.ch/culture/victo.../en/index.html

The Orchestre de la Suisse Romande will be performing parts of Tchaïkovski's NutCracker there on December 13th.

You'll find a local and international mix.

Interesting observation. I notice that the audience tend to dress up when there is a guest performer. Suits and the works...

I tend to think of a great orchestra as either one that has such a distinctive sonic personality that it sets itself apart, or one that is defined as special by the repertoire it plays. All the truly great orchestras boast an individual sound.

If you want to check out other orchestras around Switzerland besides the ZRH Tonhalle, you simply must check out the Orchester Musikkollegium Winterthur:

http://www.musikkollegium.ch/

Another one worth mentioning is the Orchestre de la Suisse Romande based in Geneva. It made a number of memorable recordings of 20th-century repertoire.

All of the above orchestras are technically very sound. Unfortunately, when it comes to musical intelligence and an orchestra's personal sound, I dont rate them as highly as I do with some other orchestras around Europe. *ducks*

If you are still keen after hearing my rather harsh critique, am always looking for concert partners. Will be refreshing to attend with people who are passionate about classical music rather than my OH who simply comments "nice" after each concert.

That’s today! Anyway, thanks a lot for the link;
there are a bunch of interesting concerts on the
list for next year.

Have you considered going alone? I do it all the time,
and actually prefer being by myself than with people
I know. Not only does it allow me to simply enjoy the
music—in a seat of my own choice—but I am also free
to practice my German during the shorter breaks by
talking to the strangers sitting next to me.

But then, I’ve never gone with someone who is just a
“concert partner”. And thanks for the link; Liszt piano
concerto and other stuff, which I might check out.

I go alone quite a bit - its hard to find concert partners and some performances cost quite a bit which my OH find it hard to stomach paying for something he doesnt quite appreciate.

Enjoy the concerts!

Switzerland's orchestras are in the top league. For example, Ernest Ansermet took the OSR there and it has maintained a reputation for excellence. Maybe not so showy as the Berlin Phil, but regularly puts on top quality performances.
Same with the Swiss Opera houses. Sure, you'll occasionally get disappointing productions, but generally you'll have top quality artists performing.
As far as dress code is concerned, frankly I don't see much difference between London and Geneva. You have people wearing dinner suits and gowns, but you also have people not wearing ties, though I probably wouldn't dress down too much, at least at the opera. If I'm going to a 4 hour opera, my primary concern is to be comfortable!

Merci vielmal. And if you need a concert partner
from March onward, feel free to PM me.

Thanks for that. The Tonhalle-Orchester performances have been
very good. And even though I’m not a big fan of the opera, I’ve liked
it so far (except the modern take on Carmen a while back). I will go
see the Berner Symphonieorchester in January; I sure hope they get
La Valse right...

Interesting comment. This is the first time I've ever heard of them being described that way.

Care to expound as to why you think the Berlin Philharmonic is showy??

How about this http://www.ogb-sob.ch/de/agenda/2011/12/21/

A bit short notice, but here is a run down.

Fêtes anglaises
4. Sinfoniekonzert

Mi, 21. Dezember 2011, 20:00
Kongresshaus Biel

Georg Friedrich Händel (1685 – 1759)
«Zadok the Priest» HWV 258

Marin Marais (1656-1728)
Suite aus «Alcyone»

Georg Friedrich Händel (1685 – 1759)
Chöre aus «Messiah»

Piotr Ilitch Tchaïkovski (1840 – 1893)
Auswahl aus «Der Nussknacker»

Howard Blake (*1938)
«The Snowman»

Leroy Anderson (1908 – 1975)
«Sleigh Ride»

Jonathan Seers (*1954)
Christmas-Medley

Sinfonie Orchester Biel

Howard Griffiths Leitung
Choir of Gonville an Caius College, Cambridge
Geoffrey Webber Leitung Chor & Cembalo

Weihnachten mit Chormusik: Ein englischer Spitzenchor interpretiert zusammen mit dem SOB ein weihnächtliches Programm, unter anderem mit Teilen aus Händels «Messias».

Der Choir of Gonville and Caius College in Cambridge gilt als einer besten Chöre Englands und geniesst auch international einen hervorragenden Ruf. Neben seiner intensiven Konzerttätigkeit in England absolvierte er unter anderem bereits Tourneen in Frankreich, Deutschland, China und Südafrika. Nun treten die rund dreissig Sängerinnen und Sänger in Biel erstmals mit einem Schweizer Berufsorchester auf.

Hope it helps.
Salut Zämma