Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Living in Switzerland > Daily life
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old 10.02.2011, 21:36
Bobster's Avatar
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: London, UK
Posts: 48
Groaned at 5 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 24 Times in 18 Posts
Bobster has become a little unpopular
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

I'm following this thread with great interest as I may be moving to Basel shortly.

For CH rentals, there's home.ch and homegate.ch, but they really don't have many FR listings. Can anyone recommend a decent site for FR that is EN friendly? I'm mostly coming across sites aimed at holiday rentals...

Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 10.02.2011, 22:04
Treverus's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: SZ
Posts: 9,274
Groaned at 215 Times in 178 Posts
Thanked 16,487 Times in 6,020 Posts
Treverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
Can anyone recommend a decent site for FR that is EN friendly?
I must say that I am still not quite used to it, but I love the dry UK humour...
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Treverus for this useful post:
  #23  
Old 10.02.2011, 22:06
Nil's Avatar
Nil Nil is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Basel
Posts: 10,381
Groaned at 442 Times in 346 Posts
Thanked 15,954 Times in 6,287 Posts
Nil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
I continuously hear "the school system". Could anybody tell me why you think the Swiss one is superior? German public schools are not that bad and Baden Würtemberg - the state next to Switzerland - is besides Bavaria on top of the list in Germany...

Kitchen Appliances - seriously WTF? You do not decide what country to move to based on weather or not you have to buy a fridge...

Finances
Sorry, it is not so easy to make the full bill guys.

1. Taxes - Yes, lower in Switzerland. But if you have two kids as the OP, there are countless of tax deductions in Germany. Much more than in most other countries, so consulting a specialist pays off.

2. Housing - My main cost driver by far is housing. In Germany I would pay half or less of what I am paying in Zurich.

3. Child care - the OP did not say how old the kids are. If they are young and you want to pay for day care for two children the bill suddenly turns over to the German side - unless you are considerably over say 200k CHF a year, the cost difference for childcare is higher than the tax savings.

I like Switzerland and for us, DINKs, it is absolutely worth it. If we had two children, I guess I would - especially at the same income as the OP said - probably chose Germany. Will over all be cheaper and if somebody comes with some vague "quality of life" stuff again - what exactly is better in Basel?
Good Input Treverus! I was going to bring those points too. The main big thing for me was about childcare. Is cost hell lots of money in CH while it is very affordable in France and Germany. And when the difference of price is in the 4 digits per months!! (approx. 2500 chf in ch and 400 euro in germany)



Quote:
View Post
There is a higher proportion of skilled workers in Basel than in Lörrach or Weil Am Rhein's populations, so the chances of fitting in with the worldview of your neighbours is somewhat increased on the CH side.
Honestly does it really matter? Your neighbours job doesn't make them nicer or more interresting to get in contact with...
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Nil for this useful post:
  #24  
Old 10.02.2011, 22:45
adrianlondon's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 8,812
Groaned at 189 Times in 172 Posts
Thanked 24,301 Times in 6,537 Posts
adrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond reputeadrianlondon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
If I'd work in Basel, I would move to Germany and just commute to Switzerland for work. (better, cheaper food, more variety, cheaper housing, lesser village mentality of people)
How about living in Basel for the cheaper taxes, being close to work, and also being in a city that's bigger/better than St Louis (France) or Weil an Rhein (Germany) and instead go to those places for ... eating out, drinking, shopping etc.

Village mentality? Go and spend a week in Weil am Rhein or even Lorrach and then see what Basel's like. We're not talking Stuttgart or Munich here, but little live-off-the-cross-border-shopping-Swissies towns.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 11.02.2011, 05:12
Joy2's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Nebenan, CH
Posts: 121
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 214 Times in 62 Posts
Joy2 has an excellent reputationJoy2 has an excellent reputationJoy2 has an excellent reputationJoy2 has an excellent reputation
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

We had the same discussion, but between somewhere north of Zurich and Germany. My husband is German (directly from the Swiss border, actually) and his opinion was -- absolutely CH. Look closely at taxes. We actually asked a German tax advisor and he said forget it -- go to Switzerland. And seriously, Weil? I don't want to offend anyone, but it's not the nicest city.

I do have trouble believing that the southern German schools are worse than the Swiss. Is this based on PISA?
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 11.02.2011, 06:41
NotAllThere's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Baselland
Posts: 8,984
Groaned at 140 Times in 122 Posts
Thanked 12,270 Times in 5,015 Posts
NotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
...

Honestly does it really matter? Your neighbours job doesn't make them nicer or more interresting to get in contact with...
It does matter when you're considering how well you're likely to fit in, and it does when it comes to putting your children into schools, unfortunately. Generally, the offspring of blue collar workers have lower expectations, and that will (and does) affect the behaviour.I'm sure the German school system is as good as the Swiss. But you have to take into account who's going to the schools. Our first five years in CH were spent in Pratteln. The school experience was tough for my kids. Now we've moved out of a manual/factory worker town to a "white collar" area; there's a world of difference. Higher earners are resented by some people on lower incomes. It may not be what you want to hear as an egalitarian, but it's the way things are.

If you want to increase your chances of having a good experience, then CH. That doesn't mean if you choose DE or FR (or Pratteln) it's going to be hell.
__________________
In accordance with Political Correctness guidelines, I've checked my privileges and come to the conclusion that I'm awesome.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank NotAllThere for this useful post:
  #27  
Old 11.02.2011, 10:58
ullainga's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: around Basel
Posts: 1,583
Groaned at 12 Times in 11 Posts
Thanked 2,189 Times in 911 Posts
ullainga has a reputation beyond reputeullainga has a reputation beyond reputeullainga has a reputation beyond reputeullainga has a reputation beyond reputeullainga has a reputation beyond reputeullainga has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
Look closely at taxes. We actually asked a German tax advisor and he said forget it -- go to Switzerland
again, he said his net pay (pay after taxes) would be the same in both cases. so it is not a deciding factor.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 11.02.2011, 13:04
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: SO
Posts: 159
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 198 Times in 83 Posts
hjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputation
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Hi J,

Your question as to where you should be living is actually comprising many fundamental questions. I.e., for how long are you planning to stay around Basel? Is it for 3 years only, or are you planning for a long term stay and willing to invest in speaking German as well? The answer may have a big impact on where you want to live. Also, what are your expectations on housing or living area? Are you looking for a free standing villa in a green village, or are you looking for a 200 square meter appartment uptown? Do you find it important that your kids may be able to play with kids from the English-speaking international community (and have to say goodbye every 3 months to one or two kids whose parents move on to Dubai or Shanghai), or do you want them to play with the local kids in Swiss german (and you will never be able to really understand them once they mastered the Schwytzertuuts)?

Our kids do very well in the Swiss school system. Being foreigners with no German skills at all when we arrived, they received 2-4hours/wk German lessons in kindergarten and even in primary school that is a possibility that is integrated in the school system. However, my kids do not need that anymore and their mastering of the language is equalt to that of their "native" Swiss freinds. I do not know how this is in DE.

Secondly, but equally important, is your salary really going to be matched on netto base, and is the difference in cost of living accounted for? In my view, you need much higher netto salaries here in CH in order to keep the same standard of living. After taxes, the biggest impact on your salary are Health Insurance (semi-private insurance for us 6 it is CHF1300/month), and rent (CHF2500/month). In DE this is really much lower, and therefore with the same "netto" salary you may even have much more to spend when going to DE. However, with the same bruto salary, you may end up moving to CH, indeed because of the lower taxes. In DE, you will get lower taxed depending on the number of kids (I do not know the actual impact on your income), and in CH you will get "Childmoney" which is approximately CHF 220/child/month (quite substantial when you have 4 kids like me).

My wife and I, and our 3 (now 4) kids moved from the EU into the Basel area 3 years ago. We intend to stay here for at least another 5 years, meaning that we wanted to raise our kids here in the local surroundings, speaking Swissgerman with their friends who live just around the corner, and going to the local Swiss school with the same friends. Therefore we moved to Baselland, which has much lower taxes than the city of Basel (Baselstadt), which saves us approximately CHF10'000/year. Most villages surrounding Baselstadt are actually in Baselland, but still within 20 minutes commuting (by car) from Weil am Rhein. We actually do a lot of our grocery in Weil am Rhein. In Baselland, almost 40% of the inhabitants is non-Swiss. Maybe that explains why we find most people in Baselland (we live very near to Baselstadt) very open to us.

From quality of life point of view, the differences between CH and DE are really focussing on people (German small village people versus Basel Swiss city people versus Baselland Swiss village people), because hiking, sports, theatre, etc is all very accessible from either Weil am Rhein or Baselstadt/Baselland. We find the German people around Weil am rhein difficult to access. All our Swiss friends live in Baselstadt/Baselland and are quite open to us. Of course it helps a lot that we speak German. We buy the large quantities (milk, bread) in Germany, the quality food stuff in France, and the rest in the local Migros in CH. This is how we can get the best of the 3 countries. We ski in the Black Forest (DE) with the occasional trip to the Swiss alps (Soerenberg, Davos), after dismissing the Vosges (French mountains) because I don't want my kids to have to learn yet another language (our own, high German, swiss German). They will be taught French in the 5th grade anyway (Swiss school system here).

To be very clear, for a family of 2 adults and 2 kids, my estimates would be that you could live relatively comfortably in Baselland for a total of CHF120'000/year (CHF10'000/month). After taxes and with childmoney this still leaves you with CHF7500/month. A nice 3-bedroom appartment in Baselland will set you back another CHF2500/month, and health insurance also CHF1000/month. Than remain CHF4000/month to do your shopping (for us approximately CHF1000/month), insure and maintain your car and buy benzine, pay for an internet connection and phones, pay for skirent and lift cards, and save a bit. As mentioned, living in DE will have the biggest impact on taxes, health insurance and rent. The other costs are almost the same.

KR,
Henk
Reply With Quote
The following 7 users would like to thank hjj_74 for this useful post:
  #29  
Old 11.02.2011, 17:13
quark's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Aargh-Ow!
Posts: 1,328
Groaned at 13 Times in 12 Posts
Thanked 1,838 Times in 756 Posts
quark has a reputation beyond reputequark has a reputation beyond reputequark has a reputation beyond reputequark has a reputation beyond reputequark has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
I would definitely live in Basel. The quality of life is much better in Switzerland.
Quote:
View Post
Although rent is higher in Basel, there are much nicer places available and in D you generally have to install your own kitchen appliances.
Quote:
View Post
I'm quite sure you will also find Basel much more international and English much more useful here. German would be a must if going for the "German side" - I would say!
Quote:
View Post
lesser village mentality of people
Quote:
View Post
Non-german speakers will find it easier to get along in Basel than in Germany.
I think some of the differences between the two options are being slightly exaggerated here.

Walking over the border, I really don't see this massive gulf in housing, quality of life, English-language ability, friendliness, mentality, etc which allegedly suddenly appears as you go through the customs post at Weil-Friedlingen. Most of these arguments are based on the Swiss "average" versus the German "average", or comparing Basel to "Germany" as a whole - but nice areas of Weil am Rhein and nice areas of Basel have more in common with each other than either have with Geneva or Frankfurt.

The factors which do change really significantly at the border are childcare, schooling, rent and taxes, so I'd base your decision around those - the other differences are minor in comparison, if they exist at all. Whichever you pick, the benefits of the other are on your doorstep.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank quark for this useful post:
  #30  
Old 11.02.2011, 17:26
dawiz's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ostschweiz
Posts: 4,015
Groaned at 96 Times in 46 Posts
Thanked 2,005 Times in 1,156 Posts
dawiz has a reputation beyond reputedawiz has a reputation beyond reputedawiz has a reputation beyond reputedawiz has a reputation beyond reputedawiz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
Walking over the border, I really don't see this massive gulf in housing, quality of life
strangely, I always do - as soon as you get into Germany, it hits you in the face - and Weil is no exception there: the roads aren't as well maintained, there are more poor people in the streets, everything's a tad dirtier, the buildings are falling apart, lots of SAT-dishes (because there's no cable infrastructure and because SAT is free) on the roofs, lots of cheap (as in dingy) food places. Considering the fact that the South of Germany is actually the richest part of it, I don't know what that says about the country as a whole.
Just compare the people shopping in Aldi and Lidl in Germany to those shopping in Aldi and Lidl in Switzerland - Germany has a massively higher number of social cases and working poor than Switzerland. That fact alone already tells you that the standard of living there is significantly lower than here. I mean, it still might be higher than in most other places on the planet, but the OP was given a choice - and as such, I really wouldn't know why you'd live in Germany, rather than in Switzerland.

Peter
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 11.02.2011, 17:46
Treverus's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: SZ
Posts: 9,274
Groaned at 215 Times in 178 Posts
Thanked 16,487 Times in 6,020 Posts
Treverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
That fact alone already tells you that the standard of living there is significantly lower than here. I mean, it still might be higher than in most other places on the planet, but the OP was given a choice - and as such, I really wouldn't know why you'd live in Germany, rather than in Switzerland.

Peter
I can only disagree again. The OP said he gets the same money. We all know that salaries in CH are higher than in Germany... so you could have a great life there.

I'll give you one simple example: My parents have a lovely, very well maintained single standing one family house. Don't know exactly, but definitely 2-300 sqm living space, a massive garden around it... As you can reach Luxembourg city within half an hour, it is in a very preferred location. The house is worth about 300k EUR.

I rent a nice 3.5 room apartment which is in a preferred location within half an hour from the center of Zurich. I rent it because I could not possibly buy it at easily 1.2 - 1.5 Mil CHF. And I do not even dream of the houses here.

In short: With a decent salary, you can relatively easily afford a nice house in Germany. There is no way I will do that in Switzerland. For me it does not matter, but if I had a family of four, I would consider that a very large part of the living standard. People continuously discuss taxes here - taxes do not matter as much as affordability unless you earn Millions a year.

P.S: Not sure what you see at your Swiss Aldi, but here in Zurich it has the exact same clientele as in Germany. Langstrasse does not have nicer junkies than Frankfurt either.
__________________
There is a special place in Hull reserved for the guy who invented autocorrect.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Treverus for this useful post:
  #32  
Old 11.02.2011, 18:00
dawiz's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ostschweiz
Posts: 4,015
Groaned at 96 Times in 46 Posts
Thanked 2,005 Times in 1,156 Posts
dawiz has a reputation beyond reputedawiz has a reputation beyond reputedawiz has a reputation beyond reputedawiz has a reputation beyond reputedawiz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
I can only disagree again. The OP said he gets the same money. We all know that salaries in CH are higher than in Germany... so you could have a great life there.
sure, if you ignore the people around you.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 12.02.2011, 07:55
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: SO
Posts: 159
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 198 Times in 83 Posts
hjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputation
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Hi there,

I am afraid you have not thought this through:

Yes, one can buy a beautiful single standing house near Luxembourg city for Eur300k(CHF450k). A similar house in Weil am Rhein is starting from the same price up.

However, a similar house in Baselstadt does not exist, as a single standing house in a city is really not to be expected. Therefore, one cannot compare it. If you want to buy a house in Baselstadt, the criteria change from single standing house to "Einfamilienhaus" which in every city usually means a "Reiheneinfamilienhaus", i.o.w., the middle of a row. Then the first house is something like this; which is not too bad for the price of CHF 670k, but I would never want my kids to grow up in this neighbourhood.

If one goes to Baselland, the first villages to look for are Oberwil, Allschwil, Binningen, Botmingen, etc. Go to Comparis.ch and do the comparison, and you will see that there actually are single standing houses available, much nicer than the cheap houses in Weil am Rhein, but at a cost: CHF 750k.

The price difference with Weil am Rhein reflect the much lower taxes in CH versus DE, the much better construction of the houses in general in CH vs DE, the much much nicer surroundings in CH vs DE (of course this is just my opinion....), and the fact that in DE there is just a larger variability of the houses available. However, really comparable houses in Weil am Rhein are also starting at prices of EUR 495k (CHF750k).

The latter reflects that house owners in Weil am Rhein and in the Basel area (Baselbiet) are of course aware that most people who can buy a house here, are looking across borders and need to make the same decisions as the OP...

Of course, when you go 30-40 minutes outside Basel, prices are a little better for a single standing house: CHF 600k (EUR 400k), which is quite close to your estimates of your parents' house. I assume you were just not aware that it is really possible to buy a house in Switzerland....
So, it all depends on what one really wants.

In the "renting arena" things are similar, and with the above mentioned links one can search for him/herself



Quote:
View Post
I can only disagree again. The OP said he gets the same money. We all know that salaries in CH are higher than in Germany... so you could have a great life there.

I'll give you one simple example: My parents have a lovely, very well maintained single standing one family house. Don't know exactly, but definitely 2-300 sqm living space, a massive garden around it... As you can reach Luxembourg city within half an hour, it is in a very preferred location. The house is worth about 300k EUR.

I rent a nice 3.5 room apartment which is in a preferred location within half an hour from the center of Zurich. I rent it because I could not possibly buy it at easily 1.2 - 1.5 Mil CHF. And I do not even dream of the houses here.

In short: With a decent salary, you can relatively easily afford a nice house in Germany. There is no way I will do that in Switzerland. For me it does not matter, but if I had a family of four, I would consider that a very large part of the living standard. People continuously discuss taxes here - taxes do not matter as much as affordability unless you earn Millions a year.

P.S: Not sure what you see at your Swiss Aldi, but here in Zurich it has the exact same clientele as in Germany. Langstrasse does not have nicer junkies than Frankfurt either.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank hjj_74 for this useful post:
  #34  
Old 13.02.2011, 02:49
Treverus's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: SZ
Posts: 9,274
Groaned at 215 Times in 178 Posts
Thanked 16,487 Times in 6,020 Posts
Treverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
However, I assume you were just not aware that it is really possible to buy a house in Switzerland....
First of all: Great post.

Second: I do not live in Basel, I live in the Höfe district of Schwyz. Go and find me a nice house for 600k CHF here please
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 13.02.2011, 13:45
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: At home
Posts: 4,167
Groaned at 210 Times in 135 Posts
Thanked 6,404 Times in 2,719 Posts
Faltrad has a reputation beyond reputeFaltrad has a reputation beyond reputeFaltrad has a reputation beyond reputeFaltrad has a reputation beyond reputeFaltrad has a reputation beyond reputeFaltrad has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
I do have trouble believing that the southern German schools are worse than the Swiss. Is this based on PISA?
The school systems are not that different. Matura and Abitur are quite the same level (at least the ones I know: German, and even the French Leistungskurs in Germany is not that easy). And don't base any special case on PISA, as a general trend by countries never ever matches a particular experience, that is the nature of statistics.

I shouldn't say that but I would choose German Gymnasium. For academicly interested students, French school is the thing if you choose it carefully. Or you can come to my classes, I do a pretty decent job
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 14.02.2011, 13:33
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: SO
Posts: 159
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 198 Times in 83 Posts
hjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputation
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
First of all: Great post.

Second: I do not live in Basel, I live in the Höfe district of Schwyz. Go and find me a nice house for 600k CHF here please
Thanks!

This looks nice..... CHF 620k.

Note that brokers get 5% of the price. So, let me know if you decide to move, right
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 14.02.2011, 13:57
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: SO
Posts: 159
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 198 Times in 83 Posts
hjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputation
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

I do not know anything about the German system, because I never looked into it. We do have experience with the Baselland school system.

In my opinion, in the Basel region, the Swiss schools are relatively good. One of the issues here is that primary and secondary schools do not educate all kids to the level where they can attend the Swiss Gymnasium. And the Gymnasium is the only realistic education for a University study.

This is why a lot of Swiss kids actually go to school on Saturday mornings in order to get educated up to the Gymnasium level. This education is either being payed by their parents, or in some Kantons by the Kanton (i.e., offered for free). It is an issue of high debate, because the system does not give every kid a fair chance to higher education.

Now follows some theoretical philosophical reflection of mine: of course, with the Swiss so terribly democratic, the majority of Swiss people does not understand why anybody should attend university, and therefore it is very unlikely that things will change, because the majority of Swiss will not want to spend money to a little bit of extra education.

In other words, my wife and I are prepared to help our kids through school, and make sure that - if our kids have the capacity - they will actually get the additional education to get to the Gymnasium. As mentioned, only if our kids have the capacity to do so.

In our region, it is common for most kids to be "screened" by the school psychologists (SPD). Usually, they will then be "cleared" (aka they are "normal"), which means that there are no excuses for bad performance.... . In my view, once kids are cleared by the SPD, they should actually be offered the education to achieve Gymnasium entrance level. Obviously, our region is not there yet.....

Regarding PISA results, I do think that it gives one a general idea of the situation, which indeed needs to be adjusted for invidual school achievements. However, the general idea should not be disregarded, as a lot of effort went into a good intercountry comparison. Note that 15y/o in Switzerland are doing generally better than their colleagues in the US, which are in turn better than in Germany and France. And all of these countries do worse than where I come from (NL). Whether one is satisfied with these "performances", indeed asks for an individual assessment regarding the child's capacities, wishes, the parents' pushing, and so forth. In the end, a lot of University studies have been harmonized between countries, limiting the discussion to "how to get to University" in DE, FR, and CH alike.


Quote:
View Post
The school systems are not that different. Matura and Abitur are quite the same level (at least the ones I know: German, and even the French Leistungskurs in Germany is not that easy). And don't base any special case on PISA, as a general trend by countries never ever matches a particular experience, that is the nature of statistics.

I shouldn't say that but I would choose German Gymnasium. For academicly interested students, French school is the thing if you choose it carefully. Or you can come to my classes, I do a pretty decent job
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 14.02.2011, 14:02
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 8,411
Groaned at 141 Times in 122 Posts
Thanked 14,609 Times in 6,216 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
strangely, I always do - as soon as you get into Germany, it hits you in the face - and Weil is no exception there: the roads aren't as well maintained, there are more poor people in the streets, everything's a tad dirtier, the buildings are falling apart, lots of SAT-dishes (because there's no cable infrastructure and because SAT is free) on the roofs, lots of cheap (as in dingy) food places. Considering the fact that the South of Germany is actually the richest part of it, I don't know what that says about the country as a whole.
Just compare the people shopping in Aldi and Lidl in Germany to those shopping in Aldi and Lidl in Switzerland - Germany has a massively higher number of social cases and working poor than Switzerland. That fact alone already tells you that the standard of living there is significantly lower than here. I mean, it still might be higher than in most other places on the planet, but the OP was given a choice - and as such, I really wouldn't know why you'd live in Germany, rather than in Switzerland.

Peter
Weil is a bit vile (sorry for the pun), or at least parts of it are. There are far nicer places in the South of Germany, many of them within easy travelling distance of the Swiss border. But just as everywhere else, the nicer the place, the more it's going to cost to buy any real estate there. And also remember that the places that look smartest aren't always the best places to live. Germany as a whole may create the impression of being more liberal than Switzerland, but Conservative people with conservative attitudes in the squeaky clean villas of rich German villages aren't any more liberal or open than their equivalents in Switzerland. I've lived there and seen it.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 14.02.2011, 14:05
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: SO
Posts: 159
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 198 Times in 83 Posts
hjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputationhjj_74 has an excellent reputation
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
Weil is a bit vile (sorry for the pun), or at least parts of it are. There are far nicer places in Germany.
Maybe for the OP's sake you can provide some examples? I think that is more helpful than just the statement alone.
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 14.02.2011, 14:17
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 8,411
Groaned at 141 Times in 122 Posts
Thanked 14,609 Times in 6,216 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Basel vs. Weil Am Rhein

Quote:
View Post
Maybe for the OP's sake you can provide some examples? I think that is more helpful than just the statement alone.
Do you mean you are looking for an example of a place in Germany that is nicer than Weil? May I suggest using a map and a pin? If you hit Hoyerswerda then forget that and try again.

Or what do you mean by nice? If you're looking for a squeaky villa in a conservative neighbourhood with gnomes in the garden then any of the villages along the foot of the Black Forest will do. Try Badenweiler for example. If you're looking for a place that knows about the good life and has a laid back atmosphere then try Freiburg.
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cheap/FREE parking in Basel/Lörrach/Riehen/Weil am Rhein? danm3 Transportation/driving 11 17.08.2012 10:50
Basel SBB to Weil am Rhein by taxi? edgrover Transportation/driving 8 31.08.2010 01:52
hello from Weil am Rhein AndrzejM Introductions 1 01.07.2009 18:32
Living in Weil am Rhein/working in basel NWCLass Transportation/driving 1 13.04.2009 15:21
Moving sale [Basel/Weil am Rhein Germany] carneyamen Housing in general 0 25.05.2007 22:31


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 18:12.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0