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Old 06.05.2012, 12:45
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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Yes....you hit it on the head.....finally. That WOULD be a great idea but the Swiss have a LAW against that. My point proven. I always remember as a little kid, my grandma would always forget something for the Christmas Dinner and we would go to the little Chinese market and they would be open because SURPRISE.....they don't celebrate Xmas. Here that would be AGAINST THE LAW. My point proven about religion being FORCED on people who do not believe.
No one is forcing religion on you. Unless you are tied up with rosary beads in your neighborhood cathedral. (you wouldn't be posting here though)

FYI...you can get something on Sunday here...even from a coop or migros if you shop at the train station. I agree with one of the posters who mentioned the blue laws in CT. A complete joke....that only exists because of tradition. Just like the people in that town. They are holding on to a way of life that they have had for a long time. Not every place in Ch is similar. Just move if it makes you feel uncomfortable
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Old 06.05.2012, 12:47
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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Separation of Church and state was what so many people fought for years ago.
I'm not sure who you are talking about ? Russia ? Fascist Italy ?
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Old 06.05.2012, 12:54
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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No one is forcing religion on you. Unless you are tied up with rosary beads in your neighborhood cathedral. (you wouldn't be posting here though)
I would rather work on Ascension and goog Friday and Easter Monday and whatever other damn catholic holiday is coming at the end of may and use those days elsewhere. So while religion is not being directly forced on me, I am being forced to take a day when I do not want to.
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  #44  
Old 06.05.2012, 12:55
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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Again I will state that many countries now do not have laws telling people what they can and can't do on religious holidays. If you want to observe the Sabbath, fine....but don't force me too.
There is no law that dictates what you can do on a Sunday as a private person
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Old 06.05.2012, 12:57
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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I would rather work on Ascension and goog Friday and Easter Monday and whatever other damn catholic holiday is coming at the end of may and use those days elsewhere. So while religion is not being directly forced on me, I am being forced to take a day when I do not want to.

Are you not being paid for those days? How is that different that Christmas?
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  #46  
Old 06.05.2012, 12:58
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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I would rather work on Ascension and goog Friday and Easter Monday and whatever other damn catholic holiday is coming at the end of may and use those days elsewhere. So while religion is not being directly forced on me, I am being forced to take a day when I do not want to.
It's a tough life.
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  #47  
Old 06.05.2012, 13:02
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

Do you consider going to work on the 1st of August? After all you're not Swiss - it'd be terrible to have holidays imposed on you to celebrate the birth of a random country.
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Old 06.05.2012, 13:14
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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... Ascension is a holiday that celebrates Jesus rising from the grave and is completely BS to anyone who is not Christian.....
I don't think such comments will endear you to many, secular or religious. I am definitely not "Christian" (especially by Bible Belt standards) being more of an Agnostic, secular humanist and I believe that much which is taken as being "true events" in religious texts, is at best a metaphor and I find little or no historical or scientific fact to support such "true events" But to dismiss beliefs that have driven Western Society for many centuries as "BS", does no one any credit.

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?...Separation of Church and state was what so many people fought for years ago....
Ironic then, isn't it, that in the US (especially), anyone contemplating running for public office must be seen to be "God Fearing" and attend church, even sporadically (and it has to be the "right" type of God Fearing as well....)

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?...Religion may shape culture, but they can also be totally separate.
Apart from creating a new culture from scratch, I fail to see how you can eliminate thousands of years of influence of religious belief from any culture. Take Christmas, strip away the Christian associations and you are left with the Roman Saturnalia, remove Saturnalia and you are left with rituals aimed at ensuring that the gods banish winter and bring back spring and summer, strip away that and still you have a religious underpinning...
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  #49  
Old 06.05.2012, 13:20
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The thing about Sunday being the resting day is not religion, it's cultural. I'm from Ticino and I've never hear of such thing till I moved to Zurich. I will always remember my neighbour freaking out when I vacumed on a Sunday.

Swiss Germans stick to the rules and the rule is no work or noise on a sunday. Nothing to do with religion - just with narrowed-minded people...
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  #50  
Old 06.05.2012, 13:32
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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I would rather work on Ascension and goog Friday and Easter Monday and whatever other damn catholic holiday is coming at the end of may and use those days elsewhere. So while religion is not being directly forced on me, I am being forced to take a day when I do not want to.
Now you're just coming off as childish and petulant. Like I said before, I'm not even the slightest bit Christian, but these "damn catholic holidays" you're referring to are awfully important to a huge amount of the population, Swiss and expat alike, and there's no reason to be so disrespectful. And you're a teacher? How many of your students' families celebrate these "damn catholic holidays"?
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  #51  
Old 06.05.2012, 13:32
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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This is not supposed to have become an assault on Sunday or on Switzerland, it was supposed to simply be a question about holidays and days off that affect your life and are religious based. National holidays like Swiss National day, Bastille Day, July 4th and so on are holidays celebrating a country or a specifi event in a country's history, not a religion or made up event. If you are French, Bastille day celebrates independence for the country no matter what your religious beliefs. Ascension is a holiday that celebrates Jesus rising from the grave and is completely BS to anyone who is not Christian. I would rather have that day off somewhere else or for other reasons. That is not part of culture but religion. Separation of Church and state was what so many people fought for years ago. Religion may shape culture, but they can also be totally separate.
This is the cultural basis of the country. As others have said it is now mostly tradition. This is the same in countries of other religions. I think you are bit too hung up on it really. No one I know does anything remotely religious on those public holidays.

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I would rather work on Ascension and goog Friday and Easter Monday and whatever other damn catholic holiday is coming at the end of may and use those days elsewhere. So while religion is not being directly forced on me, I am being forced to take a day when I do not want to.
I'd no work on those days but it's no different than Flag day, or President's day. I don't go around venerating and god or religion or a flag or the long dead presidents. I see no difference really. It's a day off based on the traditions of a country.

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Ironic then, isn't it, that in the US (especially), anyone contemplating running for public office must be seen to be "God Fearing" and attend church, even sporadically (and it has to be the "right" type of God Fearing as well....)
This is why I find the OPs complaint so strange. There is more religion shoved down on people in the US than in Switzerland. The religious (nut cases) in the US are having huge effect on politics, women's rights, etc, etc, etc in the US than anywhere in Europe that I've ever been too.

Frankly I'd rather a religious reason to be forced to take a day off than have my reproductive rights infringed upon based on other people's religious beliefs.

But OK. This is not about US politics.
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  #52  
Old 06.05.2012, 13:34
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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I would rather work on Ascension and goog Friday and Easter Monday and whatever other damn catholic holiday is coming at the end of may and use those days elsewhere.
Look at it this way: You get paid and these days do not count as days off. Nobody expects you to go to church or sth.

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So while religion is not being directly forced on me, I am being forced to take a day when I do not want to.
It is a good thing then that you live in one of the most protestant regions of the most protestant canton so you a) don't get that many religious holidays b) get only the ones that are either national or of special importance to protestants.
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Old 06.05.2012, 13:43
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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But OK. This is not about US politics.
No, it isn't, but the fact that someone from the US complains about excessive christian influence in Western Europe of all places is so absurd that it requires mention.
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  #54  
Old 06.05.2012, 13:46
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

Work on Good Friday and Easter monday and get the days at a time when you please is a great idea - except that if Good Friday and Easter monday weren't celebrated you wouldn't get them "at another time". It's not like there's'a fixed allowance of days off per year and you get to pick and choose...

Seriously you're the first person I heard to complain about holidays. Who cares why you get four days? The important part is that you get them. If you were forced to spend the whole four days in church in penitence, you'd have a point. But you're not. So what's the problem?!

Now if you're going to plead this is an "attack on your personal freedom of belief" there are plenty jobs where you're not forced to take Easter, Christmas or whichever holidays...
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Old 06.05.2012, 13:54
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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No, it isn't, but the fact that someone from the US complains about excessive christian influence in Western Europe of all places is so absurd that it requires mention.
I know. That's why I wrote what I did. But I also know what happens next....
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Old 06.05.2012, 13:58
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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I would rather work on Ascension and goog Friday and Easter Monday and whatever other damn catholic holiday is coming at the end of may and use those days elsewhere. So while religion is not being directly forced on me, I am being forced to take a day when I do not want to.
You have chosen to live in a predominantly Christian part of the world, you should not therefore be particularly surprised that Christian traditions run through most of the things we do, even if most of us are not practicing Christians.

Furthermore you have chosen to live in a part of the world where the rights of the individual are subordinated to those of the community at large.

So having done all of this of your own free will, I would suggest you either learn to live with it or move to somewhere that suits you better. But either way please stop whining about decisions you made!
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Old 06.05.2012, 15:34
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

You dd say that you always chose to avoid places in the US which still are very much dominated by religion and conservative traditions, like Alabama. Would you have taken a job in Alabama if it had been offered to you? So why take a job on the other side of the world where those Christian and conservative views are predominant? Did you do your homework first? There are plenty of areas in Switzerland which are much more liberal and easy-going- and you could have found that out with a bit of research. It was indeed YOUR choice - and I am so sorry if you find it difficult to adapt.
I'd never ever say the awful 'if you don't like it go home' - really NOT acceptable in my view. But at the end of the day - if you cannot adjust and be happy here, for your sake, maybe the question does arise- can you relax and enjoy it or not? If you can't, then maybe you made a mistake and you'll have to make the next choice- stay and enjoy - or accept it is not for you, and deal with it somehow. Bonne chance. Nobody is imposing anything on you, are they?

You would like Switzerland to change to suit YOU - and at the same time you say that the foreign country you have chosen to live in 'imposes' it's culture on you. You want to be free to shop on a Sunday (and as said above, there are plenty of places where you can- our little supermarket is open 8-12 on Sundays, and so it the Coop at the station) - which means that people would be forced to change their way of life and work to suit you. Since when are the rights of a few individuals more important to the rights of the majority??? BTW all the shops in France are closed on a Sunday too.

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Old 06.05.2012, 15:51
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

Been here since 1980. Love these wonderful quiet Sundays. Only day of the week when I can say to the wife "I can't do that, not on a Sunday" when she finds "a little job you can do". Heaven.
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Old 06.05.2012, 16:01
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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Are you saying that religion doesn't dominate life in many Western European countries?
I would say so, yes.

I found religion far more dominating in the US than here.

Hell, anyone running for POTUS better well be religious or they have NO chance, not the case here.

Sundays are closed because of tradition, NOT religion.

Sure, the tradition is due to religion, but the days of religion being a big part of peoples lives here is long past.

However, the tradition remains, but to say it has anything anymore to do with religion is nonsense.

Tom
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Old 06.05.2012, 16:21
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Re: Living in a Religious Dominated Place

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Do you consider going to work on the 1st of August? After all you're not Swiss - it'd be terrible to have holidays imposed on you to celebrate the birth of a random country.
Swiss National Day is not religious. If you are a Swiss muslin, the holiday is still important to you. Anyone who is Swiss. Again, my issue stems from religious, not national holidays. Swiss national day does not exclude anyone Swiss. Ascension excludes all Swiss who are not Christian.

Christmas is the one exception because it has really lost any semblance of religion. I have Jewish friends who put up a tree and give out presents. It is all commercial now. Tell me how it is fair that my Jewish student was supposed to come to school on both Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur, but was told he had to stay home on good Friday and Ascension.
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