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Old 07.06.2012, 08:22
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Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

Dear forum members, and especially dear smokers,

I would like to confess that I have developed a strong intolerance toward cigarette smoke. The kinds of smoke that bother me are (1) cigarette smoke in my children’s living and sleeping space, (2) smoke from psychoactive compounds during my walks with my children in the middle of the day. The first kind of smoke is coming from a couple that just moved in downstairs. They are nice people, but they smoke more than an estimated pack a day (a felt 3 packs). When at home, they do this exclusively on their balcony (I am guessing, in order to protect their own living space from their own pollution). Unfortunately, most of their smoke then migrates to our apartment. I do not see why I need to be tolerant toward their pollution of my living space and of the air that my children, my wife and me breathe and I would like to ask you, dear smokers, to help me rediscover that tolerance.
Here are my problems with smoking: Cigarette emissions stink. And there is good reason for that: they are toxic (here a non-exhaustive list of ingredients: tar, nicotine, carbon monoxide, arsenic, benzene, lead, cadmium, etc.). It is obvious that this is unhealthy, especially for little children (a quick search on pubmed.com will confirm this, or go here for a summary of the statistics: http://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/data_stat...s_cig_smoking/). My problem is that second-hand smoke has the same effects - and not even in a greatly reduced fashion (again, a quick search on pubmed will provide you with the science on this matter, go here for a summary http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passive_smoking). My granddad was a heavy smoker and died of his habit. He also was a lovely person, just like the couple downstairs. He may have been very stressed by his memories of the war. And so he smoked a lot. At first, the doctors had to amputate his left leg to save his life. They told him to stop smoking, or he would lose his other one too. He continued smoking and they were forced to amputate his other leg. So the doctors told him to stop smoking, or his heart would stop working. He continued smoking and died at the age of 60 due to heart failure.
Given these facts, could someone please explain to me why I should tolerate smoke in my and my children’s bedroom? Second-hand cigarette smoke is dangerous, it stinks and there seems to be no greater benefit to smoking (except for the tobacco industry). In fact, instead of yielding benefits, smoking is costly to society (and we are all indirectly paying for the higher health care spendings that smokers have due to a depressed immune system and an increased likelihood of developing cancer and cardiovascular disease like my granddad).

I apologize for my intolerance and am looking forward to your responses.
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Old 07.06.2012, 08:50
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

I cant stand smoke!
I think there really is no need to smoke nowadays, especialy with all the evidence there is to show how bad it is for you?
Do people really have that little self respect and are that willing to kill themselves off slowly and probably rather painfully in the end?
Smoking does not add anything to anyones lives, just a sad addiction and as far as i think should be banned to protect peoples health.
Having had my grandfather live with us when i was younger whlsst my mother cared for him due to his Empyema caused from smoking, i can safely say i have seen some of the worst effects smoking can have on people.
The is no excuses, there is no reason to smoke, ever!
Also having children i can agree with you about smokers out and about, especially the ones that wave their cigerettes about and i have to dodge my kids out the way.


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Dear forum members, and especially dear smokers,

I would like to confess that I have developed a strong intolerance toward cigarette smoke. The kinds of smoke that bother me are (1) cigarette smoke in my children’s living and sleeping space, (2) smoke from psychoactive compounds during my walks with my children in the middle of the day. The first kind of smoke is coming from a couple that just moved in downstairs. They are nice people, but they smoke more than an estimated pack a day (a felt 3 packs). When at home, they do this exclusively on their balcony (I am guessing, in order to protect their own living space from their own pollution). Unfortunately, most of their smoke then migrates to our apartment. I do not see why I need to be tolerant toward their pollution of my living space and of the air that my children, my wife and me breathe and I would like to ask you, dear smokers, to help me rediscover that tolerance.
Here are my problems with smoking: Cigarette emissions stink. And there is good reason for that: they are toxic (here a non-exhaustive list of ingredients: tar, nicotine, carbon monoxide, arsenic, benzene, lead, cadmium, etc.). It is obvious that this is unhealthy, especially for little children (a quick search on pubmed.com will confirm this, or go here for a summary of the statistics: http://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/data_stat...s_cig_smoking/). My problem is that second-hand smoke has the same effects - and not even in a greatly reduced fashion (again, a quick search on pubmed will provide you with the science on this matter, go here for a summary http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passive_smoking). My granddad was a heavy smoker and died of his habit. He also was a lovely person, just like the couple downstairs. He may have been very stressed by his memories of the war. And so he smoked a lot. At first, the doctors had to amputate his left leg to save his life. They told him to stop smoking, or he would lose his other one too. He continued smoking and they were forced to amputate his other leg. So the doctors told him to stop smoking, or his heart would stop working. He continued smoking and died at the age of 60 due to heart failure.
Given these facts, could someone please explain to me why I should tolerate smoke in my and my children’s bedroom? Second-hand cigarette smoke is dangerous, it stinks and there seems to be no greater benefit to smoking (except for the tobacco industry). In fact, instead of yielding benefits, smoking is costly to society (and we are all indirectly paying for the higher health care spendings that smokers have due to a depressed immune system and an increased likelihood of developing cancer and cardiovascular disease like my granddad).

I apologize for my intolerance and am looking forward to your responses.
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Old 07.06.2012, 08:55
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

I understand that in some apartments, one is banned from having bbq's on one's balcony due to the inconvenince of the smell, for others in the building. Perhaps that same rule could apply to cigarette smoke wafting from balconies in your block. Check your contract to see if it excludes any (all) activity that could interfer with neighbours enjoyment of life.
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Old 07.06.2012, 09:45
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

I'm with you, and also against second hand beer
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Old 07.06.2012, 10:07
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

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I cant stand smoke!
I think there really is no need to smoke nowadays, especialy with all the evidence there is to show how bad it is for you?
Do people really have that little self respect and are that willing to kill themselves off slowly and probably rather painfully in the end?
Smoking does not add anything to anyones lives, just a sad addiction and as far as i think should be banned to protect peoples health.
Having had my grandfather live with us when i was younger whlsst my mother cared for him due to his Empyema caused from smoking, i can safely say i have seen some of the worst effects smoking can have on people.
The is no excuses, there is no reason to smoke, ever!
Also having children i can agree with you about smokers out and about, especially the ones that wave their cigerettes about and i have to dodge my kids out the way.

Wow, I am not even that radical.


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I understand that in some apartments, one is banned from having bbq's on one's balcony due to the inconvenince of the smell, for others in the building. Perhaps that same rule could apply to cigarette smoke wafting from balconies in your block. Check your contract to see if it excludes any (all) activity that could interfer with neighbours enjoyment of life.
I had this exact situation in our first appart in Baseland this exact same rule. Sadly, it didn't apply to cigarette smoke.

I'll take BBQ smell anytime!
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Old 07.06.2012, 10:13
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

Agree with the OP. I'm very hardline against smokers, I could care less about their freedoms, I'm more interested in my own health and avoiding cancer causing sources than their personal liberties.
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Old 07.06.2012, 10:17
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

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Smoking does not add anything to anyones lives, just a sad addiction and as far as i think should be banned to protect peoples health.

Alcohol causes more health problems than smoking. Alcohol causes more second hand deaths than smoking does. Alcohol causes more problems in society than smoking.

Do you think booze should be banned as well or just smoking?


Also should sweets and fatty foods also be banned 'to protect peoples health' ??



Where do we draw the line???


cheers
SC
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Old 07.06.2012, 10:20
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

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Agree with the OP. I'm very hardline against smokers, I could care less about their freedoms, I'm more interested in my own health and avoiding cancer causing sources than their personal liberties.
I am very interested in my health too and therefore demand that any motorcycle or car based on fuel should immediately taken from the street. They are bad for the health and I can't understand those cruel mothers who expose their precious offspring to such a pollution or drive their children around in a SUV but moan about the few smokers still around.
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Old 07.06.2012, 10:21
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

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Alcohol causes more health problems than smoking. Alcohol causes more second hand deaths than smoking does. Alcohol causes more problems in society than smoking.

Do you think booze should be banned as well or just smoking?


Also should sweets and fatty foods also be banned 'to protect peoples health' ??



Where do we draw the line???
There's a major difference when you compare smoking with alcohol or fatty foods. Feel free to drink yourself to oblivion or eat crap, that won't affect my life, it's your choice. When someone smokes you get the fallout whether you like it or not. Simples.
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Old 07.06.2012, 10:21
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

Guess you won't be trying the South American chicha then?



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I'm with you, and also against second hand beer
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Old 07.06.2012, 10:25
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

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There's a major difference when you compare smoking with alcohol or fatty foods. Feel free to drink yourself to oblivion or eat crap, that won't affect my life, it's your choice. When someone smokes you get the fallout whether you like it or not. Simples.


It might effect your life, when i am drunk and run you over with my car.


cheers
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Old 07.06.2012, 10:37
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

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There's a major difference when you compare smoking with alcohol or fatty foods. Feel free to drink yourself to oblivion or eat crap, that won't affect my life, it's your choice.
But is does really.
Alcohol and fatty foods cause health issues that increase your insurance premiums.
Drunk drivers and alcohol induced violence can devastate your life if you or your loved ones are caught in the wrong place at the wrong time.

That's not to defend the evils of cigarette smoke though.

As to the OP the only thing you can really do is close the window and remove all the chemical crap and synthetic substances (at least the ones that emit residues) from your apartment.
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Old 07.06.2012, 10:39
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

I sympathise with the OP.

Our neighbour smokes outside downwind of his open door but upwind of ours.

No smoke goes into his apartment but it all goes into ours.

It's much worse in the winter as our children's bedroom is downstairs so when we air the house, the cold smoked filled air flows down stairs and fills their room with smoke.

My wife says we can't do anything as it's his right to smoke outside. Our children get no rights.
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Old 07.06.2012, 11:11
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

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It might effect your life, when i am drunk and run you over with my car.


cheers
SC
But at least it's against the law to drink and drive. There's no law to prevent someone from blowing their second-hand smoke in your face, or the bus/tram/train because they just HAD to get that last second puff in before the doors shut.
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Old 07.06.2012, 11:57
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

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It might effect your life, when i am drunk and run you over with my car.


cheers
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If we are going to make this comparison, then I think the police should be able to test everyones smoke emissions and ban anyone that fails from public places
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Old 07.06.2012, 14:25
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

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Wow, I am not even that radical.
Lol, sorry was on one this morning!
But i do think the is a significant difference between smoke and alcohol/fatty foods.

I shouldnt be affected by any second hand alcohol or fatty foods. Laws are place to protect people from harming under the influence of alcohol, and people under the influence of fatty foods are normally stuck indoors, behind their tele watching jeremy kyle getting fatter and fatter so they arent much harm either.
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Old 08.06.2012, 19:09
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

I agree with OP, second-hand smoke is both annoying and hazardous
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Old 08.06.2012, 19:15
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

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I'll take BBQ smell anytime!
Me too, and I'm a vegetarian!
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Old 08.06.2012, 19:20
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

Given these facts, could someone please explain to me why I should tolerate smoke in my and my children’s bedroom?


Because its legal to smoke outside or in your own apartment and there is nothing you can do about it other than get over it or move.

Apologies if it is not the answer you want, but it is in fact the reality of the situation.

Lastly, please note, please do proper research on second hand smoke. There is a lot of anti-smoking warped research out there for the anti-smoking argument. Don't read the articles, don't read WIKI of all places, read the statitistics from the actual studies in full, not the WHO report that freely admit they did not publish the studies in full. You will see the second hand smoke argument is extremely flawed.
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Old 08.06.2012, 20:08
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Re: Why should anyone tolerate second-hand smoke in their apartment?

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Where do we draw the line???
I draw the line when I can't breathe. Dear smokers, I wish you all the enjoyment and pleasure the way you want, but I really really really need breathing. I know humans are badly designed, but still.
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