I'd be curious to know what psychological studies have concluded about using spanking as a punishment.

We do, after all, learn what to avoid via our pain mechanisms (e.g. If something burns, we learn not to touch it again. There is a strong link between memory and pain).

I hope I never resort to spanking my child. But honestly, I have a feeling I'm being a bit idealistic to think that I never will.

I was "busted" playing with matches when I was about 6 years old. My stepfather spanked me like crazy for about 10 minutes. Needless to say, I never played with matches again. And had he simply sent me to my room instead of spanking me, maybe I STILL never would have played with matches again. But I don't know...

I think there is some school of thought that says it teaches kids that violence gets results (or some such). A sharp slap on the bum or legs when a child is in danger or needs to be instantly reprimanded is probably harmless. The alternative is that you cajole and negotiate with a 6 year old not to play with matches as they slowly burn the house down.

My son starts to glaze over when I'm "discussing" bad behaviour with him and I know it's not sinking in. I think I've slapped his legs twice in his hitherto 5 years, both instances were because he was going to do something dangerous or damaging.

A punishment which stings a hell of a lot more than a slap is withdrawal of TV privileges and is my current weapon of choice.

Can you please explain well-deserved in your context? I have never slapped my children once so I'm not really sure what you mean & what effect you think it has. Do you slap them because you want them to stop what they are doing (being naughty)?

One thing that all the great apes living on this rock seem to agree on is that giving misbehaving kids a clip round the ear is the disciplinary act of choice.
It is something that has worked for aeons, why change a winning strategy?
Taking telly privileges seems to work as well.

To be fair, context is all screwed up on this thread anyway - "beating the living sh1t" out of someone in MY context is landing them in intensive care being fed through a straw, to you it is a mother slapping her 6 year old and following up with a knuckle swipe to the head.

But hey, this thread is probably headed for the same road crash as the "slapping kids in a public area" one a couple of years ago.

I think the word spanking means a very different thing in different context. The old school english spanking is supposed to be painful. On the continent, it's not about real pain, of course you feel something, but it's not real pain. In a way, it's more the shock of the reaction that works like a unpleasant experience and is taken as a physical sign of disapprouvale. In a sense, it's body language, a touch signal, not a pain.
On can argue that it does also make damage even so, I totally understand and it's a personal, cultural and generational philosophy, but the word spanking is so polysemic, that a discussion about it bound to go wrong through misunderstanding.
I habe said it often, I am a bicultural guy, and on that issue too, my two cultures are the exact opposite. I am OK with differences.

This question of abuse is something that has always weighed heavily on me. My upbringing was very rough, both physically and verbally (mentally).

Dear OP - why is it more okay for you to call a stranger an "idiot", instead of acting in a diffusingly sympathetic manner such as Biff suggests, than it is for a parent to hit a misbehaving child?

Is it a matter of degree? Do you think that what the mother was doing was extreme enough to warrant verbal abuse from you, but that nothing a child does should warrant physical punishment?

Like some of the others, I can imagine scenarios where a swift pop on the backside is warranted. I can not imagine beatings such as I endured as a child ever being understandable though, but even so, I am sympathetic toward my parents knowing the circumstances which "allowed" this behavior. They were each abused themselves and the treatment we received WAS better than what they'd endured themselves.


So, while you think that her behavior was inexcusable (and I agree), I think that yours was a bit beyond the pale too. Intervening is good, yes, but the method, like hers, can be seen as being flawed as well. Of course, our actions and reactions are based upon what we're taught... perhaps you arrived at adulthood without learning that calling people names is bad, or, perhaps you, like my parents, take comfort in the idea that at least calling her an "idiot" wasn't as bad as calling her something worse.


Oh, and because I'm aware I come off sounding like some kind of goodytwoshoes with this - I have a terrible temper and a worse mouth with many years as a military brat hearing quite nasty things. Although I am better at controlling my temper these days, "idiot" is probably the least bad example of something I'd call someone who pissed me off.

When it comes to the biblical model of child rearing - not quite sure why it was raised in the first place, but, whatever - the only laws that gentiles are to follow are to refrain from sexual immorality and eat meat with blood in it. There's no obligation to take your child out of the village and stone them. As I'm sure we're all relieved to know.

Perhaps someone Jewish could comment on how they interpret it - Exodus 21:17, I think it is. I can't say I've noticed a heap of disrespectful Jewish kids' corpses outside the Gemeinde borders, so presumably it isn't common practice. Or perhaps Jewish kids just aren't disrespectful precisely because of this sanction?

I never resorted to smacking my kids. If they were seriously disobedient or cheeky, they got smacked. It wasn't a resort, it was just part of the parental toolkit - and never done with a lost temper. I still don't really understand why nowadays smacking is treated with such self-righteous horror. Perhaps a generational thing.

In this incident, I think the woman's actions, as described, were entirely out of order. Any adult can force a 5-6 year old to do what they want without whacking them. I was truly shocked a few weeks ago, when some guy referred to his crying ~2 year old as "Putain de merde".

Of course nowadays the simplest disciplinary measure available to parents is to change the wifi password...

Good one. I can asure you that if the OP had intervened against my French aunts, they would have just waited for the intrider to go away and keep doing what they where doing, cumforted in their view that there are lunatics outthere.
That doesn't mean OP is wrong with his or her opinion, but it will just reinforce opposite opinions.

2. 4 & 9. No. Never. Not even threatened to do it.

I was in Zurich yesterday and I saw a lot of people that obviously never got slapped by their parents.

You're out of line for putting your hands on another person.... but... clearly getting between them and the child, or making it very clear that their abuse is wrong and then grab your phone to record the actions/call the police is more appropriate.

With that said, if the child is in serious danger, all bets are off.... and I have been known on quite a few occasions to let an abusive parent know that hitting their kids is wrong and that they are more than welcome to take it out on me (of course it would not be a pretty ending)... but, at least the child isn't being hit at that moment.

I think the bigger problem is... what you see is more than likely 10% of what goes on in the home. WHY THE _ _ _ _ can anyone be a parent is beyond me!!

wow, I can just imagine how quiet tram and train rides would be...

Look, I'm not trying to be smart, recently my father asked me.. "do you know why we had a Mini (car) when you were young (family of 5 & a dog!)".. "no" I replied "so I could reach you all to give you a good beating when you played up" ..he said

Though I think it hasn't affected me now I'm older there is a part of me deep down that is insecure & comes to the surface just when I don't need it most...like at work when dealing with those in higher positions or in decision making processes in my personal life. I can cope but it needn't have been that way.

Well, you can do that in Switzerland without the risk of getting shot on the spot.
I wouldn't try it in Texas or Florida (and most of the rest of the US neither).

I would say something must have gone completely wrong for the last 5 years or else he wouldn't even think of doing it.

the land of George W. Bush Jr. come on.. not buying that.. they get away with murder there... you know they have the highest executions of the death penalty in the country? you really think they care about a parent taking out work stress on some measly kid in the car, on the street, at the movies or anywhere else?

Someone who does something idiotic could be described as an idiot could they not?

Never be surprised at the lengths a 5 year old will go to at the height of a hissy fit to show you up / piss you off / get their own way. It's all heat-of-the-moment stuff driven by a child's brain who doesn't much think about the consequences of hoofing everything off a supermarket shelf.

I wouldn't be critical of any parent in this situation - how can you prepare for that??

there are plenty of studies on the subject... abuse is abuse is abuse...

my dad had two belts, one with metal studs, and one without... i got to chose which I wanted.. I would get hit less with the studs, but of course, they would often break skin...

... and that was just the formal punishment for crimes like, not feeding the animals on time, etc... on those other ad hoc occasions, it was usually a hand across the face followed by a shove to the ground

did it help? nope... did it make me hate and resent him? to this day!