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  #81  
Old 16.03.2014, 19:12
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

Yes I agree. More Swiss burocracy. I could understand it if you were applying for citizenship.
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  #82  
Old 16.03.2014, 19:13
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

Well do you mean just the British or all non German speaking nationalities?
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Since I could not find any info on the site, just thought to let people know that EU, or at least the British, need a Start Deutsch 2 language certificate (like the one from Goethe Institute I imagine) to be eligible for the C Permit in Kanton Zürich. It was confirmed to me by the Migrationsamt office in Zürich yesterday.
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  #83  
Old 16.03.2014, 20:10
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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Exactly, this is just harassment and has nothing to do with "integrating" foreigners.
I would say instead that many monolingual English-speaking foreigners in Switzerland had it, and still have it very good, compared to other Western European countries...

Try to live in France, Germany or Italy only speaking English, even in the big cities (I talk out of personal experience)...good luck. You won't go very far there with the "English-speaking doctor/nanny/mechanic/slave needed" attitude, or at least not as far as here...and almost no insurance/service company will give you a dedicated English-speaking customer service (I know English-speaking people in Germany who got told on the phone "We are in Germany here, so we speak only German to our customers").

The Swiss have been very accomodating so far...
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  #84  
Old 16.03.2014, 20:15
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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Try to live in France, Germany or Italy only speaking English.
Now that's funny.


I secretely hope that the language requirements will increase until the Swiss Germans fail at their own tests. The Romands and Ticinese will be fine. Even more fun.
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  #85  
Old 16.03.2014, 20:33
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

If the examiner speaks Zuritütsch and you've learnt Berntütsch, or vice-versa- they will fail you (as they can't stand each other..) (joke...)

Last edited by Odile; 16.03.2014 at 21:38.
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  #86  
Old 16.03.2014, 20:48
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

If they are going to do this, then they should at least accept ANY of the national languages, regardless of which canton you live in.

Or if they don't want to do this, then the Swiss should also have to prove they can speak the language of the Canton…. there are a few Swiss Frenchies living in my village who can't speak (Swiss)German and my OH can't speak French, but he could go and reside in a French canton.
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  #87  
Old 16.03.2014, 21:08
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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Italian is an official language in Switzerland. So the Bund cannot force Italians to learn another language of Switzerland.
Unfortunately using that logic Anglophones should be able to submit an A2 certificate in any of the national languages and not be asked to stick to just the local one.

Don't get me wrong, I think anyone who chooses to permanently reside in Switzerland should speak at least a basic level of the local language, so I wouldn't exempt Germans, Italians or French - all of whom can be as bad as Anglophones where it comes to learning other languages (one of my neighbours is Italian and after 40 years here has only a few words of German, which is frankly shameful).
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Some people have half a brain and others don't. I'm American, for crying out loud, and even I learned German to the b2/c1 level pretty easily.

I don't get why it's a problem for the Swiss to want people who apply for a permanent residence permit to speak the local language well enough to get by. If you can't speak it, stick with your B permit and be happy.
Completely agree. All this bellyaching about being forced to speak a ridiculously basic level the language of where they live by some really smacks of the attitude you sometimes get that if you speak English loudly and slowly enough to any foreigner they'll understand you.

Whinging about some EU being treated differently to others or that they changed the rules aside, can anyone tell me what is so unreasonable about wanting permanent resident non-citizens to at least have a basic level of understanding of the local language?
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  #88  
Old 16.03.2014, 21:22
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

Well France,Germany and Italy are not to be compared to Switzerland. They are not 3 ( or 4) language countries like Switzerland is. The Swiss had to accommodate to the diversity of languages here.And in Germany there are plenty of Germans who simply dont like the English. Hangover from the wars.
And many of the French are simply too arrogant to condescend to speaking another language.



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I would say instead that many monolingual English-speaking foreigners in Switzerland had it, and still have it very good, compared to other Western European countries...

Try to live in France, Germany or Italy only speaking English, even in the big cities (I talk out of personal experience)...good luck. You won't go very far there with the "English-speaking doctor/nanny/mechanic/slave needed" attitude, or at least not as far as here...and almost no insurance/service company will give you a dedicated English-speaking customer service (I know English-speaking people in Germany who got told on the phone "We are in Germany here, so we speak only German to our customers").

The Swiss have been very accomodating so far...
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  #89  
Old 16.03.2014, 21:30
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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Well do you mean just the British or all non German speaking nationalities?
If you'd read the whole thread you'd know that it is all EU countries which don't have a reciprocal agreement with Switzerland. Great Britain is one but there are others too. There are non German speaking countries which don't have the language requirements because if these agreements.

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I would say instead that many monolingual English-speaking foreigners in Switzerland had it, and still have it very good, compared to other Western European countries...

Try to live in France, Germany or Italy only speaking English, even in the big cities (I talk out of personal experience)...good luck. You won't go very far there with the "English-speaking doctor/nanny/mechanic/slave needed" attitude, or at least not as far as here...and almost no insurance/service company will give you a dedicated English-speaking customer service (I know English-speaking people in Germany who got told on the phone "We are in Germany here, so we speak only German to our customers").

The Swiss have been very accomodating so far...
Absolutely. Having lived in both France and Germany I can confirm that you don't get very far with the 'I only speak English' attitude.
In Belgium too even though it's a multilingual country like Switzerland unless you're in Brussels you don't get very far by only speaking English either.

I think if you're living in a foreign country the very least you can dos make some effort to learn the local language. To get a C permit means you've already lived here for at least 5 years ( with one or two exceptions) so should be able to converse at a basic level at the very least.
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  #90  
Old 16.03.2014, 21:41
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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If they are going to do this, then they should at least accept ANY of the national languages, regardless of which canton you live in.
They can't even if they wanted to because nobody is citizen of the country. Swiss are citizens of their municipality, which makes it automatically a cantonal citizenship. Of course it is a national citizenship in the sense that it ends up being equivalent, but the authority is not centralized federally. All three levels of authority on citizenship are respected to the letter, and the last word is not in Bern, it's local. Federal defines the prerequisites, cantonal defines whatever they want and communal defines the practicalities in fine. It is not totally local, we all agree, but definitely not a plain federal citizenship.
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  #91  
Old 16.03.2014, 21:42
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

If the language issue is partly linked to 'integration' (and NOT assimilation)- eg being able to take part in local society and culture- by being able to communicate a basic level (which does NOT require perfect grammar and ginormous vocab)- then it makes sense to be tested in the local language of where you live (the above post about Zuri or Berntütsch was a joke... and high German is fine too, in the (Swiss) German speaking part of CH.
To be honest, if anyone can't speak BASIC communicative whatever language after living 5 years in whatever area wherever in the world- it is a poor show, really. For me, a total sign of disrespect too (and yes- no talking perfect grammar here- of vast vocabulary- but basic communication).

Last edited by Odile; 16.03.2014 at 21:55.
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  #92  
Old 16.03.2014, 21:57
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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If they are going to do this, then they should at least accept ANY of the national languages, regardless of which canton you live in.

Or if they don't want to do this, then the Swiss should also have to prove they can speak the language of the Canton…. there are a few Swiss Frenchies living in my village who can't speak (Swiss)German and my OH can't speak French, but he could go and reside in a French canton.
Fribourg, Valais and Berne are official bilingue cantons.
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  #93  
Old 16.03.2014, 22:04
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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I would say instead that many monolingual English-speaking foreigners in Switzerland had it, and still have it very good, compared to other Western European countries...

Try to live in France, Germany or Italy only speaking English, even in the big cities (I talk out of personal experience)...good luck. You won't go very far there with the "English-speaking doctor/nanny/mechanic/slave needed" attitude, or at least not as far as here...and almost no insurance/service company will give you a dedicated English-speaking customer service (I know English-speaking people in Germany who got told on the phone "We are in Germany here, so we speak only German to our customers").

The Swiss have been very accomodating so far...
All EU citizens are entitled to live in Germany or France without any language certificate being required.
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  #94  
Old 16.03.2014, 22:27
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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All EU citizens are entitled to live in Germany or France without any language certificate being required.
In case you hadn't noticed Switzerland isn't in the EU.
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  #95  
Old 16.03.2014, 23:35
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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Fribourg, Valais and Berne are official bilingue cantons.
Not to mention GR, however not many communities are officially bilingual like Biel-Bienne.
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Old 17.03.2014, 08:54
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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In case you hadn't noticed Switzerland isn't in the EU.
No shiit Sherlock.

Actually read the quoted point I was responding to.
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  #97  
Old 17.03.2014, 10:18
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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Actually read the quoted point I was responding to.
That's what's so odd, because you didn't actually respond to the point that was made in it.

RomandieFan pointed out how most other European countries are not as 'English-friendly' as Switzerland and where in many cases you would not be able to muddle your way with three words of the local language and spend the rest of your time just speaking in English and you responded that you don't need a language certificate to live there - bit of a non sequitur, TBH.

You've done that a few times in this thread, I've noticed.

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  #98  
Old 17.03.2014, 10:22
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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In case you hadn't noticed Switzerland isn't in the EU.
In any case most EU citizens are also entitled to live in CH if they can support themselves by having a Job or their own money.
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  #99  
Old 17.03.2014, 10:29
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

Interestingly enough, when I go out to the local bars to meet (Swiss) acquaintances they want to speak English. I am their practice guinea pig and they want to learn from me.

Not so good for my German...
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Old 17.03.2014, 10:32
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Re: New language requirement for EU, C Permit

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No shiit Sherlock.

Actually read the quoted point I was responding to.
I read and responded to your quoted post in case you hadn't noticed.

Whether EU countries require a language certificate or not is totally irrelevant.

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In any case most EU citizens are also entitled to live in CH if they can support themselves by having a Job or their own money.
Exactly and this is also the case in many EU countries. It's not just as simple as rocking up there and becoming a resident. We have lived in France, Germany and Belgium and in all these countries we had to show means of supporting ourselves before being given our residence permits. ( or the equivalents for the countries concerned)
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