I just got a tax bill for 2003. I owe 620 CHF fine. Well, not fine really, because I am deducted at source, so in fact odd. Now add on to this the 27CHF in interest they are charging me. Really not fine.

They deduct taxes from my Salary. Take over a year to rpocess the tex return form, and then charge me interest. ARRRGGGGGGGGG.

Should I even bother to argue?

it's a great interest rate. Rather than getting a lease for a new motorbike, I put off my 2004 taxes and bought it with cash

You need to give us a little bit more information. Did you submit a tax return? If so, did you calculate how much tax you already paid at source and how much you should have paid.

Only a year? Wow that's fast. When I paid tax at source I was always paid a refund, but strangely it took 3 years to process.

Where do you live? Have you chosen an expensive location (like Zurich City?) The amount which is deducted an average amount - depending on where you live your final taxes might be higher or lower than the amounts that were deducted.

There is another possibility - some of the money which is supposed to be deducted has been "lost" through administrative error. This is why it is important to verify than no mistakes have been made.

You've come to the right place - there are plenty of people here who know about taxes - fire away...

Hi,

I did complete a tax return. I was living in Opfikon and the bill I got was from Opfikon. Oddly enough, my girlfriend who was living in Wallisellen, got a notic from Wallisellen that she owed them taxes, but that they would settle with Zurich. Several months later she got a bill from Zurich for 2000 CHF. So I guess I can also look forward to another bill from Zurich.

Everyone has to pay taxes, I don;t object to that. It's the interest they charge you that really gets my goat.

Cheers

Usually when one gemeinde settles with another like you describe it is because you have moved. Your girlfriend may have moved from Zurich to Wallisellen - is this correct?

Now you mention that you were living in Opfikon? I take it you now live somewhere else. The gemeinde you were living in the 1st of January for a given year is the one where you pay your taxes for that year. Now here's the thing - Opfikon is a fairly low tax gemeinde, which means you are probably due a refund.

You need to check your tax return and the yellow sheet you got from your employer. This shows how much tax (Quellensteuer) you already paid in that year. Now take the income you were taxed on in that year and calculate your gemeinde, kanton and bundesteuer at this link:

http://www.steueramt.zh.ch/html/steu...e_personen.htm

Unfortunately this website is in German only. Add up the 3 amounts and the difference between what you should pay and what you have paid will be the amount of your refund or tax bill. But like I said - you lived in a low tax gemeinde - I think you should be due a refund.

Mark

Let me add a bit here.

Firstly the tax element for quellensteuer and the necessity to fill in a tax return only occur at salaries above 120K. If your salary is below this threshhold then you should be looking at the amount of tax your company decides to deduct for tax at source and compare this with the amount of tax you would be paying and then only fill in a tax return if you will get money back. If you fill in a tax return then you will be taxed "normally" and need to pay money back if you have not paid enough whereas if you have paid too much they will probably argue about paying you a refund! The link for calculating your tax has been given by Mark. Before you get excited Mark maybe did not make it clear enough that you need to follow both of the top links and add the two totals together to get all three tax elements.

As a quellensteuer payer your interest(either to you or from you) should only be calculated on the difference between the total quellensteuer paid and the amount due and it is usually at 2% which is by any standard low...

One of the things good companies do is to choose the minimum amount due on tax which I believe is around 8%. If this is the case then it could well be that you need to pay additional tax. However, most companies are not so switched on to what is possible and therefore you will most likely find as Mark has said that you are paying the mixed rate (100%) which should put you around 5% in front for Opfikon. Furthermore, when a company calculates the tax amount they do so based on the brutto II salary only. There are many other things you can deduct which bring your net salary down and these are not just related to Swiss interests but are global!

And finally the bad news. If you are working for a "good" company and earn less than 120K you are now left having to pay additional tax every year. Once you fill in a tax return you must always fill one in.

Another thing to note is who did your tax return? Did you do it yourself or go to a treuhand? If you went to a treuhand you can simply take the forms and ask them for an explanation. If you did it yourself then you should be asking - have I claimed everything I possibly can?! Most likely not...

I am by no means an expert, but can share with you what I have learned over the last 4 years here in CH

a) yes, the wheels do grind slowly at the quellensteuer office... but the system does work. I received a refund on my 2002 tax (a good chf 3,000) last year, and just received a slightly larger one on my 2003 tax... and they paid me 2% interest on what they owed me, so I'm not complaining about the delay

b) it seems to me that it is usually worth it to pay the treuhand a couple hundred bucks to do your taxes... mine has managed to get me back ten times what he charged me, so I'm happy with him. It seems that he can pick up the phone and call his friends in the quellenstr office, so he would stand a better chance getting my money back than I would... considering I only speak restaurant Deutsch...!

c) and to be fair, its not just his connections.... mine pointed out two deductions I was entitled to, but would not have known about.

d) even if you earn less than 120k, you can choose to file a return... thats the only way to get a refund, as far as I can tell. and if you speak any German, the paperwork is not that complicated. You can even get them to mail you a CD and the software does all the dirty work for you

cheers

Um, 'scuse me but I thought that foreigners paying Quellensteuer didn't have to submit tax returns? I've been here since 1997 and have never submitted one. I haven't been paying that close attention, but I think every year I get some sort of tax-related income summary in the mail, and I've always simply filed it away.

I'm a Canadian living in Zurich. Am I doing something wrong? Should I be filing for refunds?

One more question though: I got married in July 2005, and a week ago I got a bill in the mail saying that because I'm now married, I have to pay more Quellensteuer, and the last half year of unpaid taxes are going to be extracted from my next paycheck! Is this true: that getting married means paying *more* taxes?

Thanks! runway

If you earn more than 120k per year you then have to start submitting tax returns when paying quellensteuer. Once you have earned over 120k in any year, then you must continue to submit tax returns, even if your income in subsequent years drops to zero.

Getting married in CH is almost always financially disadvantegous if both partners work, but not if only one works (i.e. stays at home, has kids, makes lunch for kiddies when they come home from school etc). For this reason it is likely that your quellensteuer rate will change if you are married.

Since your tax will now be even harder to predict (since your income will be combined with your spouse) you would be advised to submit a tax return, or at least calculate one to see if you would be due a refund. There's also a good chance that the submission of a tax return would become compulsory, but you'd have to check that in more detail (or give us more information).

Mark

Marriage is not always disadvantageous but normally in Switzerland it is financially painful.

Once you are married your combined salary is considered as your total salary. However you are also subject to completing other parts of the tax return. Your Tarif changes to VT from GT and you can see that this reduces the tax load a little. You can also deduct an amount of money for simply being married ca 5K if both parties work. Furthermore, watch out for Church tax. If your wife is a "church member" and therefore pays tax to the church then you pay too. ie the church tax is paid on your joint salary. This is not the case if you are both in different churchs. Also if your wife does not work but is a member of the for example Catholic church then the Swiss are so kind as to see your joint salary as Catholic church taxable... That can hurt... Also with Church tax you are not able to be partially in ie for the first 6 months. If on Jan 1 you are in then for the whole year tax wise...

OK, I don't make that much, so no tax forms automatically.

My wife has a complicated employment sitation. She's part-time employed in an orchestra, part-time freelance musician, and partly paid by her health insurance as a result of an accident years ago which reduced her ability to do her job as intensively as before. Her income is variable, but for sure also under 120k yearly.
However, *together* there's little doubt that we earn over 120k brutto. Netto, I'm not so sure.

I'm a post-doc at the university, paid through various external contracts.

Does this change anything? Do I need to worry about tax returns? I prefer less paperwork, unless I'm *sure* we can get some sort of refund...!

Thanks again!

Your wife will be receiving part of her income without Quellensteuer - so in this case she will almost certainly be bound to submit a tax return. Now since you are married you will have submit a joint return, and she will be listed on your tax return.

Your situation sounds far from simple - I'd recommend going to a professional for advice and have them complete your tax return (e.g. a treuhand). This will cost you, but not much. It will be worth the time you will save.

Mark

No doubt you're right about the Treuhand! Any recommendations? I have ZERO experience with this sort of thing. I'm not even sure what a 'Treuhand' is! Cheers, runway

Hi all,

A friend sent me a form for swiss-fit who are running a workshop for swiss taxes.

I attach the application form (now lost but here is the link: http://www.fit-swiss.ch/index-46--L-en.html

Regards

M

Wait a minute - my wife has been in the same situation for a few years now, and she's never filled out a tax form. I assume that means she IS subject to Quellensteuer.
So again: we don't have to worry about tax forms, at least not now.
We've got plenty of things to worry about without tax worries as well!

But thanks anyway for the tax workshop forms ; ))

-runway

I think you actually answered your question a few posts earlier. You will, now that you are married move into the normal tax situation and therefore will need next year and potentially this year to fill in a tax return... I would however suggest getting a CD and reading it. If you have difficulty with some of the sections then posting here you will get plenty of help.
Unless of course the Swiss-fit course is FOC...