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  #41  
Old 29.05.2015, 16:37
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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Never thought I would be in the role of defending France, but it is always amusing to see the cars with Swiss numberplates increasing their speed once they pass the border "now we are FREEE..".
That's because the speed limit on motorways is 130Km/hr in France and only 120Km/hr here.
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  #42  
Old 29.05.2015, 16:48
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Re: The cyclist from hell

"I don't need to cross Mont Blanc thankfully, but for the majority of slower/less confident cyclists I fully understand why they use the normal width pedestrian footpath because it's ****ing scary cycling across Mont Blanc on the main road section except very early in the morning at weekends, especially if you want to then head up Rue du Mont Blanc and therefore need to get across two lanes of heavy traffic."

I fully understand (and agree) as well why cyclists use the pedestrian foothpath on the Mont Blanc but it is just as illegal as what the scooters do. Live and let live I would say. Of course there should be a decent cycling lane on the bridge. And there should be a way to avoid scooters having to wait in a long traffic jam behind the cars, as that takes away the incentive of taking the scooter in the first place. I can take the car as well, it's comfortable and I can listen to the radio and it's safer but if we all do this, Geneva will be even more at a standstill
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  #43  
Old 29.05.2015, 17:05
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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This is one I wish more drivers would understand. Pulling into the cycle lane in advance with indicator on is the best way to tell cyclists you're turning right, particularly in a slow line of traffic when the indicator can't be seen. Or at least move right a bit so your indicator is visible, particularly if the traffic is stopped.

So many times I've had drivers do a sharp right turn across the cycle path without thought or visible indicators.
Under normal conditions there are exactly two reasons why the right blinker can't be seen by a cyclist on the bycicle lane:
- all are broken (very unlikely as there are at least two)
- the car driver didn't activate it

While it indeed is good practice to pull into the cycle lane in preparation to turn right while moving, you may only do so if you pass the traffic light before it turns yellow/red. If you need to stop you must pull out of the bycicle lane, it doesn't matter if you're first or tenth in the line.

No car is allowed on the bycicle lane if it impedes bycicle traffic, it doesn't matter which vehicle is driving how fast.
Verkehrsregelnverordnung Art. 40/3
"Führer anderer Fahrzeuge dürfen auf dem mit einer unterbrochenen Linie abgegrenzten Radstreifen (6.09) fahren, sofern sie den Fahrradverkehr dadurch nicht behindern."
"Drivers of other vehicle types may drive on the bycicle lane (if separated by a dotted line), provided they don't impede bycicle traffic."

List of traffic fines(Bussenkatalog):
222.1 Parking on the bycicle lane costs 120.- CHF
222.2 Stopping on the bycicle lane if bycicle traffic is impeded costs 80.- CHF
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  #44  
Old 29.05.2015, 23:44
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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Dashcams (and helmet cams) are - and have been for a long time - common in many countries
My understanding is that dashcams and helmet cams are NOT LEGAL in Switzerland due to rules about "hidden" cameras in public spaces.

http://www.edoeb.admin.ch/datenschut...x.html?lang=en
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  #45  
Old 30.05.2015, 08:49
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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My understanding is that dashcams and helmet cams are NOT LEGAL in Switzerland due to rules about "hidden" cameras in public spaces.

http://www.edoeb.admin.ch/datenschut...x.html?lang=en
Good info.

However, it's going to be one of those grey areas ..... I'm still unsure whether or not it's claiming dashcams are illegal, or just filming individuals without their knowledge or consent is in breach of privacy laws.

A bit like the Google camera car capturing street view pics. ..... and some people appearing in places and situations where they shouldn't. In this case, plenty of pixulating was required.

Certainly, they are readily available to purchase, here.

From the latest Landi offers (to name but one):

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DashCam mit GPS Sensor MD 87277 MEDION® LIFE® P86009

Gültig ab 26.05.2015 | SOLANGE Vorrat!
Mit 3.0 Megapixel CMOS Sensor, Full HD Videoauflösung mit bis 1296p, 2,7" / 6,86cm Farbdisplay (16:9), GPS- und G-Sensor. Garantie: 3 Jahre.

Artikelnummer: 27961
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  #46  
Old 30.05.2015, 09:04
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Re: The cyclist from hell

There was an article in Times of Malta a year back, basically for dashcams to have legal implications the footage would have to be tamper proof, a blackbox for the car..

..interesting
http://www.timesofmalta.com/articles...ash-cam.512858
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  #47  
Old 31.05.2015, 15:05
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Re: The cyclist from hell

50cc scooters - yellow plates - may ride in cycle lanes, I understand. There are so many motor electric bikes now I feel they should no longer be allowed in cycle lanes; traditional cyclists are getting outnumbered by the powered machines.

If you need a yellow plate you should ride on the main road IMO.
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  #48  
Old 31.05.2015, 17:41
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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If you need a yellow plate you should ride on the main road IMO.
That's a really interesting point of view. I think I'd disagree, but it's not a strong disagreement.

The 50cc scooters (moped in English and mofa around here) are no problem (in my view) in a bike lane; they present in the same manner as a reasonably fit cyclist and are considered slow by anyone even a bit better than that.

The yellow-plate e-bikes (when well-charged) do have very strong performance (much better than a moped) and can be a bit of a surprise when they whisk past slower cyclists (I often like slip-streaming them, but that's not exactly usual). I sometimes see e-bikes sitting in the middle of the car lane, even when there's a bike lane available. That's certainly what I would do on an e-bike on 30/50 km/h roads.

The e-bikes are a compelling alternative to a car for someone who has to travel a short to medium distance, so I then think: do I want to see a car on the road or an e-bike in the bike lane?
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  #49  
Old 31.05.2015, 22:06
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Re: The cyclist from hell

interesting info from Urs Max thanks.
I wonder if anyone knows what the law is on bicycles "taking the lane", ie riding in the middle of the lane to stop "confident" drivers attempting dangerous overtakes.
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  #50  
Old 31.05.2015, 23:38
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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I wonder if anyone knows what the law is on bicycles "taking the lane"
https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classifi...index.html#a46

"Radfahrer müssen die Radwege und -streifen benützen."

"Cyclist have to use cycle ways and cycle lanes."

Penalty: CHF 30 (https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classifi...tion/19960142/ - item 621)
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  #51  
Old 31.05.2015, 23:51
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Re: The cyclist from hell

Hi Daffy,
Thanks for the reply, but I think taking the lane would only really be appropriate when there is no cycle lane, so that particular clause wouldnt apply.
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  #52  
Old 31.05.2015, 23:56
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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Hi Daffy,
Thanks for the reply, but I think taking the lane would only really be appropriate when there is no cycle lane, so that particular clause wouldnt apply.
https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classifi...index.html#a34

"Fahrzeuge müssen rechts, auf breiten Strassen innerhalb der rechten Fahrbahnhälfte fahren. Sie haben sich möglichst an den rechten Strassenrand zu halten, namentlich bei langsamer Fahrt und auf unübersichtlichen Strecken."

I cannot find a direct penalty for that, I am afraid.
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  #53  
Old 01.06.2015, 00:45
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classifi...index.html#a34

"Fahrzeuge müssen rechts, auf breiten Strassen innerhalb der rechten Fahrbahnhälfte fahren. Sie haben sich möglichst an den rechten Strassenrand zu halten, namentlich bei langsamer Fahrt und auf unübersichtlichen Strecken."

I cannot find a direct penalty for that, I am afraid.
The penalty is death.
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  #54  
Old 01.06.2015, 07:07
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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The penalty is death.
Weird. I am still alive?
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  #55  
Old 01.06.2015, 11:18
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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There is a cycling lane next to it which scooters use to get through to the traffic light. This is not allowed

(he goes faster than the scooters on the cycling lane and don't you dare slowing him down).
I'm struggling to work out what you're complaining about here. Seems like what you're really saying is "How dare he use the lane that's rightfully his, not yours, and get annoyed when you, who shouldn't be there, inconvenience him".

I'm with him on this - if you have this sort of attitude when you're illegally using his lane and slowing him down then I'm not at all surprised he'd get pissed off with you and want to start taking stronger measures.
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  #56  
Old 01.06.2015, 15:17
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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Weird. I am still alive?
I should have worded it more carefully. The maximum penalty for cycling on the wrong side of the road is death. There is no minimum penalty.
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  #57  
Old 01.06.2015, 16:56
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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I'm struggling to work out what you're complaining about here. Seems like what you're really saying is "How dare he use the lane that's rightfully his, not yours, and get annoyed when you, who shouldn't be there, inconvenience him".

I'm with him on this - if you have this sort of attitude when you're illegally using his lane and slowing him down then I'm not at all surprised he'd get pissed off with you and want to start taking stronger measures.
Well, of course it's not a discussion about what is legal; for me the "stronger measures" (i.e. filming all offenders) are a bit disproportionate to the offense, 99% are making sure they are not blocking anyone and with a bit of tolerance we all get to work in time. I always remain behind cyclists never trying to pass. It works both ways, it's not the case that all cyclists are such saints either, especially with the electric bikes some are going 40km an hour on the cycle lane now and can't stop even if they want to in case there are pedestrians that show up from behind cars.

Last edited by belgo; 01.06.2015 at 16:58. Reason: syntax
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  #58  
Old 01.06.2015, 20:01
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Re: The cyclist from hell

I will add an amusing moment to counteract the rest. I was out for a trundle, starting to go up a slope. the "pros" came along behind me & one put his hand out across my back to help me up the slope. I thought that was highly amusing. I had to say thanks but actually I have a power assisted bike. I just hadn't switched it to power on as I was at least trying to start the hill in exercise mode.
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  #59  
Old 01.06.2015, 21:54
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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Well, of course it's not a discussion about what is legal;
Well no, but you've lost the moral high ground before you've even started.

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for me the "stronger measures" (i.e. filming all offenders) are a bit disproportionate to the offense,
Eh? I can't see that any filming he's doing is in any way a strong measure. Now if he were to post it all over the internet, like a significant number of militant cyclists do in the UK and the US, you might have a semblance of a point, but even then, not much.
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Old 01.06.2015, 23:35
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Re: The cyclist from hell

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interesting info from Urs Max thanks.
I wonder if anyone knows what the law is on bicycles "taking the lane", ie riding in the middle of the lane to stop "confident" drivers attempting dangerous overtakes.
It appears that safety concerns can indeed override the general duty to stay on the right side.

The characteristics of the situation (small speed difference and dangerous being overtaken) generally applies to roundabouts, where cyclists are, officially and explicitly, strongly advised to take the middle of the lane for safety reasons (unless they make a simple right turn), explicitly to prevent being overtaken.

These characteristics are also present on roads that are so narrow that overtaking is dangerous, particularly by big trucks, which after a short time has all traffic move at the same speed as the bycicle. So here too, both criteria are fulfilled. However, common sense should have the cyclist the generally illegal way out if available and use the sidewalk instead, as being slowed down will get many a driver angry, which helps no-one and may actually provoke dangerous actions.

Same should apply to narrow country roads (you know, typically unpaved, 2-3m wide, the kind where often motorised traffic is forbidden except for farming vehicles), though letting a car pass by should be easy enough here (temporarily dismount if necessary).

So yes, I think there are situations where it's legal for a bycicle to ride in the middle of the lane and block the otherwise faster traffic, despite it being slow.

Last edited by Urs Max; 02.06.2015 at 00:06.
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