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  #61  
Old 11.12.2015, 21:06
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

Years ago when Harry Potter came to Switzerland some of my neighbours believed that enjoying Harry Potter was akin to devil worship: they stopped their kids from reading the books. I found their attitude rather hard to understand.
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Old 11.12.2015, 21:13
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

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The only oppressive thing I find is that if I do anything remotely not "average" people have a heart attack. "No, we don't have a TV" --> Judgement/heart attack; "No, we don't have a christmas tree." --> assumption of Satan worship.

Dudes chillax, some people like the simple life of not having gifts or tvs when they have laptops to keep them entertained. People are different, that's something Switzerland hasn't really caught on to in some parts.
Absolutely correct, if you look, talk, dress or do anything different, then it is a problem there. I never understood this, different is a good thing.
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Old 11.12.2015, 21:35
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

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The only oppressive thing I find is that if I do anything remotely not "average" people have a heart attack. "No, we don't have a TV" --> Judgement/heart attack; "No, we don't have a christmas tree." --> assumption of Satan worship.

Dudes chillax, some people like the simple life of not having gifts or tvs when they have laptops to keep them entertained. People are different, that's something Switzerland hasn't really caught on to in some parts.
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Absolutely correct, if you look, talk, dress or do anything different, then it is a problem there. I never understood this, different is a good thing.
I'm not denying your experiences, but sometimes I wonder if I'm living in a completely different Switzerland to the one you inhabit.

If anything, I feel more free here, because my weirdness can be explained away by "he's English", said with an indulgent smile. Even the local eccentrics are treated with much better humour than would have been the case anywhere I've lived in England. We've got an "artist" living in a ramshackle house just up the road. His yard, open to the street, is filled with all sorts of weird esoteric junk. As far as I've seen nothing has ever been damaged, nobody has spray-painted anything on his walls, nobody has smashed his windows. I wouldn't be so confident for his safety if he was living in a small town in England.

Sure, the locals are nosy, but I don't find this in any way inhibiting. If anything, it's comforting: should anything ever happen to me or anyone in my family, I know the neighbours would be round like a shot.

Perhaps it really is all about expectations. I'm just happy not to be gobbed on while walking down the street. A few twitching curtains don't bother me at all.
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Old 11.12.2015, 22:03
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How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

I'm sort of with DB here. I am fairly introverted, but here, I find myself having conversations with all sorts of people. And i've had decent service about as often as I did in the US. Maybe it's because I'm older, maybe it's because I'm used to being different in the US (last place we lived, I did not assimilate well). But whatever, i like it here. I would hate to go back to the US.
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Old 11.12.2015, 22:11
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

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My boyfriend refuses to move here because he says he can feel a palpable heaviness or oppression here. Other people had made similar comments. So, I am only trying to see how other people feel.
Quite frankly I wonder if he's reacting to the people or the landscape. Some people (including many flatland Swiss!) really don't cope well psychologically with mountains blocking out half the sky.

I've felt that occasionally - as though the mountains have a presence of their own. As though my being there is tolerated but not welcomed. Again this has nothing to do with the people, it's a reaction to a particular place and is the same no matter whether I'm alone or with others.

I'm sure it's just my lizard brain reacting to certain configurations of earth and sky but your boyfriend's comment about a "palpable heaviness or oppression" resonated with me.
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  #66  
Old 11.12.2015, 22:38
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

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The only oppressive thing I find is that if I do anything remotely not "average" people have a heart attack. "No, we don't have a TV" --> Judgement/heart attack; "No, we don't have a christmas tree." --> assumption of Satan worship.

Dudes chillax, some people like the simple life of not having gifts or tvs when they have laptops to keep them entertained. People are different, that's something Switzerland hasn't really caught on to in some parts.
I find it very interesting how people say that about Switzerland, because I feel the complete opposite. I guess it all depends on your background an expectations, as well as where you end up in Switzerland.

As a French Canadian who has lived several years in Western Norway, I feel refreshingly free from pressure to be conform at all times. I love Norway, but I arrived there at a time when there were few foreigners apart from refugies, and I kept being reminded that I didn't belong. I will always feel like a foreigner in the wrong way there, while here I'm just one amongst many and nobody cares. Hell, the country itself is multicultural, I like that. Also, here in Zürich I observe pretty excentric people on a daily basis, and there are no signs of social pressure in our neighbourhood and in the Troll's school.

About the Swiss German reserve, again it's probably from having lived in Norway too long, I don't see it as a problem. I meet a lot of people when I ski or when I hike, I chitchat with the parents at school, I get an acceptable service most places, really can't complain. Personally I'm always unconfortable when I'm in the States, it just gets too much for me. Too much openness and too much friendliness is just as oppressive if you're not used to it as the lack of it.

About the rules, well here at least I know the rules are followed. Not like when we lived in Paris and we got a long list of rules for our building and we had to spend the next 2 years figuring out which rules you could/should ignore and which ones you couldn't. My Canadian side prefers clear rules. Speaking of Paris, the working environment there was horrible, especially if you weren't one of the chose few few to have gone to the right schools.

I also find the obsession with security (personnal and national) to be oppressive. It's something I long associated with the US, but once you have kids, you find it's become pretty pervasive in Norway as well. Everything is so dangerous, you wonder why people have kids. Here, the Troll gets a level of freedom he would never havenin Canada, Norway or France.

So I don't know, my theory it's that it's a very personal opinion. I don't find Switzerland oppressive, cold or conformist, but I can get why some might thing it is. Especially if you live in the countryside, which is never as open as bigger cities would be.
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  #67  
Old 11.12.2015, 22:51
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

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Have you ever vacationed or lived in the US?)
Yes, I have many a time- Boston, Cape Cod down to Virginia- they do stare in West Virginia I can tell you. All over Arizona and Colorado- they do stare in Leadville for sure... and many more.
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  #68  
Old 11.12.2015, 22:57
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

Yes, I lived in Chicago for 6 months and San Francisco for three before I came to Switzerland. IMHO, Chicago is an absolutely fabulous place to live!
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Old 11.12.2015, 23:13
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

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Quite frankly I wonder if he's reacting to the people or the landscape. Some people (including many flatland Swiss!) really don't cope well psychologically with mountains blocking out half the sky.



I've felt that occasionally - as though the mountains have a presence of their own. As though my being there is tolerated but not welcomed. Again this has nothing to do with the people, it's a reaction to a particular place and is the same no matter whether I'm alone or with others.



I'm sure it's just my lizard brain reacting to certain configurations of earth and sky but your boyfriend's comment about a "palpable heaviness or oppression" resonated with me.

Oh, i missed this earlier. When I lived in North Carolina - we were in the center of the state, and I always felt as though i was suffocating beneath trees - no vistas anywhere, unless we travelled 3 or 4 hours in either direction. I've had the same feeling in certain valleys here and in the US, but for the most part, i can get above the heavy bits here.
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Old 12.12.2015, 00:48
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

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Quite frankly I wonder if he's reacting to the people or the landscape. Some people (including many flatland Swiss!) really don't cope well psychologically with mountains blocking out half the sky.

I've felt that occasionally - as though the mountains have a presence of their own. As though my being there is tolerated but not welcomed. Again this has nothing to do with the people, it's a reaction to a particular place and is the same no matter whether I'm alone or with others.

I'm sure it's just my lizard brain reacting to certain configurations of earth and sky but your boyfriend's comment about a "palpable heaviness or oppression" resonated with me.
I felt hemmed in and subdued by the grey mountains in Graübunden. Once I moved to Seeland Bern I felt so much better.
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Old 12.12.2015, 02:28
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

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Compared to California, yes very much; compared to New Jersey, similar level of rudeness.
As rude as New Englanders? Please, god, say it isn't so.

My scale of rudeness for the US goes:

Deep South<Mid West<Mid-Atlantic<New Jersey/New York<New England<Massachusetts<Boston (where people are rude as hell but don't do it on purpose)

I left out the west because I know nothing about it.
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Old 12.12.2015, 04:16
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

there is absolutely no place in the world I feel less oppressed than strolling the Limmat with a cold Feldi on a warm, sunny afternoon. heck, I'm ok just to walk up Rämistrasse on a cold, dark evening, too.

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  #73  
Old 12.12.2015, 15:38
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@Konuku, where are you from? Just some context on your perspective.
I'm American but also lived in France for 5 years as well as in London for 10 years.

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Quite frankly I wonder if he's reacting to the people or the landscape. Some people (including many flatland Swiss!) really don't cope well psychologically with mountains blocking out half the sky.

I've felt that occasionally - as though the mountains have a presence of their own. As though my being there is tolerated but not welcomed. Again this has nothing to do with the people, it's a reaction to a particular place and is the same no matter whether I'm alone or with others.

I'm sure it's just my lizard brain reacting to certain configurations of earth and sky but your boyfriend's comment about a "palpable heaviness or oppression" resonated with me.
Well, his ex-father-in-law was Swiss German. Claus had lived in other places for a number of years outside of Switzerland but came back to Switzerland to retire. He used to complain all the time about how he (yes, the Swiss German) felt Switzerland was oppressive, but felt like he had to live here to spend his final years with his children, grandchildren, etc.

Claus loved the mountains so his complaints were about other Swiss people, always judging and telling other people how to behave or live. He just didn't feel free without feeling that eyes were always on him.

So after hearing Claus complain so many times, my boyfriend was probably brainwashed - even unintentionally. I personally think my boyfriend has not spent enough time in Switzerland - particularly Ticino - to know if it is oppressive or not. But deep seated thoughts can be hard to break.

While my boyfriend has lived all other the world (Japan, France, Alaska, Florida, Texas, numerous other states and places), he has spent the last 30 years in LA. If there is one city in the world that let's you be as weird as you want without blinking an eye, it is LA. I lived there for 4 years and saw a lot of weird shit (a guy jogging backwards with a St. Bernard around his shoulders is one thing that came to mind)! Saying that, I also enjoyed it tremendously. It goes without saying that LA is so different from Switzerland.

Another reason he is not a fan of Switzerland are the prices for a lot of things. This might also contribute to what he feels as "oppressive". He is used to going out to lots of (often nice) restaurants in France, California or NY. But here, going out is much more expensive in comparison so he feels limited by what he can order or do. And this part, I do understand much more.

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Quite frankly I wonder if he's reacting to the people or the landscape. Some people (including many flatland Swiss!) really don't cope well psychologically with mountains blocking out half the sky.

I've felt that occasionally - as though the mountains have a presence of their own. As though my being there is tolerated but not welcomed. Again this has nothing to do with the people, it's a reaction to a particular place and is the same no matter whether I'm alone or with others.

I'm sure it's just my lizard brain reacting to certain configurations of earth and sky but your boyfriend's comment about a "palpable heaviness or oppression" resonated with me.
I forgot to mention that I do know what you mean. Though I think the Valais is beautiful, being on the valley floor there feels a bit heavy to me. There is a strange energy there that I do not find in other parts of Switzerland. Thank goodness they have incredible vineyards and raclette! It makes it better.

Last edited by glowjupiter; 12.12.2015 at 20:51. Reason: Merged posts - please use multiquote button.
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Old 12.12.2015, 16:07
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

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The only oppressive thing I find is that if I do anything remotely not "average" people have a heart attack.
Every member of my wife's family is not even remotely average.

And they are all Swiss.

Of course, it helps to be a "figlia d'artista".

Tom
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Old 12.12.2015, 16:12
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

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As rude as New Englanders? Please, god, say it isn't so.

My scale of rudeness for the US goes:

Deep South<Mid West<Mid-Atlantic<New Jersey/New York<New England<Massachusetts<Boston (where people are rude as hell but don't do it on purpose)

I left out the west because I know nothing about it.
As a native New Englander, I have always felt right at home in CH.

Tom
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Old 12.12.2015, 21:20
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

One thing that gets to me is the fact i speak French with a slight English accent, and people find it rather charming. Until i tell them i an Scottish Irish!!

But, the other day i was at a Workshop thingy, and everyone had an accent when they spoke. We had a mishmash of me and Portuguese, Spanish, German etc. All with a funny furren accent - but speaking French.

And we all understood each other. There was no Genevan accent in the whole room apart from the lady that did the course.

And there was a guy who couldn't find a word in French, and we all helped him. He said it in Spanish and we found the meaning and word. With our respective languages.

It's called respect. I often go out with friends. If there is one that does not understand English we all switch to French and vice versa.

I was Switzerlanded at ten years old!!!
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Old 13.12.2015, 13:19
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

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Years ago when Harry Potter came to Switzerland some of my neighbours believed that enjoying Harry Potter was akin to devil worship: they stopped their kids from reading the books. I found their attitude rather hard to understand.


nobody here around made a lot of ado --- some likrd the boopks and others did not
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Old 13.12.2015, 16:59
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

Have lived here now since quite a while, and have to say I find it one of the least "uptight" and "regulated" countries I've ever had the pleasure of living in.

The Swiss are their own worst critics - they know when they are over the top - and very often happy to be enlightened to their own shortcomings and / or tunnel-vision, and open to expand their horizon of in-grained thought.

It can take a little while to build the trust, and have to say that I've found it easier living in Zurich than in other more rural areas (where it was sometimes more difficult). But I guess that's true for anywhere.

And additionally agree - the landscape can play a big role. Living in a valley surrounded by mountains, added with a small community for example can be very oppressive. But, otherwise - no, I don't find it oppressive.

They even have larger parking spaces for Frauen - although not due to any lack of ability of women parking less well (have definitely witnessed both sides of the coin)
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Old 13.12.2015, 17:03
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

And the unemployment benefits are really good, aren't they?!?
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Old 13.12.2015, 17:21
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Re: How many people feel Switzerland is oppressive?

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Time for a soothing Edelweiss tea to relax!
That's an extremely racial comment (more here ):

http://www.20min.ch/schweiz/news/sto...ches--23861617
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