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Old 01.11.2006, 12:11
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Tricky question: Sale or Salary?

Okay, here is the background.

Back around August I took a photo of a water spout over Lake Constance. I sent it out of interest to SF Meteo, who quickly spread the word. One newspaper requested hi-res examples, and offered my money. They said somewhere in the range of 100-200chf. Naturally I said OK. They asked for my bank account details which I gave them.

A few weeks later things started to get complicated. I received what appeared to be a employment contract, with the title being freelance journalist. This was definitely a "one off", so I never replied.

I received the money in my bank account, with the deposit titled "Salary". Worked out to be around 140chf or something. Bugger all really. As a salary it is naturally subject to income tax as well.

Last month I then received another mail requesting my AHV card. All this for one lousy photo?

If I had known it was going to end up like this, I would have either said no, or given them the photo for free. To me I was selling them the photo, and not my services.

They are starting to ring me, I haven't answered them yet. I am wondering what my options are. I never signed anything.
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Old 01.11.2006, 12:13
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Re: Tricky question: Sale or Salary?

answer the phone. I've been trying to get through to you for ages!

(it's a sale, surely?)
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Old 01.11.2006, 12:18
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Re: Tricky question: Sale or Salary?

Quote:
answer the phone. I've been trying to get through to you for ages!

(it's a sale, surely?)
Then I am definitely not answering.

I am just wondering what their legal position is. They paid me under the assumption I would sign a contract as a freelancer. That ain't happening. I would sooner return them the money.
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Old 01.11.2006, 12:19
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Re: Tricky question: Sale or Salary?

Quote:
Okay, here is the background.
snip snip
They are starting to ring me, I haven't answered them yet. I am wondering what my options are. I never signed anything.
Hello,
I think the best bet is to consult a tax consultant for this matter.
140chf is a small amount, but you know how rule-based the Swiss can be, so it will be salary or INCOME. Even if it cost you 100chf to file a 1chf tax return, they will make you do it!

Nevertheless, I wish you good luck.

HAT
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Old 01.11.2006, 12:30
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Re: Tricky question: Sale or Salary?

They are treating you as a freelance contributor and will pay the % of AHV (pension) on the amount when they have your details. They will also show on thier books that they made a payment to you, so the tax authorities could trace the payment - vety unlikley for such a small amount.

You can add it to income column in the 2006 tax declaration. Or complete the back page of Hilfsblatt A (supplemental sheet A) and deduct expenses like the film and processing and the travelling expenses to the Bodensee and back and get the income down to zero. Or just 'overlook' the payment on your tax form.

Either way, their accounts dept will keep bugging you until they have your AHV card, they will post it back once they have it on their records. I think that they shouldn't have paid you until they had seen it...
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Old 01.11.2006, 12:39
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Re: Tricky question: Sale or Salary?

If that is the case I will give them the money back. The hassle is not worth it. This is especially so as I was on ALV during this time and never declared it, as I didn't expect it to be a salary payment. That could also come back to haunt me.
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Old 02.11.2006, 17:46
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Re: Tricky question: Sale or Salary?

Why not just phone them and say that there seems to be some misunderstanding?

If you only earn a small amount then they'll just want you to sign a piece of paper to say that you are a freelancer, and you'll take care of all your own stuff. This is so that you don't turn around and then claim to be an employee and ask for them to make AHV contributions on your behalf etc.

Imagine you hire a cleaner and she cleans your place once per month. You make payments to her bank account. The next problem is that you are effectively her employer and this carries certain obligations. But if she hasn't earned very much you can just get her to sign a piece of paper that she's you aren't responsible for all that stuff and the matter is solved. Or pay her cash and don't tell anyone - but this wasn't an option for the newspaper company.

A few years ago I did some work for a local dive store teaching diving. The money was peanuts (done for fun, not profit), and I also signed one of these things releasing them from their obligations as an employer.

So don't be scared - just clarify the situation and sign what you need to. It doesn't have to be a huge amount of bother for 140 francs - unless you want to turn it into one!
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Old 02.11.2006, 18:18
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Re: Tricky question: Sale or Salary?

All sorted.

Just after I posted this yesterday they rang again, this time I answered.

The first person tried to push their side, until she finally put me onto her boss. After explaining clearly that this was well and truly a "one time", they decided to let it slide. No contract, no AHV. Done.

What seemed to do the trick was telling them the position they had put me in in relation to the ALV: Because I didn't consider "employment" I never declared it. If I agreed with the newspaper, I could have left myself liable to penalties from the ALV office.

My argument was always everything indicated I was selling them a photo, not a service.
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Old 02.11.2006, 18:39
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Re: Tricky question: Sale or Salary?

You might find this useful in future:
http://www.sab-photo.ch/index.dna?nid=1007&lang=e

It's the «Recommended fees for photographic reproduction rights» published by the Swiss Association of Photo Agencies and Archives (SAB/ASBI). It costs CHF30 postage inclusive.

It'll give you a better idea of what your photos could be worth. For example, the recommended fee for a 1/4 page image for a newspaper with circulation of 500'000 is CHF315.
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