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  #21  
Old 25.02.2015, 13:29
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

What I don't understand is why the big deal?

Language can't be a big deal - the 2 countries are separated by just a bridge
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  #22  
Old 25.02.2015, 13:37
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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Switzerland is one of the few quasi-free countries left on the planet.......Switzerland has the political system which I very much prefer as an economist which is a system with a highly decentralised political structure with a very weak central government...... So yeah Switzerland is my ideal country, it isnt perfect, I know that, I would prefer even more freedom but it is very close to my paradise so I want to start a new life there.
One man's freedom is another man's terror. Don't be fooled - if you consider yourself a free spirit, then Switzerland may feel quite oppressive in some ways.
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  #23  
Old 25.02.2015, 14:05
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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One man's freedom is another man's terror. Don't be fooled - if you consider yourself a free spirit, then Switzerland may feel quite oppressive in some ways.
Very true - for example you can't disable snap to grid in the Swiss version of Powerpoint
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Old 25.02.2015, 14:16
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

Switzerland… Freedom…. hahahaha!

You have to ask for permission to be self-employed, for goodness sake… and they take great pleasure in saying "Computer says NO"
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Old 25.02.2015, 14:37
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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Switzerland… Freedom…. hahahaha!

You have to ask for permission to be self-employed, for goodness sake… and they take great pleasure in saying "Computer says NO"
You don't have to ask. You have to inform and then since it's regulated you have to comply with the rules.

Sometimes it doesn't seem like there is a difference, but there is.
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  #26  
Old 25.02.2015, 14:44
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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Very true - for example you can't disable snap to grid in the Swiss version of Powerpoint
Exactly. A fine example of Swiss tyranny. Any other country would have staged a rebellion against this kind of oppression by now.
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  #27  
Old 26.02.2015, 09:58
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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It's good that you read theory textbooks. Now, in the practical world, I will sum up that for people that make things in Switzerland (as you wish to become) the abandoment of the peg has been an unmitigated disaster. You don't need to take my word, take that of SWISSMEM (the manufacturer's trade association)

http://www.swissmem.ch/en/news-medie...-erwartet.html

For someone that wants to get a job making things, this is a terrible, terrible time to be looking to get hired in Switzerland.
Well, manufacturers are not economists, they just make gadgets, they have not read economic textbooks like I have so you should take their advice on economic theory with a grain of salt, the currency peg removal is a GREAT thing, yes it might cause temporary adjustment problems for manufacturing but so what? It is a system that balances itself out automatically, if manufacturing goes down then demand for swiss currency abroad goes down and that lowers wages which again causes manufacturing to go up again. It is a constant equilibrium process that is occuring, kind of similar to the bodies immune system which also auto-repairs stuff, this manufacturer is not a "doctor" like I am, his opinion is simply wrong.


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But, getting back to your original topic, based on the strategy you are described, I fully expect you to bounce out of Switzerland like a racquetball. Not speaking a Swiss language is going to be a MASSIVE obstacle, and your skill set is very niche. This gives you a very, very small target to aim for - companies that need blacksmiths that can tolerate not speaking their own language. The other point is that companies here tend to hire in a very small geographic radius, so if you move to Zurich, an employer in Sankt Gallen likely won't consider you very seriously.
Well I dont really want to be a blacksmith actually, I am willing to get any job, even if it means I have to shovel cow manure for 10 hours a day. I just want to get started in Switzerland and then work on building a career, I am generally a brilliant guy, I am sure I will do fine no matter what I do since I am smarter than most people and can use this intelligence to outcompete them.

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As others said - work on the language skills. That is the best thing you can do to help yourself. The coming immigration quotas are not going to help your cause, but that is beyond your control. Developing another professional skill set will also help expand your options. What you need to is give yourself the biggest possible range of employers that could use you.
Yeah I will work on the language thing, I saw a documentary about a guy learning the hardest language in the world (icelandic) in a week, he was a genius though and I am not THAT smart I think but hey I dont think German will be that hard to learn, it is kinda similar to danish with many words, it is just some words that make me go "wtf?" when I listen to german (around 50%).
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  #28  
Old 26.02.2015, 10:03
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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Does the UK not meet your criteria? You already speak the language....
The UK is almost as socialist as Denmark is, I want a real change and Switzerland is the biggest change you can get in Europe.
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  #29  
Old 26.02.2015, 10:21
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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I am generally a brilliant guy, I am sure I will do fine no matter what I do since I am smarter than most people and can use this intelligence to outcompete them.
Maybe that works for you in a land of pig farmers, but I suspect you might be in for a bit of a shock if you ever make it to Switzerland.
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  #30  
Old 26.02.2015, 10:36
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

Shoveling cow manure all day is will get you about 3200 a month, or that was the rate I was offered some years back
But serously there is a lot of metal manufacturing going on here,heaps of workshops large and small so it actually wouldn't hurt to come and have a look. Be prepared to go through a lot of shoe leather in your search though.
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  #31  
Old 26.02.2015, 10:37
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

if manufacturing goes down then demand for swiss currency abroad goes down and that lowers wages which again causes manufacturing to go up again.
Lower wages simply won't happen and prices won't adjust, eventually maybe but not in a timeframe useful to you, it took Migros ages to reduce prices to go against cross border shopping, it didn't work by the way.
Sure that the forums economic experts will give you more on this topic as soon as they have finished their coffee.

Well I dont really want to be a blacksmith actually
Your superior intelligence means Jack Shitt, especially when you want to compete with oodles of low income foreign immigrant workers, apart from that your high intelligence means that you will be bored to tears within minutes of shoveling cow-pats and then you may not get a job because you will be considered arrogant and/or over qualified (much the same thing to employers)


Yeah I will work on the language thing, I saw a documentary about a guy learning the hardest language in the world (icelandic) in a week, he was a genius though and I am not THAT smart I think but hey I dont think German will be that hard to learn, it is kinda similar to danish with many words, it is just some words that make me go "wtf?" when I listen to german (around 50%)
Well good luck with that one, all Indo-germanic languages are related, so I am sure that your superior intellect will have you speaking Schwiizer Düütsch in no time whatsoever.
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  #32  
Old 26.02.2015, 10:40
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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Well, manufacturers are not economists, they just make gadgets, they have not read economic textbooks like I have so you should take their advice on economic theory with a grain of salt, the currency peg removal is a GREAT thing, yes it might cause temporary adjustment problems for manufacturing but so what? It is a system that balances itself out automatically, if manufacturing goes down then demand for swiss currency abroad goes down and that lowers wages which again causes manufacturing to go up again. It is a constant equilibrium process that is occuring, kind of similar to the bodies immune system which also auto-repairs stuff, this manufacturer is not a "doctor" like I am, his opinion is simply wrong.
Ahem - you're not a "doctor" either if it comes to that.

Doctors have to (1) have a recognized medical degree. You're an autodidact. Not that there's anything wrong with that. Well, actually there is, I wouldn't let an autodidact remove my appendix, but maybe in the context of a descriptive field like economics...

(2) complete a period of residency where they actually work on some patients. Again "I've read lots of theory books" does not qualify you.

--------------------------

Can I offer a word of friendly, well-meant advice? Tone down the self-promotion. I mean way down. Show, not tell. The brillianter you say you are, the less people are prepared to believe it.

Look, I don't doubt that it's true - half the people in the world are smarter than average, after all, and I have no reason to doubt you when you say you're one of them - just offering advice to help you tailor your approach to your audience. Please take it as it's meant.
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  #33  
Old 26.02.2015, 10:49
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

Ah- whatever happened to the tale of a young men (and now women) going out to prove themselves in the big wide world?

It's still a romantic thought and a much needed drive for the majority of people that immigrated to CH, no?

Unfortunately, since Roman times, bureaucracy and technology has stepped in and no longer can one camp on the town's outskirts until one finds a meaningful mode of emploi. That will likely to not get you deported for 6 months (since you're EU), but probably make you broke and then get deported after 6 months. So, if you are going to embark on this adventure - there's two to three things I'd get cracking on asap.

Some form of legal shelter - you basically need a legal address so you can get registered here and avoid getting deported, plus to get all the mail from the government that you will be getting in the first few months. One of the cheapest places to stay is going to be a youth hostel and they general run about 100 - 120 CHF including a small breakfast per night. Another potential place to look for accommodation is shared places or people that are subletting for a while - you can find these announcements here, on Glocals, on Internations, etc. It's going to be hard to come in under say 1000 CHFS a month though, from what I've seen but maybe other people have other experiences.

Food (or rather a plan for getting food cheap) - a youth hostel is probably also a good idea because they might take your mail without it getting too lost and also because you might be able to cook (not all youth hostels offer kitchens though). Also in terms of mail, you generally can't get a PO Box (we tried) unless you have a significant volume of mail. You definitely don't want to be eating out at all if you're going on a budget - as an example, a standard lunch at McD's is 13 CHFs/one at Co-op restaurant buffet is 10-16 CHFs.

Jobs - you think other people are joking when they say book at LEAST 6 months, but it really isn't a joke (unfortunately). I'd suggest even start before you arrive if you want to give yourself a decent chance and go all out even from the beginning. I could go into all the reasons that you will need to budget that here, but it's really hard to explain to someone until they see it with their own eyes. Be flexible about what you can do and when you're not job-hunting, be learning the local language.

Also - accept the fact, despite your brilliance (because it has really nothing to do with that here), you may have to go home after 6 months. I say that, not to discourage you, but to make sure that you have an escape plan/Plan B just in case things do not work out here.

Really wish you all the best of luck, young man!

Last edited by AroundTown; 26.02.2015 at 11:26.
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  #34  
Old 26.02.2015, 10:58
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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I could go into all the reasons that you will need to budget that here, but it's really hard to explain to someone until they see it with their own eyes.
What @AroundTown said.
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  #35  
Old 26.02.2015, 11:42
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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The UK is almost as socialist as Denmark is, I want a real change and Switzerland is the biggest change you can get in Europe.
Try Kosovo.
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  #36  
Old 26.02.2015, 12:21
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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I dunno, the people I have talked with said their standard of living was much higher in Switzerland, in Denmark you can barely afford a 2-bedroom apartment, food and a crappy car like a Toyota Aygo without going broke, I havent been on a holiday in many years because there is almost no extra money left after bills are paid (electricity and water bills for example are insanely high), I seriously doubt things are that bad in Switzerland, even with your 300CH healthcare bill per month.
I know precisely one Dane in Switzerland:
a. Lives in a small rental apartment.
b. Drives a Toyota Yaris, about five years old.
c. Returns to Denmark for vacation, staying with relatives.
d. Speaks German and Swiss-German.

YMMV.
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Old 26.02.2015, 12:24
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

You know there was a time when Danes didn't sit there agonising about where to move and asking questions on the internet. No - they'd pile into their boats, sail across the wine-dark whale road, burn down a monastery or two, take some local maidens as their wives, extort money from the king, build a house of turf and raise pigs.

What has become of such a noble band of heathens?
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  #38  
Old 26.02.2015, 12:26
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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What has become of such a noble band of heathens?
They got married.
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  #39  
Old 26.02.2015, 12:29
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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.... I am generally a brilliant guy, I am sure I will do fine no matter what I do since I am smarter than most people ...
Well, that goes without saying.
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  #40  
Old 26.02.2015, 12:56
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Re: Danish guy that wants to move to Switzerland

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I am generally a brilliant guy, I am sure I will do fine no matter what I do since I am smarter than most people and can use this intelligence to out compete them.
It is good to be confident, but the Swiss will HATE you if you show this aspect of your character.

Why not come here in the summer for a few weeks. There is a nice camping site next to the river in Bern, and you can look around at the jobs market.

http://map.classic.search.ch/wabern/...,viasuisse,zug
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