Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Employment
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 26.02.2015, 11:07
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Outside Lugano
Posts: 341
Groaned at 9 Times in 9 Posts
Thanked 66 Times in 33 Posts
Konuku has earned some respectKonuku has earned some respect
RAV and unpaid work experience

Hello all,

I will be starting to receive RAV starting in March. I have accepted a few short-term unpaid jobs (3-5 work days each) over the next couple of months to help flesh out my CV and to hopefully help me network.

Does anyone know if I will still be paid RAV during these days? I know that they might make up your salary if you get a full-time job that is less than your RAV payments but what about very short-term gigs? It would be a shame to be penalised while I am trying to improve my situation.

Thanks for any help.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 26.02.2015, 11:34
Sbrinz's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Murten - Morat
Posts: 10,969
Groaned at 542 Times in 342 Posts
Thanked 10,573 Times in 5,408 Posts
Sbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

The RAV never stops you working for money, look on the website for the advantages, or ask your RAV adviser.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 26.02.2015, 11:39
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Outside Lugano
Posts: 341
Groaned at 9 Times in 9 Posts
Thanked 66 Times in 33 Posts
Konuku has earned some respectKonuku has earned some respect
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

Quote:
View Post
The RAV never stops you working for money, look on the website for the advantages, or ask your RAV adviser.
I did ask and she didn't know. She told me to ask La Cassa. I have tried to ask them 3 times, but they have never gotten back to me. So, in the meantime, I thought I would ask here before I have to travel 30 minutes into Lugano for an answer. Just in case anyone might know...
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 26.02.2015, 11:45
Sbrinz's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Murten - Morat
Posts: 10,969
Groaned at 542 Times in 342 Posts
Thanked 10,573 Times in 5,408 Posts
Sbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

http://www.area-lavoro.ch/arbeitslos/finanzielles/

http://www.area-lavoro.ch/arbeitslos/FAQ/

Your RAV adviser will administer your search for paid employment. As she says, it is the unemployment insurance that are ultimately responsible for paying you, and administering the Swiss laws. You should go to your unemployment Cassa and ask them directly.

Advice: if you are working less than 8 hours per week, you should inform your health insurance you need the accident insurance cover!
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Sbrinz for this useful post:
  #5  
Old 26.02.2015, 12:02
10pixels's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Basel
Posts: 216
Groaned at 3 Times in 3 Posts
Thanked 149 Times in 83 Posts
10pixels has no particular reputation at present
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

Quote:
View Post
Hello all,

I have accepted a few short-term unpaid jobs (3-5 work days each) over the next couple of months to help flesh out my CV and to hopefully help me network.

Does anyone know if I will still be paid RAV during these days?
While you are getting payment from RAV, you are essentially working for them. From RAV's perspective, if you take up unpaid work, then you are not available for job hunting and interviews and therefore, RAV will not pay you. It does not matter to RAV that the unpaid work you will be doing may help you find your next job.

That's the way RAV rules work, however crazy they may be to you and me.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 26.02.2015, 12:06
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Outside Lugano
Posts: 341
Groaned at 9 Times in 9 Posts
Thanked 66 Times in 33 Posts
Konuku has earned some respectKonuku has earned some respect
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

Quote:
View Post
Advice: if you are working less than 8 hours per week, you should inform your health insurance you need the accident insurance cover!
Thanks. But my RAV counselor told me that they will deduct such coverage from my payouts and that I don't need to take it through my health insurance. Is this incorrect?
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Konuku for this useful post:
  #7  
Old 08.03.2015, 11:40
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Outside Lugano
Posts: 341
Groaned at 9 Times in 9 Posts
Thanked 66 Times in 33 Posts
Konuku has earned some respectKonuku has earned some respect
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

Just an update...it appears that La Cassa does NOT pay when one does unpaid work experience. I am still not sure why as they claim that they often make up the difference if one accepts a job that pays lower than they do (at least for a while).

Perhaps they are concerned that lots of people will do unpaid work experience and still get paid and then not really look for work. Personally, my whopping 2 days unpaid work experience is beneficial to my finding a job, getting more experience and networking. But they choose to not see it as such.

I will be sure to no longer accept such assignments even if they may help me get off the RAV faster. A bit short-sighted on their part but it is what it is.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 08.03.2015, 13:16
Papa Goose's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Ägeri
Posts: 3,607
Groaned at 233 Times in 190 Posts
Thanked 4,042 Times in 1,742 Posts
Papa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond repute
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

Terms of the RAV Insurance payment is that you must be available and looking for work, taking on other duties would mean your not at those times so the insurance will not pay you. It's simple principle and nothing to do with the work being paid or not.

I was in a similar position, and thats what they told me. If THEY send you on something, thats fine, do it off your own bat and they will dock you the days. Remember the RAV is not there to find you a job, they are there to ensure you comply with the rules to get the insurance payment.
__________________
How do you know if a Frenchman has been in your garden.... your rubbish is gone, your dog is pregnant.... but at least your cabbages are pest free
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Papa Goose for this useful post:
  #9  
Old 09.03.2015, 14:44
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Outside Lugano
Posts: 341
Groaned at 9 Times in 9 Posts
Thanked 66 Times in 33 Posts
Konuku has earned some respectKonuku has earned some respect
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

Quote:
View Post
Terms of the RAV Insurance payment is that you must be available and looking for work, taking on other duties would mean your not at those times so the insurance will not pay you. It's simple principle and nothing to do with the work being paid or not.

I was in a similar position, and thats what they told me. If THEY send you on something, thats fine, do it off your own bat and they will dock you the days. Remember the RAV is not there to find you a job, they are there to ensure you comply with the rules to get the insurance payment.
I do understand that but then why do they pay you the difference if you accept a job that pays less than they do? I understand that if the difference is too great, they will not. But if they are willing to pay some then why don't they offer the maximum they can and then you lose the difference? If it is only 50%, then it is only 50%. I don't think many people will make it a habit if they get only 50% of an already much lower salary (70%/80% of their original one).

Receiving something is better than nothing and not paying anything goes against the rest of their policy.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 09.03.2015, 15:03
Aleydis's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Zurich
Posts: 765
Groaned at 22 Times in 21 Posts
Thanked 527 Times in 281 Posts
Aleydis has earned the respect of manyAleydis has earned the respect of manyAleydis has earned the respect of many
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

Their goal is to get you off their books. Think of it this way. RAV is your employer as long as you look for another job. And you cannot book any of your hours with a different employer unless you deduct them out of your RAV paycheck, ergo you have to be paid for them.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 09.03.2015, 15:12
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Outside Lugano
Posts: 341
Groaned at 9 Times in 9 Posts
Thanked 66 Times in 33 Posts
Konuku has earned some respectKonuku has earned some respect
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

Quote:
View Post
Their goal is to get you off their books. Think of it this way. RAV is your employer as long as you look for another job. And you cannot book any of your hours with a different employer unless you deduct them out of your RAV paycheck, ergo you have to be paid for them.
So if that is their goal, it makes sense that they support you to get additional work experience and to network (which is what I would be doing). But now, I will no longer accept such activities because I simply cannot afford to do so.

Tant pis pour moi!
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 13.03.2015, 18:04
Newbie
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Bottmingen
Posts: 6
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Centurio has no particular reputation at present
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

If you are doing unpaid work I would not bother telling them as it is not relevant to them. But why would anyone do unpaid work anyway. Esp in a situation when you need to focus 100% of your time to find a new job because you are unemployed.

If you do paid work ad interim during unemployment this is considered "Zwischenverdienst" and you have to report it to your "Kasse" every month with the monthly form that you have to send to Kasse. The Kasse will then deduct your payment for work from your the unemployment insurance you receive. The advantage is that this way your unemployment payment is extended for another month (if your "Zwischenverdienst" is greater or equal to your unemployment insurance) because you did not get these days paid by the Kasse. I did this already and it works fine.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Centurio for this useful post:
  #13  
Old 13.03.2015, 18:41
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Outside Lugano
Posts: 341
Groaned at 9 Times in 9 Posts
Thanked 66 Times in 33 Posts
Konuku has earned some respectKonuku has earned some respect
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

Quote:
View Post
If you are doing unpaid work I would not bother telling them as it is not relevant to them. But why would anyone do unpaid work anyway. Esp in a situation when you need to focus 100% of your time to find a new job because you are unemployed.

I have to tell them because I will be missing a language class that they are paying for. I could call up sick each day, but I feel slightly funny about doing it especially because I will be out of the country, and it complicates things.

I have agreed to be a wine judge at a prestigious wine competition (I work in the wine business). The trip is paid for though they do not pay us for working. I will be in touch with other top wine professionals so while I am working, I am actually trying to network and find a job.

My field is incredibly limited in Switzerland so networking on a global level is paramount. Not only will this unpaid work help me network, but it will also look good on my cv. Plus I get a free trip to Madrid.

So I am actually trying to use it to get a job. I am not working at Burger King or stuffing envelopes. That would be pointless.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 13.03.2015, 18:45
Newbie
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Bottmingen
Posts: 6
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Centurio has no particular reputation at present
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

OK I understand. In this case you have to tell them. Could you tell them you are going to interviews abroad? That's not even a complete lie and thats what I would do if you are away for a few days on unpaid work abroad. I am not sent on mandatory courses though so it is easier. My RAV advisor is quite understanding, fortunately.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 13.03.2015, 19:01
Aleydis's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Zurich
Posts: 765
Groaned at 22 Times in 21 Posts
Thanked 527 Times in 281 Posts
Aleydis has earned the respect of manyAleydis has earned the respect of manyAleydis has earned the respect of many
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

Konuku, have you tried to explain the situation as is? If yes, what did the RAV advisor say?
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 13.03.2015, 19:05
Newbie
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Bottmingen
Posts: 6
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Centurio has no particular reputation at present
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

I would not do that, because unpaid work is considered exploitation by the RAV and Kasse and therefore the system penalises you and cuts the days where you work. If you receive less payment then your daily rate from the Kasse then this will be a bad deal. The rules make sense to me because employers should not exploit the unemployed by offering them work which is paid below the market rate, ie unfair payment.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 13.03.2015, 19:11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Outside Lugano
Posts: 341
Groaned at 9 Times in 9 Posts
Thanked 66 Times in 33 Posts
Konuku has earned some respectKonuku has earned some respect
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

Quote:
View Post
OK I understand. In this case you have to tell them. Could you tell them you are going to interviews abroad? That's not even a complete lie and thats what I would do if you are away for a few days on unpaid work abroad. I am not sent on mandatory courses though so it is easier. My RAV advisor is quite understanding, fortunately.
Yes, my counselor did say that and suggested that if I could get job interviews for the time I would be there then it would not be an issue. But, I don't think that would be possible because I am busy all day long, and I don't have the contacts yet to even get an interview.

I would have to "prove" I had an interview as well by submitting an email.

So, I think I will have to bite the bullet this time. I just wish they were a bit more understanding. I am not doing charity work (as great and useful to the world as that is). I am actually trying to help myself get a job but my situation is a bit unique and falls outside of their rigid parameters.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 13.03.2015, 19:12
Aleydis's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Zurich
Posts: 765
Groaned at 22 Times in 21 Posts
Thanked 527 Times in 281 Posts
Aleydis has earned the respect of manyAleydis has earned the respect of manyAleydis has earned the respect of many
Re: RAV and unpaid work experience

Quote:
View Post
I would not do that, because unpaid work is considered exploitation by the RAV and Kasse and therefore the system penalises you and cuts the days where you work. If you receive less payment then your daily rate from the Kasse then this will be a bad deal. The rules make sense to me because employers should not exploit the unemployed by offering them work which is paid below the market rate, ie unfair payment.
I get it and I agree, but since the OP already accepted the engagement(s)... And it does make sense after all... Why not give it a try...
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Unpaid Work Experience Lily B Jobs wanted 0 02.06.2012 22:56
Work experience/ Internships in social work IronAngle Employment 3 29.12.2011 00:40
part time work and rav buchs Employment 5 15.03.2011 15:28
PLEASE HELP Looking for work even unpaid MONTREUX annastorm Jobs wanted 3 26.01.2011 23:55
Searching for work experience/ voluntary work [Hospital. Vaud] Little Miss H Jobs wanted 1 02.07.2007 09:59


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 02:17.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0