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Old 21.08.2015, 11:54
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Working and living in Switzerland

Dear all,

(ADMIN: if necessary please move this post to where it belongs, I could`t find it) thnx

So, here is my story. Im a 30 year "old" guy from Croatia. I studied at Faculty of tourism and hospitality management and became Magister of conomics. Later I finished one year specialization for PR and became public relations manager.
For the last few years I was thinking and dreaming about moving to Switzerland and now I finaly decided to do something about it. First thing that made me realize it is not that easy to just go there and find a job is the procedure. Basicaly, from what I have read is that first you need to find a company that is interested in you, ans than that same company needs to justify to department (i dont know exact name...) that You are (out of all the other potential employees within Switzerland and other EU and EFTA coutries) only one who fulfils their needs for the open job position.

Sounds like mission impossible to me, dont you think so? At least from my position where I (based in Croatia) need to find a company who is willing to go thru that whole process.

So my quostion is, what are your experiences?
Do you think there is need for Mrs of Economics?
Anything? Any suggestions?

And yeah... I dont think my english is perfect, but that`s just a perfectionist in me speaking. Und mein deutsch is so schecht, aber ich denke das ich kan make it better.

so... waiting for your experiences, suggestions, information..whatever...

thnx a lot guys (in advance)
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Old 21.08.2015, 12:04
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

Hi there and welcome to the forum!

I don't have any advice to give you other than keep looking for a job on the internet and apply for any position that seems fit. Good luck!
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Old 21.08.2015, 12:15
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

Although Croatia is an EU country, Croatians have limited access to employment in Switzerland with only 50 one-year B permit and 450 L permits available (per year). Swiss Authorities Online (ch.ch) says this:

"Special rules applying to Croatian nationals

Following the popular vote of 9 February 2014 (adoption of mass immigration initiative), the agreement on the free movement of persons will not be extended to Croatia. However, as of 1 July 2014 Croatian nationals will be subject to separate quotas (outside quotas for third country nationals). These consist of 50 one-year B permits and 450 short-term L permits. Please refer to the relevant State Secretariat for Migration SEM fact sheet. "

https://www.ch.ch/en/working-switzerland-eu-efta/

Also:
https://www.bfm.admin.ch/dam/data/bf...ts/fs-hr-e.pdf
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Old 21.08.2015, 22:35
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

Grüezi!

I'm also a graduate of Hospitality and International Tourism Management but I'm leaning towards Culinary currently. I'm not a Swiss, or a EU, instead I'm an American which is considered 3rd country. Before moving here, I've read a lot of forums saying it would be quite difficult in my situation because a Swiss would much rather hire a Swiss, over an immigrant. If they can resource within their own why look for someone else unless a Swiss really couldn't do the job?

It was quite discouraging, but the best thing to do is to take Deutsch classes and to improve on it. As an EU resident, you have the opportunity to stay here longer than I do, without a visa. Apply to as many places as you can and just work yourself up, but if you really want to work here, you really need to adapt to the Swiss culture. The Swiss can speak many languages (and like any other country) however, they really appreciate when you try to learn their language. They won't judge you at all, they're quite nice actually

alles gueti!
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Old 21.08.2015, 22:54
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

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Although Croatia is an EU country, Croatians have limited access to employment in Switzerland with only 50 one-year B permit and 450 L permits available (per year). Swiss Authorities Online (ch.ch) says this:

"Special rules applying to Croatian nationals

Following the popular vote of 9 February 2014 (adoption of mass immigration initiative), the agreement on the free movement of persons will not be extended to Croatia. However, as of 1 July 2014 Croatian nationals will be subject to separate quotas (outside quotas for third country nationals). These consist of 50 one-year B permits and 450 short-term L permits. Please refer to the relevant State Secretariat for Migration SEM fact sheet. "

https://www.ch.ch/en/working-switzerland-eu-efta/

Also:
https://www.bfm.admin.ch/dam/data/bf...ts/fs-hr-e.pdf
This also means that you are not considered an EU national as far as Switzerland is concerned, but still as a 3rd country national or non-EU - which means this is the criteria and what an employer would have to do to be able to hire you.

https://www.bfm.admin.ch/bfm/en/home...zulassung.html

KrystelCaparas, it's not a question of preferring to, it's that according to the Foreign Nationals Act to hire a non-EU national an employer MUST prove they can't find a Swiss/EU national who could do the job.
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Old 22.08.2015, 00:12
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

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Grüezi!

I'm also a graduate of Hospitality and International Tourism Management but I'm leaning towards Culinary currently. I'm not a Swiss, or a EU, instead I'm an American which is considered 3rd country. Before moving here, I've read a lot of forums saying it would be quite difficult in my situation because a Swiss would much rather hire a Swiss, over an immigrant. If they can resource within their own why look for someone else unless a Swiss really couldn't do the job?

It was quite discouraging, but the best thing to do is to take Deutsch classes and to improve on it. As an EU resident, you have the opportunity to stay here longer than I do, without a visa. Apply to as many places as you can and just work yourself up, but if you really want to work here, you really need to adapt to the Swiss culture. The Swiss can speak many languages (and like any other country) however, they really appreciate when you try to learn their language. They won't judge you at all, they're quite nice actually

alles gueti!
Love the encouraging spirit!

Besides, it might actually be easier (or not?) to 1)find a Swiss partner -> 2)get work permit based on family reunification -> 3)find a job, want to try that route instead?
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Old 22.08.2015, 01:30
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

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it might actually be easier (or not?) to 1)find a Swiss partner -> 2)get work permit based on family reunification -> 3)find a job, want to try that route instead?
@oosoo cant believe you are encouraging marriage for benefits...

I have no authority in this topic since I came here the easy way(jus sanginis),
But you certainly have a nice preparation, and I notice the word "tourism" in its description, if you dream about CH for the purchasing power you have easier options given your circumstances, I have personally met people with a similar description, who studied here in Switzerland working as bartenders, so it's easy to tell it is an extremely competitive environment.

With your background you can go to less competitive places, and maybe even live a more interesting life.

I know a German guy, who went to the carribean as a cook, then became chef, then he became , FnB(food n beverage), then he became a manager, all of that happened in a 10 years period, you have a much better background than he did.

Now I'm not saying you have to go to the Caribbean , but take a look at Greece or spain(EU touristic destinations), or you can always go to Asia, but i would recommend south America, because you get to learn a useful language jn your profession which is spanish and they are really nice to foreign people.
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Old 22.08.2015, 09:07
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

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@oosoo cant believe you are encouraging marriage for benefits....
and I can't believe you take jokes so seriously
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Old 22.08.2015, 19:31
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

I am from Macedonia( got a bulgarian passport too) and i started off as an au-pair with an L permit. Once i found a full-time job i applied for a B permit and got it straight away. The only thing my employer had to do was confirm that the contract is valid. They were not asked to prove that there is nobody in the EU that could do the job they gave me.
So i guess the key is to find a job and do not worry about the permit that much, once you have somebody who would give you a job, you will get a permit without any struggle. Regardless of what people may say.
Maybe you can start with a seasonal job, like grapes picking, i know it might not be an ideal job, but that will get you an L permit, and that would be a good way to start climbing up the ladder.

Good luck
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Old 22.08.2015, 20:06
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

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I am from Macedonia( got a bulgarian passport too) and i started off as an au-pair with an L permit. Once i found a full-time job i applied for a B permit and got it straight away. The only thing my employer had to do was confirm that the contract is valid. They were not asked to prove that there is nobody in the EU that could do the job they gave me.
So i guess the key is to find a job and do not worry about the permit that much, once you have somebody who would give you a job, you will get a permit without any struggle. Regardless of what people may say.
Maybe you can start with a seasonal job, like grapes picking, i know it might not be an ideal job, but that will get you an L permit, and that would be a good way to start climbing up the ladder.

Good luck

They wouldn't because Bulgaria is part of the EU Free Movement Agreement though there are some restrictions here in Switzerland until May next year.

Croatia is a totally different scenario - not part of the Free Movement Agreement as the treaty between Croatia and Switzerland on this was never signed due to the vote to curb EU immigration and therefore Croatia is still considered a 3rd State country by Switzerland and so the non-EU hiring rules apply. Without being highly qualified/skilled with several years to back it up there's no chance of getting a permit. Believe me, employers aren't going to spend a fortune and waste their time applying for a permit for a non-EU grape picker.
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Old 22.08.2015, 20:33
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They wouldn't because Bulgaria is part of the EU Free Movement Agreement though there are some restrictions here in Switzerland until May next year.
Croatia is a totally different scenario - not part of the Free Movement Agreement as the treaty between Croatia and Switzerland on this was never signed due to the vote to curb EU immigration and therefore Croatia is still considered a 3rd State country by Switzerland and so the non-EU hiring rules apply. Without being highly qualified/skilled with several years to back it up there's no chance of getting a permit. Believe me, employers aren't going to spend a fortune and waste their time applying for a permit for a non-EU grape picker.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Medea Fleecestealer;2437794]
They wouldn't because Bulgaria is part of the EU Free Movement Agreement though there are some restrictions here in Switzerland until May next year.

And by the way, these "some restrictions" you have mentined are exactly like the ones for Croatia: The employer has to prove that there is nobody from CH or the EU(excluding Bulgaria and Romania) who is qualified or interested in taking the job.

And yes, they would bother to take grape pickers because there are loads of exceptions when it comes to agricultural jobs which makes it easier for the employer, and plus, not many people from the EU or CH are keen on picking grapes.

Last edited by 3Wishes; 23.08.2015 at 00:06. Reason: merging consecutive replies, fixed quoting
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Old 22.08.2015, 22:20
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

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They wouldn't because Bulgaria is part of the EU Free Movement Agreement though there are some restrictions here in Switzerland until May next year.
And by the way, these "some restrictions" you have mentined are exactly like the ones for Croatia: The employer has to prove that there is nobody from CH or the EU(excluding Bulgaria and Romania) who is qualified or interested in taking the job.

And yes, they would bother to take grape pickers because there are loads of exceptions when it comes to agricultural jobs which makes it easier for the employer, and plus, not many people from the EU or CH are keen on picking grapes.
Bulgarians/Romanians can move here without having to have a job first and can also be self-employed, neither of which applies to Croatians. Hence probably easier to hire Bulgarians/Romanians to pick grapes than trying to get permits for Croatians to do it.

Last edited by 3Wishes; 23.08.2015 at 00:06. Reason: fixed quoting, I think
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Old 22.08.2015, 22:56
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

Croatians can move here without having to have jobs as well.

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Bulgarians/Romanians can move here without having to have a job first and can also be self-employed, neither of which applies to Croatians. Hence probably easier to hire Bulgarians/Romanians to pick grapes than trying to get permits for Croatians to do it.

Last edited by 3Wishes; 23.08.2015 at 00:07. Reason: fixed quoting
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Old 23.08.2015, 10:13
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

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Croatians can move here without having to have jobs as well.
Another . No, they cannot. The Free Movement Agreement does not apply to them here in Switzerland because the protocol between Croatia and Switzerland was never signed due to the vote to curb EU immigration. Please read and educate yourself.

https://www.bfm.admin.ch/dam/data/bf...ts/fs-hr-e.pdf

Other countries in the EU yes, Switzerland no.

Croatians must have either a job offer which has been approved by the Swiss authorities or be independently wealthy enough not to have to work at all - just like any other non-EU national does. This would also have applied to you btw if you hadn't had a Bulgarian passport. As a Macedonian only you'd be a non-EU national subject to the same rules.
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Old 23.08.2015, 10:38
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

A benefit for Croatians is that they have their own quotas (50 one-year B permits and 450 L permits) and mustn't compete with other "third-countries" for quotas. Other than that, the criteria are the same as for third-country citizens.
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Old 23.08.2015, 12:56
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

Please Medea Fleecestealer, do not roll your eyes that often, you will make yourself dizzy.
I see you have "educated" yourself by scrolling down pages on the internet. But i think that milanndo can do that himself, internet is available in his country too you know. I think what he needs is to hear the experience of people in a similar situation. And given the fact that you are neither Croatian nor a citizen of any other Eastern European country I am quite sure you are very far from being in a similar situation, therefore no experience you can share.
Anyway, my point: it is not always as difficult as it may be presented on the internet. If there is an employer who wants you, and if the permits have not been given out already, you will get a permit. Just keep looking.
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Old 23.08.2015, 13:16
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

Wasn't it the great Croatian-Mexican writer, Porfirio Díaz Tito, who once said: "Pobre de Croacia tan lejos de Dios y tan cerca de la Suiza" (Poor Croatia, so far from God but so close to Switzerland).
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Old 23.08.2015, 13:32
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

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Please Medea Fleecestealer, do not roll your eyes that often, you will make yourself dizzy.
I see you have "educated" yourself by scrolling down pages on the internet. But i think that milanndo can do that himself, internet is available in his country too you know. I think what he needs is to hear the experience of people in a similar situation. And given the fact that you are neither Croatian nor a citizen of any other Eastern European country I am quite sure you are very far from being in a similar situation, therefore no experience you can share.
Anyway, my point: it is not always as difficult as it may be presented on the internet. If there is an employer who wants you, and if the permits have not been given out already, you will get a permit. Just keep looking.
Perhaps he does, but your experience entering as an EU national is even less relevant than mine. At least I did enter as a non-EU national, though as an American not an East European. So I know that, should he be lucky enough to find an employer and be granted a permit, he'll also need to apply for a Type D visa at the Swiss embassy in Croatia so he can enter Switzerland long term legally. Another requirement for non-EU nationals.

And yes, I did/do scroll down the pages of the internet, shame you didn't see fit to do the same.

If you want to give him some personal experience of getting a job here, leave Switzerland on your Bulgarian passport and then try applying for jobs using your Macedonian one. I'd be interested in how easy you find it then.

Last edited by Medea Fleecestealer; 23.08.2015 at 13:43.
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Old 23.08.2015, 13:53
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

milanndo, my advice would be to do as a previous poster suggested: get some experience elsewhere, learn more languages (if you want to work in Switzerland, you will have to; most Swiss who work in tourism speak at least two of their languages + very good English), and once you have those prerequisites, then you'll be in a much better position to move here.

I agree with what medea said. I know it can sound harsh, but it's better to educate people just starting their search than having them rashly decide to abandon their previous plans for a pipe dream of living in Switzerland.
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Old 23.08.2015, 13:55
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Re: Working and living in Switzerland

You seem to not be grasping the fact that Bulgaria and Romania do face the same obstacles. These two countries do not get the same treatment as the rest of the EU. So saying that i entered the country as an EU national with all the rights granted is far from the truth. So please, you do not have to pretend to know more about my circumstances.
Anyway i think i made my point clear in the previous post, it is not always as hard as it may be shown on the internet. If you have something to say against that, be my guest, if not, then just drop it, i give it to you, you are the queen of the internet.
I am not going to feel bad for sharing my experience which by the way is relevant because my position is very much similar to the position a croatian citizen would be in.
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