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Old 22.12.2015, 18:00
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Re: Salaries sinking?

Agree with most posts here that the situation is incredibly uncertain. It used to be the talk that well qualified BAs for example would always be needed on-shore (CH), but oh boy do you feel "that" pressure nowadays in the cost-cutting finance industry (especially, as also mentioned, when the magic 5 starts to appear on your birthday cards).

I personally try to rationalise constantly that I'm good and qualified at what I do, work damned hard and bring great experience when ranked against other potential candidates. And many of my off-shore / out-sourced colleagues are really good (usually young and lacking in experience, but really good).

And I see daily what my daughter is studying at the Uni ZH in Business Information / WirtschaftInformatik - the standard is unbelievably high.

No doubt that experience plus qualifications tops all, but many days it really feels like going to work is like pure sh.t.
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Old 22.12.2015, 18:50
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Re: Salaries sinking?

For those that understand German - this also just appeared.

http://www.20min.ch/finance/news/sto...sche--24507832
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Old 22.12.2015, 18:59
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Re: Salaries sinking?

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Agree with most posts here that the situation is incredibly uncertain.
That's the moment you realize that you are too long in Switzerland - compared to the rest of the world is working in Switzerland anything but uncertain. Getting older comes with the same issues around the globe, I found in fact that in Switzerland age and experience is comparatively respected... so much so that they still manage to make employers pay more for hiring older employees! In any other country would that result in a lot of unemployed people in their 50s... not exactly the case here, is it?
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  #64  
Old 22.12.2015, 20:23
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Re: Salaries sinking?

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What housing market? As long as I've been here, buying a house as an investment has been usually thought of as a bad idea.
So, this would not be a good time to purchase a house/ apartment, then? I already took the leap and several of our friends (long-term expats from India) are now looking to buy property here...

It is a very difficult decision for Indian expats (well, buying property is a difficult decision for everyone). A luxury house/ appt. in a gated community in Delhi/ Gurgaon would cost us about CHF 350k, so its a much more viable monetary option. But unsure of the long-term prospects in India and ignorant of the long-term prospects in Switzerland :-)
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Old 23.12.2015, 13:22
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Re: Salaries sinking?

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So, this would not be a good time to purchase a house/ apartment, then? I already took the leap and several of our friends (long-term expats from India) are now looking to buy property here...

It is a very difficult decision for Indian expats (well, buying property is a difficult decision for everyone). A luxury house/ appt. in a gated community in Delhi/ Gurgaon would cost us about CHF 350k, so its a much more viable monetary option. But unsure of the long-term prospects in India and ignorant of the long-term prospects in Switzerland :-)
buy to let is a big market in france and the UK, it seems much less common in switzerland but some do make it work for them, I had no idea the prices where so high in India to be honest That is more than Texas or Florida in the USA
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Old 23.12.2015, 13:24
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Re: Salaries sinking?

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buy to let is a big market in france and the UK, it seems much less common in switzerland but some do make it work for them, I had no idea the prices where so high in India to be honest That is more than Texas or Florida in the USA
Since most of the Swiss rent, buy to let must be bigger in CH than in the UK.
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Old 23.12.2015, 13:41
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Re: Salaries sinking?

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Since most of the Swiss rent, buy to let must be bigger in CH than in the UK.
The person I spoke to about mortgages said it wasn't the same as the UK for investment, so I am not an expert. Something about taxes he said. I'm looking to buy and trying to figure out the best place myself.
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Old 23.12.2015, 13:51
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Re: Salaries sinking?

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Since most of the Swiss rent, buy to let must be bigger in CH than in the UK.
I am not sure myself, but the impression I get is that a lot of flats are owned by agencies like WinCasa already. In which case not many so called buy-to-let properties actually go on sale.

Last edited by JoMiFa; 23.12.2015 at 14:05.
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Old 23.12.2015, 14:17
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Re: Salaries sinking?

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But unsure of the long-term prospects in India and ignorant of the long-term prospects in Switzerland :-)
If finances are no problem, that is, if the house is not an investment where return is a primary concern, then the long term outlook in Switzerland should be less of an issue.

In that case, the question is how much will you save vs rent, and what is the opportunity cost of tying up your money.

If finances are something of a stretch, if you need a safe return, if your permission to stay is uncertain, then perhaps think twice.

I've said this on other threads, but despite the fact that after ca. 15 years we will (hopefully) sell flat or (possibly) at a loss, we saved a boatload over renting. As we had few other investment options in Switzerland (blue passport) we had no real opportunity costs either. If not a great financial step, purchasing was at least not a bad one.

The house is a ball-and-chain, though. The sheer hassle of getting rid of it at a time when our focus had to be elsewhere has kept us in it, although we should have moved ages ago. To me this is the more significant caution about buying into the illiquid Swiss market, especially if your future here is uncertain.

But getting back to salary trends... It might be wise to factor some caution into affordability calculations.

Good luck with your decision.
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Old 23.12.2015, 14:26
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Re: Salaries sinking?

Some are owned by pension. Funds, that's also true in the UK. True there are probably less accidental landlords who could not sell for the price they wanted .

It's going to be funny to watch many go bankrupt in the UK due to tax changes, they won't be able to pay the cgt bill after the mortgage is paid off & may have an income tax bill higher than net rent.
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Old 23.12.2015, 21:22
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Re: Salaries sinking?

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buy to let is a big market in france and the UK, it seems much less common in switzerland but some do make it work for them, I had no idea the prices where so high in India to be honest That is more than Texas or Florida in the USA
The cost of property is ridiculously high in Delhi, Mumbai, Hyderabad, and Bangalore. Due to the burgeoning population and urbanization, and increasing affluence of the urban populace, urban housing is a premium market.

However, if we do decide to purchase property in India, we won't be reaching for the high-end gated community ones What I meant, and perhaps didn't explain clearly, is that based on the 1 CHF = 67 INR conversion rate, CHF 350k will get us a much more luxurious property in India than it would in Switzerland. But when buying property for the long term, just the quality of the building plays such a small part in the decision.
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Old 23.12.2015, 21:30
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Re: Salaries sinking?

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The cost of property is ridiculously high in Delhi, Mumbai, Hyderabad, and Bangalore. Due to the burgeoning population and urbanization, and increasing affluence of the urban populace, urban housing is a premium market.

However, if we do decide to purchase property in India, we won't be reaching for the high-end gated community ones What I meant, and perhaps didn't explain clearly, is that based on the 1 CHF = 67 INR conversion rate, CHF 350k will get us a much more luxurious property in India than it would in Switzerland. But when buying property for the long term, just the quality of the building plays such a small part in the decision.
all depends where you want to live, cheap/bigger/better doesn't matter if it's somewhere you don't want to be!
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Old 26.12.2015, 13:27
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Re: Salaries sinking?

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Hi all,

My experience: IT job, Master degree in Computer Science, EU citizen, same employer for the last 5 years, very little German language.

Considering current salary vs first salary, I'm at a total of 35% salary increase (I had also a promotion). Well over 120k.

I would say it depends on the job type...
And there we have it. Lots of posts about this and that and up pops this post that basicaly blows everything else away.

Loyalty and hard work creates oppertunity. Good employees get calls from head hunters all the time. Usualy a few each week.

If you need to compete against hundreds of other people then re-think your work ethic and consider loyalty over jumping ship like a rat at the first sign of trouble.
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Old 26.12.2015, 14:04
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Re: Salaries sinking?

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And there we have it. Lots of posts about this and that and up pops this post that basicaly blows everything else away.

Loyalty and hard work creates oppertunity. Good employees get calls from head hunters all the time. Usualy a few each week.

If you need to compete against hundreds of other people then re-think your work ethic and consider loyalty over jumping ship like a rat at the first sign of trouble.

I would certainly expect this kind of increase (or more) after 5 years from entry level (following IT masters).

Also agree that people with skill sets needed at particular times (especially in IT projects) get called regularly from agencies.

Not jumping ship at first signs of trouble also good advice. However loyalty and staying at the same company for longer periods of time is very dependent on career path, progression, age and industry.

The declining salary topic I believe that is more the issue is for those with 15+ years of experience, who have achieved the higher end of the relevant salary scale since the past few years, and now find that it is either stagnating or decreasing (through various means).

IT being a cost object rather than a profit centre is certainly showing signs of this trend.
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