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  #21  
Old 05.01.2007, 20:31
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Re: London or Zurich

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the job in zurich is at the headquarters while that of london is a branch office to a company whose headquarters are in germany
I would base part of the decision, from my very limited point of view, on whether or not you can speak German or at least have a minimum base from which you could start to learn it. Of course speaking German does not mean that you can understand the Swiss (Germans enroll in Swiss German courses here in droves), but at least you'd have a start. This is point of view that excludes career opportunities and everything else, so don't put too much weight on it. However, I think it is still important, especially as it was already mentioned earlier in the thread in terms of interaction with the Swiss at the workplace outside of official business. Swiss German is *basically* another language: so you'll be confronted with one written and one spoken "language" (at least the very least outside the office).
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  #22  
Old 05.01.2007, 20:33
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Re: London or Zurich

easy answer for me: Zurich hands down.

We moved to London in 2005 from the US. Later we moved out to a small town about an hour by train from London. Basically I am happy to say that the hell that was the UK for us has ended and I am a happy, happy, happy person. We moved to ZH this fall (husband in Oct. and the toddler, dogs and I in late Nov.)

Financially we are waaaaay better off here because my husband is much better compensated for what he does than he was in London (IT). We find the cost of living to be very reasonable compared to the UK and for us, we've gone from trying to make ends meet every month to being in shock at how much money is still in the bank every month. And we found accomodation to be easy to find here but maybe as a family we weren't looking in the same places that are reportedly so difficult to find a place, or our criteria was different or something. Not sure, but we found plenty of options and got a place lined up very quickly.

As a bit of context for my remarks: I'm American, husband is Brit/Swiss and raised in Switzerland. I speak no German yet, other than to say things like "Do you speak English", "I speak only a little German", and "I'd like the 35 liter trash sacks please." I've found people to be much friendlier and more helpful to me as a foreigner here than I did in the UK (intending no offence to the British contingent of the board, just sharing my personal experiences) and I've found it easy to get by with English and my limited German but then again, I am not working so am mostly interacting with the world as a customer etc.

As for the comments earlier in the thread about high pay for IT jobs in London, it may depend on what sector of IT you are in as my husband found the pay there (in relation to cost of living) to be terrible vs. the US or Switzerland.
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  #23  
Old 05.01.2007, 22:08
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Re: London or Zurich

I think purchasing power is a fair bit higher in Zurich and it also has better quality overall. Easy decision if these are the only two factors.

Entertainment is of course better in London but then how many clubs does one need ? 20 ? 45? 400?. If it is 40 then Zurich has them.

Social life: Again London wins, especially if one is here with a non-local partner or single. Far more difficult to feel part of the scene without language skills. Defn of local: Someone who has been here for several years (independent of nationality). But this can be overcome up to 49% by learning the language.

Career opportunities: Again London wins and this time easily, due to the more vibrant and open-minded business climate and no language barriers. This is a very very subjective factor and depends on the industry one works in and long term goals. What I see here in Zurich and Switz is that they mostly need specialists in IT or related areas. I hardly see any senior management openings and the chances of getting them are not too high. I guess if one is an IT specialist, it does not really matter to these folks and one can compare.

As one can see from the above (5 factors), career opportunities (and I mean jobs) would favor London while quality, purchasing power point to Zurich. Social life and entertainment are better in London but it really depends on whether you need 100 clubs and 100 contacts. If not, the premium London enjoys in these two areas may not swing the pendulum towards it.

This is of course assuming one can swing permits easily in both places. If one has a work permit in only one of the two (non EU folks), then it is better to look where one has the right to work for the most part and throw resumes at the other.
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  #24  
Old 05.01.2007, 22:20
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Re: London or Zurich

If you can’t speak German, then stick to London. The worst part of me living in the German speaking world was missing on the conversations around me, I could not properly hear what’s happening ( hence missed on learning), could not properly tell what I think ( and hence missed on getting noticed enough!)...for a communicative extrovert like me, it was like someone tied me down...life is good, transport is good and all that damn but how will you feel in this social set up with a foreign language and a slightly xenophobic legacy is a big question to ponder upon...if given a choice now to do all again, I WILL go to London or to any English speaking place.

and yeah one can/should learn German but then not everybody ends up learning it..

Last edited by Rahul; 05.01.2007 at 23:50.
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  #25  
Old 05.01.2007, 22:50
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Re: London or Zurich

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the job in zurich is at the headquarters while that of london is a branch office to a company whose headquarters are in germany
Being at the HQ will enable you to network and get noticed where it really counts. Not doubt you will get chances there simply because you are on the spot. So I'd say Zurich it is then.....
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  #26  
Old 10.01.2007, 15:05
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Re: London or Zurich

Of course Zurich. London is completely shit.
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  #27  
Old 10.01.2007, 15:25
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Re: London or Zurich

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Of course Zurich. London is completely shit.
There's nothing quite like a well presented argument, is there?
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  #28  
Old 10.01.2007, 16:28
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Re: London or Zurich

Well I have a great big long list with various arguments why London is shit but I don't want to spend all day writing them here. Just a few here:
Salaries are low compared to the cost of living,
Transportation is crap,
Impossible to live near work due to high prices in accomodation in the centre,
Congestion charge and shit like that,
Everyone in London (shops etc) are foreigners,
High crime rate,
RIDICILOUSLY HIGH INCOME TAX,
Too much typicality (you might as well be a robot),

etc.......etc...........etc.................etc
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  #29  
Old 10.01.2007, 17:14
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Re: London or Zurich

London is the most vibrant and exciting city in the world. It has a few problems, transport being the obvious one, but it if you want life in any kind of fast lane, then its the place to be.
dave

Quote:
Well I have a great big long list with various arguments why London is shit but I don't want to spend all day writing them here. Just a few here:
Salaries are low compared to the cost of living,
Transportation is crap,
Impossible to live near work due to high prices in accomodation in the centre,
Congestion charge and shit like that,
Everyone in London (shops etc) are foreigners,
High crime rate,
RIDICILOUSLY HIGH INCOME TAX,
Too much typicality (you might as well be a robot),

etc.......etc...........etc.................etc
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  #30  
Old 10.01.2007, 17:19
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Re: London or Zurich

The majority of your grumbles are no surprise, but I am amazed by this. I am assuming this typicalitificationism you are referring to is lack of individuality ? Then you have it completely wrong. Walk down any street in London and you will find no two people dressed or looking the same. It is really the opposite end of the spectrum to the majority of Switzerland in that terms of conformity.
dave

Quote:
Too much typicality (you might as well be a robot)
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  #31  
Old 10.01.2007, 17:28
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Re: London or Zurich

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The majority of your grumbles are no surprise, but I am amazed by this. I am assuming this typicalitificationism you are referring to is lack of individuality ? Then you have it completely wrong. Walk down any street in London and you will find no two people dressed or looking the same. It is really the opposite end of the spectrum to the majority of Switzerland in that terms of conformity.
You took the words out of my mouth. In Switzerland, it is unacceptable by society in general to look a bit different, be it in physical appearance or in dress (think about all the staring that goes on!)
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  #32  
Old 10.01.2007, 17:30
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Re: London or Zurich

I would second this. An overseas posting is a good step in your career, but generally speaking , being close to the decision-makers at HQ is the best way to get ahead in a career, rather than being in a "distribution centre" or "overseas branch"
dave

Quote:
Being at the HQ will enable you to network and get noticed where it really counts. Not doubt you will get chances there simply because you are on the spot. So I'd say Zurich it is then.....
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  #33  
Old 11.01.2007, 01:16
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Re: London or Zurich

Personally I wouldent ask a question like this as these people know nothing about you and whichever route you choose, you should know its your choice. My advice would be, if you have a wife or kids or planning, definatly stay in London as the swiss state schools are ****!!! But if you are earning a good wage, there are some good private schools in Zurich, one of which i went to for a year to get my GCSE's before moving back to London to go to uni.... 4 years later, im still here in good old London, brilliant job great gf and friends. Anyway enough of the fairytale. DO WHAT YOU THINK IS BEST!!!
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  #34  
Old 11.01.2007, 05:49
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Re: London or Zurich

Yes ,"Do what you think is best" ,i like thease words that make me appreciate my choices ,every strong choice!I'm Chease student. You are a clever people who understand how to live,live yourself!I like you .
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  #35  
Old 11.01.2007, 08:28
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Re: London or Zurich

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<snip>My advice would be, if you have a wife or kids or planning, definatly stay in London as the swiss state schools are ****!!! But if you are earning a good wage, there are some good private schools in Zurich, one of which i went to for a year to get my GCSE's before moving back to London to go to uni.... 4 years later, im still here in good old London,</snip>
Obviously you have no knowledge of either the British of Swiss state school systems to make such an erroneous statement. If children don't speak the local language where they are they will be at a disadvantage wherever they are. Every parent in the UK would love to put their children through private education - including members of the Labour government - but the Swiss only send their children to a private school if there is a problem with the child...
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  #36  
Old 11.01.2007, 17:18
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Re: London or Zurich

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Well I have a great big long list with various arguments why London is shit but I don't want to spend all day writing them here. Just a few here:
Everyone in London (shops etc) are foreigners,

etc.......etc...........etc.................etc
Wow! Really, double wow!
So you like it here because there are less foreigners here? Hell, most on this forum are foreigners! You are one, for crying out loud (or atleast were one)!

(just so you know Zurich claims that ~22% of residents are foreigners, not foreign-born......and its is >20% in Switzerland overall!!!! Whereas the total of foreign-born, NOT foreigners, in London is less than 27%..... so your assessment vis-a-vis Switzerland is inaccurate).

However, would you care to elaborate on this? I suspect that given your lack of enthusiasm to elaborate on the etc. etc. but still choosing to put this point down must mean that you have something more to say about this.
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  #37  
Old 19.01.2007, 13:49
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Re: London or Zurich

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Obviously you have no knowledge of either the British of Swiss state school systems to make such an erroneous statement. If children don't speak the local language where they are they will be at a disadvantage wherever they are. Every parent in the UK would love to put their children through private education - including members of the Labour government - but the Swiss only send their children to a private school if there is a problem with the child...
Is that really true? that private schools, eg the well known ones in the alps, are only for problem children... never thought that. i know several people who went to one of them and im unaware that they were problem children... rather well off parents was the only common factor.
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  #38  
Old 19.01.2007, 13:56
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Re: London or Zurich

No they wouldn't. There are several generations of teachers in my family and they report the majority of parents support both the concept and practice of the state system. Regardless of whether you support the principle of government-funded education, it should be noted that just because you pay for something, it doesn't necessarily make it better.

dave

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Every parent in the UK would love to put their children through private education
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  #39  
Old 19.01.2007, 14:50
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Re: London or Zurich

Quote:
No they wouldn't. There are several generations of teachers in my family and they report the majority of parents support both the concept and practice of the state system. Regardless of whether you support the principle of government-funded education, it should be noted that just because you pay for something, it doesn't necessarily make it better.

dave
Er-hum - with the proviso that they could afford it 'every parent would love to put their children through private education'.

Come on! How come even Labour MPs and cabinet ministers put their kids into private education? Do you really think the local comprehensive is attractive to any parent who cares for their kids and wants them to get on in life?

Yes, there are excellent state schools - I myself went through the local Grammar school, but with all due respect to your teaching family, if they teach in the UK state system, they'd say that wouldn't they?
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  #40  
Old 19.01.2007, 15:06
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Re: London or Zurich

ZURICH for sure.

I too lived in London for a while and I can safely say Zurich is a much beter option.

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