Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Employment
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 27.11.2008, 22:53
leinbachj's Avatar
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: geneva
Posts: 9
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 3 Times in 1 Post
leinbachj has no particular reputation at present
am i getting ripped off - help

I've been in Geneva a few days and just began my new job. I am a teacher at an international school. I understood that I had a monthly salary. My contract says that I get paid for every month of the year. Being a teacher, I naturally have a break over the Christmas holidays. I was told today that since I began work late in the year, the Swiss government has a rule that says I would not get paid over the holiday. In other words I would only get paid for December for the days I work, and not for the the holiday part.

Is this legit, or am I getting ripped off?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 27.11.2008, 23:07
swisspea's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: From one side of lake Zurich to the other...
Posts: 3,427
Groaned at 10 Times in 7 Posts
Thanked 1,991 Times in 1,082 Posts
swisspea has a reputation beyond reputeswisspea has a reputation beyond reputeswisspea has a reputation beyond reputeswisspea has a reputation beyond reputeswisspea has a reputation beyond reputeswisspea has a reputation beyond repute
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

sounds weird to me - what does your contract say ?

Do the parents pay less school fees when there is less school ?

Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 27.11.2008, 23:20
leinbachj's Avatar
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: geneva
Posts: 9
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 3 Times in 1 Post
leinbachj has no particular reputation at present
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

The parents pay their fat tuition of 18,000 francs per year. I was told this was due to Swiss govt. rules. Is that true, or not?
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 27.11.2008, 23:27
tomcat's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Comfort, Texas
Posts: 2,275
Groaned at 51 Times in 35 Posts
Thanked 928 Times in 608 Posts
tomcat has a reputation beyond reputetomcat has a reputation beyond reputetomcat has a reputation beyond reputetomcat has a reputation beyond repute
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

Doesn't sound legit. Maybe a misunderstanding? Many Swiss get a 13th monthly salary around the holidays, maybe they meant you won't get that since you started late in the year? Just guessing ...
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 27.11.2008, 23:40
Swisstree's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: ZH/NI
Posts: 1,122
Groaned at 18 Times in 13 Posts
Thanked 928 Times in 474 Posts
Swisstree has a reputation beyond reputeSwisstree has a reputation beyond reputeSwisstree has a reputation beyond reputeSwisstree has a reputation beyond reputeSwisstree has a reputation beyond repute
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

It sounds very odd and if your contract says that you are to be paid monthly then it should be straight forward. A temp teacher is the only one I know off who gets paid for the school days and not the holidays but if you're contracted for the remaining year then you should be paid a monthly salary without deductions. Curiously, what on earth has the government to do with employment contracts for a private international school.. somethings not right. All of this, however, is speculation and I would take your contract to a lawyer specialising in employment law and get the correct advice.
BTW did they recruit you from overseas or are you locally employed?
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 28.11.2008, 05:46
leinbachj's Avatar
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: geneva
Posts: 9
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 3 Times in 1 Post
leinbachj has no particular reputation at present
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

I was hired from overseas. The govt should have nothing to do with a private school, as far as I know. Except, this is Switzerland and I don't know the rules. My employer flatly said that I wouldn't get paid for the Dec holidays because of a government rule which relates to my late arrival in the year. My contract simply states that I get a monthly salary, with nothing mentioned about holidays. I think I'm getting ripped off.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 28.11.2008, 06:48
swisspea's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: From one side of lake Zurich to the other...
Posts: 3,427
Groaned at 10 Times in 7 Posts
Thanked 1,991 Times in 1,082 Posts
swisspea has a reputation beyond reputeswisspea has a reputation beyond reputeswisspea has a reputation beyond reputeswisspea has a reputation beyond reputeswisspea has a reputation beyond reputeswisspea has a reputation beyond repute
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

I guess you will need to clarify with your employer.

I know in Australia we had 'Christmas leave-loading' which was an additional payment which was on top of the normal salary at Christmas time (similar to the 13th month salary) - and it was pro-rated so if you only worked part of the year you only got part of the Christmas bonus, but you still got your normal salary.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 28.11.2008, 06:52
AbFab's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Züri Oberland
Posts: 4,895
Groaned at 233 Times in 155 Posts
Thanked 4,608 Times in 1,769 Posts
AbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond repute
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

Why not ask your employers to show you this 'law' in writing/online? They must have this, if they are applying it.

Also ask them if your loss in motivation for teaching at their school is worth the money they are saving...
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 28.11.2008, 07:33
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: .
Posts: 355
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 164 Times in 90 Posts
alaind has earned some respectalaind has earned some respect
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

My understanding is that you earn around 2 days of paid vacation per month you've worked.

Depending for how long you've started and how many vacation days you need to take to cover the christmas break this might explain the issue.
In a company not having a mandatory christmas break you'd just go working and take whatever you have already accumulated.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 28.11.2008, 07:59
lucy_sg's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Zurich
Posts: 737
Groaned at 3 Times in 3 Posts
Thanked 329 Times in 193 Posts
lucy_sg has a reputation beyond reputelucy_sg has a reputation beyond reputelucy_sg has a reputation beyond reputelucy_sg has a reputation beyond repute
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

I know for a fact that the Migros school teachers are not paid during the summer/christimas vacation. They are paid a bit more during the rest of the year to compensate. What i don't know is whether this is a Migros school rule or a Swiss rule.

Does your contract refer to any Swiss regulation?

Not sure if you teach english, but you might want to contact these folks:

http://www.e-tas.ch/other/index.asp

or these

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/swissenglish/

Last edited by lucy_sg; 28.11.2008 at 08:03. Reason: typo
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 28.11.2008, 08:11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Wankdorf
Posts: 255
Groaned at 33 Times in 15 Posts
Thanked 124 Times in 60 Posts
ItchyTriggerFinger has made some interesting contributions
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

There is such a clause in the Swiss labour law that allows the employer not to pay its employee for their leave and for any Swiss public holidays which falls on a work day.

It depends on your employment contract. I know a few temp staff who also won't be getting paid during the Chrismas - New Year weekend.

Ask your employer.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 28.11.2008, 09:12
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Geneva
Posts: 5,111
Groaned at 107 Times in 94 Posts
Thanked 2,764 Times in 1,476 Posts
Shorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond reputeShorrick Mk2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

Quote:
View Post
There is such a clause in the Swiss labour law that allows the employer not to pay its employee for their leave and for any Swiss public holidays which falls on a work day.
Really? Care to point out exactly where that clause is?
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 28.11.2008, 09:33
Tilia's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zug
Posts: 2,046
Groaned at 58 Times in 31 Posts
Thanked 1,379 Times in 698 Posts
Tilia has a reputation beyond reputeTilia has a reputation beyond reputeTilia has a reputation beyond reputeTilia has a reputation beyond reputeTilia has a reputation beyond repute
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

As others have mentioned, the issue here is probably the holidays and not the salary. If you have to take holiday during certain periods of the year (not uncommon practice), then that would mean that you don't have enough holiday accrued for the Christmas holidays if you started late in the year. Thus, you don't get paid for the days you don't have to work but can't count as holiday. I'm sure it is all written in your employment contract in one form or another.

So it has nothing to do with a "gov rule" but rather with the labor- and contractual laws of Switzerland.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 28.11.2008, 10:17
ljm ljm is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Geneva
Posts: 767
Groaned at 7 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 372 Times in 218 Posts
ljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputation
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

The problem with private schools in Geneva is that there is no collective agreement which would clarify the application of Swiss labour law to the specific employment circumstances and additionally protect the employees.

Such an agreement exists, for example, to protect the employees of creches and other daycare institutions in Geneva and it specifies that teachers have the right to fully paid 7 weeks of holidays per year. One full year of service is counted if the employee started to work at the latest on 1 July of the year.

Even in the absense of such an agreement, general provisions of Swiss labour law apply, which means that, unless hired temporarily, you definitely have the right to 4 weeks of fully paid holidays during the year in addition to official holidays (up to a maximum of 9 days per year).

You can do several things: ask the school administration to show you the exact provisions of the law that justify their action; if you feel comfortable, ask some of your colleagues whether they have the same terms of contract; go to permanence juridique (http://permanence-juridique-geneve.ch/) with whatever information you find and your contract, and get legal advice or talk to a trade union, for example http://www.unia.ch/Home.1.0.html?&L=1 or http://www.sit-syndicat.ch/Sit-présente.htm).

General advice -- try to learn as much as possible about your rights -- although you may think that you will never get into contract-related disputes with your employer, it is better to be prepared. Remember that employees in Switzerland are generally well-protected.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank ljm for this useful post:
  #15  
Old 28.11.2008, 11:06
Tilia's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zug
Posts: 2,046
Groaned at 58 Times in 31 Posts
Thanked 1,379 Times in 698 Posts
Tilia has a reputation beyond reputeTilia has a reputation beyond reputeTilia has a reputation beyond reputeTilia has a reputation beyond reputeTilia has a reputation beyond repute
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

Which is of course pro rated if you start during the year.

If you start 15.11 and the school ends the 18.12 e.g, you would have to take 4 days unpaid in 2008 which is equivalent to approx. 1/5 of your monthly salary that you would get less for Dec.


Quote:
View Post

Even in the absense of such an agreement, general provisions of Swiss labour law apply, which means that, unless hired temporarily, you definitely have the right to 4 weeks of fully paid holidays during the year in addition to official holidays (up to a maximum of 9 days per year).
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 29.11.2008, 17:43
leinbachj's Avatar
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: geneva
Posts: 9
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 3 Times in 1 Post
leinbachj has no particular reputation at present
Re: am i getting ripped off - help

I checked back with my employer, and it only has to do with labor laws and accrued holiday. There had been a little language misunderstanding, and now it is ironed out. I'm expected to work from home a few days during the holidays to make up. No problem, no more. Happy holidays.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank leinbachj for this useful post:
Reply

Tags
contracts, employment conditions, rights at work


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Renting in Geneva - don't get ripped off Dan75 Housing in general 0 22.07.2008 10:57


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 11:32.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0