When you start work, do you start paying AHV straight away?
I would think so personally.

An employer has said that only permanent contracts have to pay AHV, and deductions can be delayed if the employee is on a temporary contract.

Surely this implies that temp workers (fruit pikcers, chalet maids, whoever) pay no social taxes at all...

Any thoughts please?

Yes, everybody has to pay it temporary or permanent, but it is not always the case that the employer will have to deduct it. Take for example someone that comes in to do some casual work for you. As long as they don't earn more than 2000 per year they can sign a piece of paper that says they will pay their own AHV (government pension) contributions.

gbn - you were probably wondering how these would be paid in the case where the employer doesn't deduct them. The answer is you'll pay them when you do your taxes. You'll declare all your sources of income, even those from temporary work [cough, splutter] at which point it will be clear that you owe some AHV contributions and you'll be billed for them.

Regarding that stupid grey AHV card which everybody tells you is super important - it's sat in my drawer for years and nobody has ever asked for the thing. They have asked for the number though.

Everytime I have changed jobs I have had to give the HR Manager this stupid grey card, and I also had to give it to the RAV when I became unemployed. I cannot believe this relic has not been superceded by modern technology.

Well I don't know if the technology is modern, but I suspect that the reality is that the card itself serves no purpose other than to be a place which contains the number. The fact that mine is blank and unused is a testament to that fact. However that won't stop people from asking for the card without ever stopping to ask themselves "why?". What if you lost it? What if you didn't have it with you, why must the card be seen? Surely if your name matches the number they have stored for you then everything is fine?

There are many such bits of paper in the Swiss system which don't seem to serve any useful purpose at all.

My favourite is the Schriftenempfangsschein (letter receiving certificate). The poor Swiss get burdended with this thing which they have to deposit with their community office whenever they move. When they move again they have to go ask for the bit of paper back, then they take it to the next community who keep it. If you lose it you have to pay for a new one, and if you become Swiss you suddenly get burdened with it. Thankfully foreigners don't have to worry about it. I've really tried to understand what purpose this piece of paper serves (other than to give the poor Swiss something else to worry about), but I've drawn up a blank. For a bit of entertainment on a rainy afternoon ask a Swiss to explain (or defend!) their Schriftenempfangsschein to you.

Sorry, I know that last bit was off topic, just trying to lighten up the very boring topic of AHV contributions...

Hi,
I agree, if you are a "SCHWARZARBEITER" nobody will deduct you nothing but at the end you will end without pension...
It's erverybodies own choice.
"Schriftenempfangsschein" for me is something to have you "under control". To know when you leave country or canton.

Hope that helps...
regards, medusa

Thanks all,

My original post was neither the full story nor about me... but I have my answer.
There was a contract, more than 2k per annum earned, and no AHV taken...

That's not strictly correct. There are many situations where people are self-employed or do temporary work for someone for less than 2,000 per year. That doesn't make them a "schwarzarbeiter" (a so called "black worker", or someone who works in the informal economy and doesn't declare tax).

To say you'll be without pension is also not correct. If the income is declared to the tax office (as it is supposed to be) then you'll be sent a bill so that your pension contributions match your taxable income.

As for being left without a pension, I'd argue that people who pay today will be left without a pension tomorrow anyway, but that's a discussion for another thread...

As for the "Schriftenempfangsschein" they know where you are anyway, because you have to register where you live in any case. The stupid piece of paper serves no purpose except to add to your stress if you lose it. Having a piece of paper sitting in a file in some government office adds absolutely no value when it's all stored in a computer anyway. The country can survive without foreigners having to mess around with it, so why subject the Swiss to it?