Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Finance/banking/taxation
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 22.05.2012, 21:18
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Geneva
Posts: 3
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
ck_geneva has no particular reputation at present
are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Hi,

I was brought to this forum by this post Geneva or not Geneva through a google search.I have the same question but it is still unanswered.
I am a consultant at the UN in Geneva and currently have a type "H" carte de legitimation. I need to know if I am subject to payment of income taxes/or any kind of tax in Switzerland. I researched a lot on the matter but could find nothing online, the UN HR did not seem to bother with my question so i called the swiss authorities but got even more confusing answers. The bureau de l'administration fiscal du canton de geneve, geneva's revenue service administration, said that i am exempted from taxes, when i asked them to give me an attestation stating this they told me to call the swiss mission saying they can issue it. But when i called there, the guy said that it does not matter if i am a UN consultant because as long as i have a type H carte de legitimation i should be paying taxes like any other resident. I turned to the UN again and found this document http://consultants.unctad.org/Docume...Conditions.pdf from which i understood that UN consultants are tax exempt ( paragragh 15. TAXATION).
Can someone point me in the right direction?
thanks
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 22.05.2012, 22:04
Sbrinz's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Murten - Morat
Posts: 10,961
Groaned at 542 Times in 342 Posts
Thanked 10,567 Times in 5,406 Posts
Sbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Ask this man, he works at UN in Geneva,

http://www.englishforum.ch/members/1412-grynch.html
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 22.05.2012, 22:08
Mag's Avatar
Mag Mag is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Fribourg
Posts: 500
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 452 Times in 228 Posts
Mag has an excellent reputationMag has an excellent reputationMag has an excellent reputationMag has an excellent reputation
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Most consultants working for the UN are not considered to be UN officials, and therefore do not benefit from UN staff privileges when it comes to taxation. From what I know (based on my experience of one UN org in Geneva), you do need to declare your taxes.

However, I can't help you much when it comes to how you go about it. I have a B permit - and since my assignment was relatively short, I was told I could just add my income to my husband's tax return. I've just looked up type "H" cartes de legitimation, and official documents state that it brings no privileges or immunities...

I think that there was a similar discussion on the Geneva Consultants LinkedIn group page. If you don't get the information you need here, you might be able to find it there. Good luck!
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Mag for this useful post:
  #4  
Old 22.05.2012, 22:35
miniMia's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: romandie
Posts: 8,848
Groaned at 85 Times in 76 Posts
Thanked 7,391 Times in 3,729 Posts
miniMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond repute
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Paragraph 15 says that the UN is exempt from taxes, not you. Paragraph 1 says you are not a UN employee.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 22.05.2012, 23:52
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Geneva
Posts: 3
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
ck_geneva has no particular reputation at present
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Quote:
View Post
Paragraph 15 says that the UN is exempt from taxes, not you. Paragraph 1 says you are not a UN employee.
paragraph 1 of the document mentions the contractor, so does paragraph 15 where it says
Quote:
In the event any governmental authority refuses to recognize the exemptions of the
United Nations from such taxes, restrictions, duties or charges, the Contractor shall immedi ately
consult with the United Nations to determine a mutually acceptable procedure.
.

Does the Swiss government refuse to recognize these exemptions?
regards
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 23.05.2012, 06:29
Corbets's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Zug, CH
Posts: 2,833
Groaned at 155 Times in 111 Posts
Thanked 5,373 Times in 1,835 Posts
Corbets has a reputation beyond reputeCorbets has a reputation beyond reputeCorbets has a reputation beyond reputeCorbets has a reputation beyond reputeCorbets has a reputation beyond reputeCorbets has a reputation beyond repute
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Quote:
View Post
paragraph 1 of the document mentions the contractor, so does paragraph 15 where it says
.

Does the Swiss government refuse to recognize these exemptions?
regards
Are you a contractor or a consultant?
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 23.05.2012, 09:30
tom tulpe's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Horgen
Posts: 1,192
Groaned at 23 Times in 20 Posts
Thanked 1,409 Times in 646 Posts
tom tulpe has a reputation beyond reputetom tulpe has a reputation beyond reputetom tulpe has a reputation beyond reputetom tulpe has a reputation beyond reputetom tulpe has a reputation beyond repute
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Quote:
View Post
paragraph 1 of the document mentions the contractor, so does paragraph 15 where it says
.

Does the Swiss government refuse to recognize these exemptions?
regards
No. But you are not the United Nations. You're a contractor (as per para 1).

Why don't you quote the rest of para 15 where it says that WRT taxation, you're on your own and it's none of UN's business?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 23.05.2012, 09:38
Sbrinz's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Murten - Morat
Posts: 10,961
Groaned at 542 Times in 342 Posts
Thanked 10,567 Times in 5,406 Posts
Sbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Tom, he is a "Consultant" and he is normally telling people what needs to be done, not being told what he needs to do.

Quite honestly I don't give a fig whether he pays taxes or not. He hasn't introduced himself, he has arrived here demanding expert tax advice and he can't read a document and understand it. He seems to lack any manners, I suggest you ignore him.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 23.05.2012, 10:27
tom tulpe's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Horgen
Posts: 1,192
Groaned at 23 Times in 20 Posts
Thanked 1,409 Times in 646 Posts
tom tulpe has a reputation beyond reputetom tulpe has a reputation beyond reputetom tulpe has a reputation beyond reputetom tulpe has a reputation beyond reputetom tulpe has a reputation beyond repute
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Quote:
View Post
Tom, he is a "Consultant" and
He is a "Contractor" (with a capital "C") for the purpose of the UN General Conditions.

Quote:
View Post
he is normally telling people what needs to be done, (...) I suggest you ignore him.
Heh
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 23.05.2012, 10:46
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Geneva
Posts: 3
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
ck_geneva has no particular reputation at present
Quote:
View Post
Tom, he is a "Consultant" and he is normally telling people what needs to be done, not being told what he needs to do.

Quite honestly I don't give a fig whether he pays taxes or not. He hasn't introduced himself, he has arrived here demanding expert tax advice and he can't read a document and understand it. He seems to lack any manners, I suggest you ignore him.
look i did not mean to be rude. I apologize if you felt i was. I am indeed asking for advice. the document i referenced is titled "GENERAL CONDITIONS OF CONTRACTS FOR THE SERVICES OF CONSULTANTS OR INDIVIDUAL CONTRACTORS". I am a consultant, not an individual contractor. Paragraph 15 talks about contractors in general, in the context of the document, the contractor can be a consultant or an individual contractor.please correct me if i am wrong. Anyway, it's just a document i found on the website, i don't know how far it dates back, i don't even know if the conditions it mentioned still apply.

Quote:
View Post
No. But you are not the United Nations. You're a contractor (as per para 1).

Why don't you quote the rest of para 15 where it says that WRT taxation, you're on your own and it's none of UN's business?
maybe i did not properly understand the paragraph. but i am more than happy to listen.thanks!

Last edited by 3Wishes; 10.12.2015 at 17:02. Reason: merging consecutive replies
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 23.05.2012, 13:34
miniMia's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: romandie
Posts: 8,848
Groaned at 85 Times in 76 Posts
Thanked 7,391 Times in 3,729 Posts
miniMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond repute
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Quote:
View Post
paragraph 1 of the document mentions the contractor, so does paragraph 15 where it says

Does the Swiss government refuse to recognize these exemptions?
regards
Paragraph 1 = Does mention the contractor. It says the contractor is not part of the UN.

Paragraph 15 = The UN does not have to pay taxes. You are not part of the UN.

They way I interpret it is for example, you bill the UN. Normally you have add VAT. But since the UN is exempt, you can't charge VAT. If the gov't comes back and insists to collect VAT from you, then they will help you work that out.

But let's hope Grynch will have a word.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank miniMia for this useful post:
  #12  
Old 23.05.2012, 13:55
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Neuchatel
Posts: 19,355
Groaned at 368 Times in 275 Posts
Thanked 22,366 Times in 10,062 Posts
Odile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond repute
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Quote:
View Post
look i did not mean to be rude. I apologize if you felt i was. I am indeed asking for advice. the document i referenced is titled "GENERAL CONDITIONS OF CONTRACTS FOR THE SERVICES OF CONSULTANTS OR INDIVIDUAL CONTRACTORS". I am a consultant, not an individual contractor. Paragraph 15 talks about contractors in general, in the context of the document, the contractor can be a consultant or an individual contractor.please correct me if i am wrong. Anyway, it's just a document i found on the website, i don't know how far it dates back, i don't even know if the conditions it mentioned still apply.

Welcome and all that. But I am always amazed that people ask this sort of question on an Internet Forum. Surely the best place to ask is with the admin/hr at your place of work- and make absolutely sure. When and if the tax office catches up with you, what will you say 'sorry, I was told on a Forum I didn't have to pay taxes'?. It won't work. So ask in the proper place, where they know what you do and how and when and the exact regulations.

Then come back for a friendly chat later. An introduction would be nice. Bienvenu en Suisse
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Odile for this useful post:
  #13  
Old 23.05.2012, 15:14
Mag's Avatar
Mag Mag is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Fribourg
Posts: 500
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Thanked 452 Times in 228 Posts
Mag has an excellent reputationMag has an excellent reputationMag has an excellent reputationMag has an excellent reputation
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Quote:
View Post
Surely the best place to ask is with the admin/hr at your place of work
In the OP's defence, I had also found it quite difficult to get any information regarding these matters from admin/HR. The problem is that they do not see it as their responsibility to provide income tax related information to consultants, even though I imagine that it is a recurrent issue.

That being said... @OP - MiniMia has explained the paragraphs you were asking about clearly. In addition, the fact that you have an "H" carte de legitimation reinforces the idea that you have to pay taxes.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 23.05.2012, 15:18
miniMia's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: romandie
Posts: 8,848
Groaned at 85 Times in 76 Posts
Thanked 7,391 Times in 3,729 Posts
miniMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond repute
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

And to be fair, she did get two different answers. My guess is the first "no tax" answer was a misunderstand that the OP was a UN employee. Plus some consultants may have tax liabilities to other countries, etc.

It's really up to the individual to figure out this stuff themselves with consultation with the local authorities. The problem is if you don't lay it all out to the authorities, they won't know how to answer 100% correctly.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 09.12.2015, 18:20
Newbie 1st class
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Geneva
Posts: 17
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Botnino has no particular reputation at present
Re: are UN consultants subject to income taxes in Switzerland?

Hi,
I know this was a long time ago but wondering what was the tax outcome of your situation?
Thanks!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
geneva, income tax, tax exemptions, un consultant




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Trading in Switzerland - Capital gains/income taxes? Wheat Hoarder Finance/banking/taxation 8 28.08.2012 01:54
Why do topics get moderated on the very subject they are trying to address ? breagh Forum support 159 21.02.2011 20:39
Paying Taxes Despite No Income AnjaB Finance/banking/taxation 21 26.01.2011 02:07
Californians with B permit: How are you handling your state income taxes? richardm Finance/banking/taxation 4 21.06.2009 15:49
Income Taxes bupuckster3 Finance/banking/taxation 4 17.10.2007 18:58


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 20:41.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0