Well, shit, honey....you know what they say about Florida, "There are two types of drivers; old people and their parents." Massholes still drive like bats outta hell out on 128 though I am happy to say that nobody has tried to enter my lane or run me off the road when passing like I experienced many times in Switzerland. I do miss the autobahn though.

Aren't you over 50?

Tom

LOL...I'm a cranky old cur, but I'm not quite that old just yet.

And drive like mentally deficient people (sorry, can't say the "r" word) in CT and NY at ANY speed!

Tom

Sorry, just going by your avatar!

Tom

I worked for 6 companies last year, TSR the Geneva part of Swiss TV paid ZER0, everybody else paid 6%. Which is the legal minimum for someone who works for 13 weeks or more, that's how TSR paid 0. For younger people it's less than 6% and it does not have to be on the salary covered by pillar 1

I'm close, so no apology needed. Actually, I think Joanna Lumley looks younger than I do though. Must be all the vodka.

Massholes!

I know in the UK, there just will be no basic state pension but it will be means tested.

In Switzerland, I think that it will also be the same even though the country is considerably wealthier per head.

I do not know where somebody was getting the 6% deduction figure.

I am under the impression that the deductions are as follows that an employer deducts and pays on an employee.

AVS 10.1%
Assicurazione contro la disoccupazione 2.2%
Spese amministrazione 1.5% of AVS
Disoccupazione l 2.0%
AF 1.75%
AFI 0.15%

The AVS being the Pension part.
I am assuming that inflation = interest rate (It used to though not anymore) then the AVS of 10% of their salary for 44 years would be:
chf 60,000 x 44 years x 10.1% => chf 266,640
80% of chf 60,000 => chf 48,000
chf 266,640 / 48,000 => 5.5 years of pension.

That is being optimistic because most Swiss are apprentices for the first 4 years of leaving school.

The figures do not stack up to me as they do not in the UK.

So what is actually going to happen?
Is the West going to end up third world or is the solution euthanasia?

Regarding average pensions: don't forget that the average person in CH probably doesn't start earning until 25, which is considerably older than in the UK. When I first moved here, I was 25 and got all sorts of "young person" discounts, akin to student discounts.

+1 - pensions have always been and will always be ponzi schemes. There is no denial about this, and this is why companies like SwissRe have been worrying about the ageing population for the past 10+ years.

Primarily family, and quite frankly, why the Hell would I think of going back to the UK. If I ever do, then clearly I'm ready for the looney bin.

Clearly that was in jest... being old and grumpy marks you out as an average old Swiss person... as is well recorded on EF.

Unlike the UK, in CH at least, the government has always pushed individuals to make savings, i.e. the 3/4 pillar system for retirement. Looking after your own investments and encouragement to save (in addition to state pension, private pension and private equity, http://thinkswiss.org/documents/soci...n%20System.pdf) means that most people should have enough to get by. This does, of course assume that the global economy can continue... which in itself is questionable.

I read the reverse, they were going to increase the basic state pension for everybody as it's cheaper than 'means testing'.

Monthly payslip, employer & employee both pay 6%

AVS pension is nothing like the figures you mention...........

A very inconvenient truth, that nobody really likes to speak out. If you work 'till 65 (or 67) - and don't die before 80-something, who is going to pay for this?
That is just not going to work.
We will have to move the retirement-age to a much later point in life. 75 would probably be more realistic.

here is the swiss state pension amounts, provided u have the full contribution periods.

more info here: http://www.123-pensionierung.ch/de/ahv/hoehe-ahv/

Without adjusting your assumptions, I would point out the following

1. The Swiss AVS is approx 18% funded from other sources
2. Investment income exceeds inflation. So the CHF 266k would be higher (as expressed in current 2012 francs)
3. There will be investment income on the principle even as it decreases once the pensioner starts receiving their benefit
4. There are high mortality decrements for pensioners.

Add up all of the above, and first the principle is probably 50% higher than you allowed for. Second, the average benefit is likely about 10 years (ie adjusted for mortality).

This is consistent with most pension plans. As a rule of thumb, the principle needed to fund your pension starting at age 65 is approx 9x the annual benefit.

But leaving all of the above aside, you should also remember that state pension plans are funded on a "pay as you go" basis. Thus, the state can increase contribution rates as needed to fund current outflows. As it happens, that is the source of the current historically high contribution rates for many state pensions throughout the world, because of the baby boomer demographic bulge which is resulting in higher state pension outflows over the next period.

Well I guess I've just been lucky then.. I've been working in chemicals, banking, insurance and electronics.. perhaps it depends on the industry as well.

Soylent Green is peeeepllllllee. Peeeeepppplllleeee!

That is if global warming (hey, when the midwest has temps over 100F for two weeks, aside from killing the massive corn crop, you just can't look away and think nothing is changing...) doesn't cull the weak and the unfit first. Pity Mr. Heston didn't live long enough to make the above exclamation in real life.