Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Finance/banking/taxation
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old 17.08.2016, 13:45
Corbets's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Zug, CH
Posts: 2,840
Groaned at 155 Times in 111 Posts
Thanked 5,382 Times in 1,839 Posts
Corbets has a reputation beyond reputeCorbets has a reputation beyond reputeCorbets has a reputation beyond reputeCorbets has a reputation beyond reputeCorbets has a reputation beyond reputeCorbets has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
Dear Alexander

This is Michael Loss, Intrum Justitia's Head of Communications - and here to help.

I do appreciate some of the other member's advice as to contact the original creditor, in your case the mobile phone company. But since it is obvious that there is need for action on our side as well, let's tackle that together.

In case I may assist you, please let me have a case number (to be found on the upper right of any IJ letter) and your contact details via my media relations e-mail address: medienstelle@intrum.com. I will get back to you right away and get things going from there.

Sound good?

Cheers, Michael
Love it. And now people learn that public postings on the Internet are... public, and can be seen by anyone. Some of our members posting on other topics might want to remember that.
Reply With Quote
The following 5 users would like to thank Corbets for this useful post:
  #22  
Old 17.08.2016, 13:46
Sbrinz's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Murten - Morat
Posts: 10,978
Groaned at 542 Times in 342 Posts
Thanked 10,579 Times in 5,411 Posts
Sbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

After being divorced for 10 years, IJ sent me a demand that I pay my ex-wife's dental bill. I sent them a copy of my divorce papers, & these were ignored. I received a repeated demand, plus more costs.

The dental assistant refused to connect me to the dentist. A friend called the dental surgery, was put through to the dentist, and after the explanation, he agreed to withdraw the claim.

Don't bother to communicate with IJ, they are rats. Only the original debtor can stop an IJ claim, or you pay them the full demand.

In Switzerland we have a legal debt collection service. IJ claim they get better results than the government's Betreibungsamt, they do, by threatening people.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank Sbrinz for this useful post:
  #23  
Old 17.08.2016, 14:21
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Zürich
Posts: 28
Groaned at 6 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 14 Times in 6 Posts
Intrum Justitia has no particular reputation at present
Quote:
View Post
So where where you when your Cretinous phone drones hounded me for 800 Chuff´s over a period of six months long AFTER I had paid the phone company and BEFORE the Frist? As I told you lot then, (have a look at the, registered, correspondence) the whole thing was an admitted error on the phone companies part due to the phone company sending bills to an old address after failing to understand that I no longer lived there and that I was long gone to Basel. Officially Abgemeldet, done and dusted! Thing is Michael everything was sorted out via registered mail, that you chose to ignore, long before your band of modern day highwaymen smelt blood in the water and let slip the dogs of war.
Was it just an overzealous Mitarbeiter or is it company policy to overcharge and screw people over and over again?
Knowing what I know now you SOB´s would not have seen a single Rappen.
Hej Slammer, real sorry I couldn't handle your request before. I simply was working with other companies back then.

I can assure you there is no company policy in place to do what you assume IJ does. It is but a legit business to handle outstanding debt from original creditors, trying to reimburse what is rightfully theirs. That service of course comes at a cost and the original creditor will not want to pay for that, since - if everything goes the right way - not paying a bill wasn't their mistake to begin with.

However that be the case, IJ makes mistakes as all other companies I know so far, do, too. Be that as it may - I am on board now and will look into every case that comes across my desk and have it solved. Period. In case I should not see your requests on here, please let me know via medienstelle@intrum.com with a case number and contact details. I will get back to you asap.

Cheers, Michael

Quote:
View Post
After being divorced for 10 years, IJ sent me a demand that I pay my ex-wife's dental bill. I sent them a copy of my divorce papers, & these were ignored. I received a repeated demand, plus more costs.

The dental assistant refused to connect me to the dentist. A friend called the dental surgery, was put through to the dentist, and after the explanation, he agreed to withdraw the claim.

Don't bother to communicate with IJ, they are rats. Only the original debtor can stop an IJ claim, or you pay them the full demand.

In Switzerland we have a legal debt collection service. IJ claim they get better results than the government's Betreibungsamt, they do, by threatening people.
Hej Sbrinz

Sorry things seemed to have turned out the way they did. Should your case still remain open and you want to me to have a look into it, let me know via medienstelle@intrum.com.

Cheers, Michael

Quote:
View Post
Love it. And now people learn that public postings on the Internet are... public, and can be seen by anyone. Some of our members posting on other topics might want to remember that.
Thx Corbets, much appreciated - doing what I can!

Cheers, Michael

Last edited by 3Wishes; 17.08.2016 at 23:08. Reason: merging consecutive replies
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Intrum Justitia for this useful post:
  #24  
Old 17.08.2016, 14:37
Treverus's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: SZ
Posts: 9,275
Groaned at 215 Times in 178 Posts
Thanked 16,492 Times in 6,021 Posts
Treverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
I can assure you there is no company policy in place to do what you assume IJ does. It is but a legit business to handle outstanding debt from original creditors, trying to reimburse what is rightfully theirs. That service of course comes at a cost and the original creditor will not want to pay for that, since - if everything goes the right way - not paying a bill wasn't their mistake to begin with.
Sure. And there are standards in Switzerland how high these expenses for the delayed payment and effort to send another letter should be. And that you need to proof that you indeed had those expenses. IJ adds a multiple of that to a huge amount of transactions per day hoping for people to be threatened by strongly worded pseudo-legal letters. You know as well as me that you never get the fees you demand from people who are not scared but go for the Betreibung.


Your company has over a decade of track record of trouble with the consumer watchdogs as you are working in a grey area which is far from legit. Here is an article by Beobachter on your once again illegal practices from two months ago: http://www.beobachter.ch/konsumenten...erzugsschaden/


I could not watch myself in the mirror in the morning if I'd work at an as unethical company as yours.
__________________
There is a special place in Hull reserved for the guy who invented autocorrect.
Reply With Quote
The following 7 users would like to thank Treverus for this useful post:
  #25  
Old 17.08.2016, 14:38
Phil_MCR's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 11,485
Groaned at 246 Times in 157 Posts
Thanked 13,338 Times in 5,682 Posts
Phil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
So where where you when your Cretinous phone drones hounded me for 800 Chuff´s over a period of six months long AFTER I had paid the phone company and BEFORE the Frist? As I told you lot then, (have a look at the, registered, correspondence) the whole thing was an admitted error on the phone companies part due to the phone company sending bills to an old address after failing to understand that I no longer lived there and that I was long gone to Basel. Officially Abgemeldet, done and dusted! Thing is Michael everything was sorted out via registered mail, that you chose to ignore, long before your band of modern day highwaymen smelt blood in the water and let slip the dogs of war.
Was it just an overzealous Mitarbeiter or is it company policy to overcharge and screw people over and over again?
Knowing what I know now you SOB´s would not have seen a single Rappen.
don't hold back, slammer. tell 'em how you REALLY feel!
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Phil_MCR for this useful post:
  #26  
Old 17.08.2016, 14:44
slammer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Lummerland
Posts: 3,666
Groaned at 79 Times in 58 Posts
Thanked 5,792 Times in 2,134 Posts
slammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
View Post
Hej Slammer, real sorry I couldn't handle your request before. I simply was working with other companies back then.

I can assure you there is no company policy in place to do what you assume IJ does. It is but a legit business to handle outstanding debt from original creditors, trying to reimburse what is rightfully theirs. That service of course comes at a cost and the original creditor will not want to pay for that, since - if everything goes the right way - not paying a bill wasn't their mistake to begin with.

However that be the case, IJ makes mistakes as all other companies I know so far, do, too. Be that as it may - I am on board now and will look into every case that comes across my desk and have it solved. Period. In case I should not see your requests on here, please let me know via medienstelle@intrum.com with a case number and contact details. I will get back to you asap.

Cheers, Michael
Ah but the bill was paid, however the phone company sent bills to my new address AND continued to send bills to the old one, totally unable to understand that I was deregistered and no longer lived there, why the heck should I pay two bills?
As to being a legit business, sorry but IJ is borderline at best, with totally immoral business practices and without scruple.

Quote:
View Post
don't hold back, slammer. tell 'em how you REALLY feel!
IJ´s lawyerbots would pull the plug on EF in minutes if I did.

Last edited by 3Wishes; 17.08.2016 at 23:10. Reason: merging consecutive replies
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank slammer for this useful post:
  #27  
Old 17.08.2016, 14:59
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Zürich
Posts: 28
Groaned at 6 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 14 Times in 6 Posts
Intrum Justitia has no particular reputation at present
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
Sure. And there are standards in Switzerland how high these expenses for the delayed payment and effort to send another letter should be. And that you need to proof that you indeed had those expenses. IJ adds a multiple of that to a huge amount of transactions per day hoping for people to be threatened by strongly worded pseudo-legal letters. You know as well as me that you never get the fees you demand from people who are not scared but go for the Betreibung.


Your company has over a decade of track record of trouble with the consumer watchdogs as you are working in a grey area which is far from legit. Here is an article by Beobachter on your once again illegal practices from two months ago: http://www.beobachter.ch/konsumenten...erzugsschaden/


I could not watch myself in the mirror in the morning if I'd work at an as unethical company as yours.
Hej Treverus

The so called Verzugsschaden is legit and has not need to be legally defined - for it is not our "damage", but the original creditor's. They merely demand it back through us from whoever caused the case to be placed with a debt collection company like ours.

I consider it may job to seek out the cases where we made honest mistakes and correct to the best of my knowledge. The business of debt collection is much needed one, as IJ alone refunded CHF 180m of outstanding debt last year to creditors. That money would not have been able to be brought back by the Betreibungsamt... plus, debtors would have a registry entry then, which creditors are less and less inclined to delete.

As for the case you mentionned - that will be pursued by another consumer protection organisation - Saldo. Why? Because SKS (Swiss Consumer Protection) issued a media statement, quoting our company had in fact agreed on not pursueing that case in specific and our cost in general any more. Which, as you might assume, is neither correct, nor had we ever received the actual case information to review it (it was denied to us), nor were we asked as to the fact of the case before or after the statement was issued. For that matter SKS & Beobachter will receive a so called "Red Card" by Saldo - one of their own - for unprofessional journalistic reporting on that case.

I do agree with you however that we need to eliminate our mistakes ourselves - and I am here to do just that.

Cheers, Michael
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Intrum Justitia for this useful post:
  #28  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:01
aSwissInTheUS's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zurich area
Posts: 5,062
Groaned at 40 Times in 38 Posts
Thanked 7,138 Times in 3,241 Posts
aSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
Hej Slammer, real sorry I couldn't handle your request before. I simply was working with other companies back then.

I can assure you there is no company policy in place to do what you assume IJ does. It is but a legit business to handle outstanding debt from original creditors, trying to reimburse what is rightfully theirs. That service of course comes at a cost and the original creditor will not want to pay for that, since - if everything goes the right way - not paying a bill wasn't their mistake to begin with.
In this country we have a simple and official way how to deal with debts and reclaim them: Betreibung/pursuit. Any company not going the formal route but going through IJ, which is just sending one "threatening" letter after the another is just simpely one thing: Super dodgy.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank aSwissInTheUS for this useful post:
  #29  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:03
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Zürich
Posts: 28
Groaned at 6 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 14 Times in 6 Posts
Intrum Justitia has no particular reputation at present
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
Ah but the bill was paid, however the phone company sent bills to my new address AND continued to send bills to the old one, totally unable to understand that I was deregistered and no longer lived there, why the heck should I pay two bills?
As to being a legit business, sorry but IJ is borderline at best, with totally immoral business practices and without scruple.
Hej Slammer

Double issueing of a phone bill is, as you will agree, the fault of the phone company.

If however I come across such cases, I want to, can and will solve them for anyone.

Plus, I said our kind of business is legit as to its necessity in today's economy. Payment behaviour worsens from one year to another and holding up contracts on both ends something that less and less people are inclined to do. Hence... debt collection. Some do it inhouse, some can't - because it simply is too expensive to build whole departments for that matter.

If i can help with a case, let me know.

Cheers, Michael
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:04
aSwissInTheUS's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zurich area
Posts: 5,062
Groaned at 40 Times in 38 Posts
Thanked 7,138 Times in 3,241 Posts
aSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
The business of debt collection is much needed one, as IJ alone refunded CHF 180m of outstanding debt last year to creditors. That money would not have been able to be brought back by the Betreibungsamt...
Because there was no legal reason for the debt? And the so called "debtors" were just threatened into paying a unjust claim?
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank aSwissInTheUS for this useful post:
  #31  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:07
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Zürich
Posts: 28
Groaned at 6 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 14 Times in 6 Posts
Intrum Justitia has no particular reputation at present
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
Because there was no legal reason for the debt? And the so called "debtors" were just threatened into paying a unjust claim?
Nope. I meant reimbursements of the original outstanding debt by the creditor. Money they were effectively owned.

As I said - if unjust, I'll find out for you. Let me know.
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:12
Downerbuzz's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: town not big enough for the both of us
Posts: 698
Groaned at 32 Times in 21 Posts
Thanked 677 Times in 310 Posts
Downerbuzz has a reputation beyond reputeDownerbuzz has a reputation beyond reputeDownerbuzz has a reputation beyond reputeDownerbuzz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

I seriously considered giving my first neg rep ever on one of those posts. I figure though that being a p.r. spokeperson for a company like that is punishment enough .
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Downerbuzz for this useful post:
  #33  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:12
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 6,153
Groaned at 309 Times in 249 Posts
Thanked 9,534 Times in 3,872 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Head of Communications & Reputation

wow, that's one hard sell! kudos for joining up and answering questions, did you know about there reputation before you joined the company? the interview must have been, ermmm, interesting lol
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:14
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Zürich
Posts: 28
Groaned at 6 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 14 Times in 6 Posts
Intrum Justitia has no particular reputation at present
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
I seriously considered giving my first neg rep ever on one of those posts. I figure though that being a p.r. spokeperson for a company like that is punishment enough .
If I take that as a "win" for now, I hope you won't punish me further...
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:19
aSwissInTheUS's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zurich area
Posts: 5,062
Groaned at 40 Times in 38 Posts
Thanked 7,138 Times in 3,241 Posts
aSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

There are two options when the Betreibung will fail: The person is totally broke and their is nothing to be pawned, the claim is unjust will be thrown out of court once Rechtsvorschlag was made. In the first case even IJ fails unless the debtor digs himself into a deeper pile of manure. In the later case... Q.E.D.

Additionally any Verzugsschaden above the highest interest rates defined in SR 221.214.111 is pure greed and usury.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank aSwissInTheUS for this useful post:
  #36  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:24
slammer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Lummerland
Posts: 3,666
Groaned at 79 Times in 58 Posts
Thanked 5,792 Times in 2,134 Posts
slammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
I seriously considered giving my first neg rep ever on one of those posts. I figure though that being a p.r. spokeperson for a company like that is punishment enough .
Either he kicked his bosses dog by accident or Michael has a martyr complex.
Having said that getting to rip into a real live IJ Mitarbeiter does give one a nice clean and fuzzy feeling.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank slammer for this useful post:
  #37  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:28
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Zürich
Posts: 28
Groaned at 6 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 14 Times in 6 Posts
Intrum Justitia has no particular reputation at present
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
There are two options when the Betreibung will fail: The person is totally broke and their is nothing to be pawned, the claim is unjust will be thrown out of court once Rechtsvorschlag was made. In the first case even IJ fails unless the debtor digs himself into a deeper pile of manure. In the later case... Q.E.D.

Additionally any Verzugsschaden above the highest interest rates defined in SR 221.214.111 is pure greed and usury.
The law on credit loans within the Swiss Code of Obligations (OR) does not apply, since an unpaid bill is not a credit. Neither the creditor, nor a debt collection company are in the business of credit loans. And the Verzugsschaden ist not a debt collection company's "damage", but the creditor's. Hence it does not originate from the debt collector, but the creditor because he is missing money. It's the legally described charge a creditor can ask from a debtor in order to reimburse him for the cost of getting his bill paid in OR 103/106 - for example the cost of his interal or external debt collection efforts.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:29
Treverus's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: SZ
Posts: 9,275
Groaned at 215 Times in 178 Posts
Thanked 16,492 Times in 6,021 Posts
Treverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
Either he kicked his bosses dog by accident or Michael has a martyr complex.
Having said that getting to rip into a real live IJ Mitarbeiter does give one a nice clean and fuzzy feeling.
Next thing we now and the PR responsible of DeVere will make a Q&A session here as well...
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Treverus for this useful post:
  #39  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:32
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Zürich
Posts: 28
Groaned at 6 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 14 Times in 6 Posts
Intrum Justitia has no particular reputation at present
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
Either he kicked his bosses dog by accident or Michael has a martyr complex.
Having said that getting to rip into a real live IJ Mitarbeiter does give one a nice clean and fuzzy feeling.
No dog, no martyr - just in the business of fluffy and cozy problem solving.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Intrum Justitia for this useful post:
  #40  
Old 17.08.2016, 15:34
slammer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Lummerland
Posts: 3,666
Groaned at 79 Times in 58 Posts
Thanked 5,792 Times in 2,134 Posts
slammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond reputeslammer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Unjust debt collection...help!

Quote:
View Post
Next thing we now and the PR responsible of DeVere will make a Q&A session here as well...
We just need a healthcare call-centre drone to join the fun and we can party.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank slammer for this useful post:
Reply

Tags
consumer rights, contract compliance, debt collection, intrum justitia, phone and internet issues, unjustified blames




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Debt Collection Agency Issues cken1774 Finance/banking/taxation 3 26.09.2015 12:54
threatening betriebungsamt [debt collection] action Morph Business & entrepreneur 5 19.11.2014 20:24
Debt Collection BOBG48 Finance/banking/taxation 7 14.04.2014 18:53
Debt collection agency in Switzerland? Jasskalsi Finance/banking/taxation 1 09.09.2009 03:41
Debt collection agency? ddejay Finance/banking/taxation 17 27.12.2007 23:42


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 21:20.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0