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  #101  
Old 09.06.2014, 13:41
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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Yes, they usually are. This one wasn't, though.
In the US anyway, there are Greek Orthodox and Byzantine Catholic. The Byzantine Catholic are somehow the same as Roman Catholic - at least, growing up, we could always go to Byzantine Catholic church instead of a regular old RC church.


And, if you want an example of some awesome Catholics, check out
"Nuns on the Bus"

http://www.networklobby.org/bus

I believe the Vatican censured these nuns, but they're not paying attention.
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  #102  
Old 09.06.2014, 14:43
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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Don't forget the Swiss jedi!



The official body for statistics in Switzerland does mention that there is a significant and marked shift towards oriental religious affiliation, mainly Buddhism and Hinduism, and also 'alternatives' like Paganism (Islam is separate). Jedi is not mentioned anywhere- but perhaps 'lOffice des Statistiques are totally mistaken here.
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  #103  
Old 09.06.2014, 15:08
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

Good to know that paganism is separate from Islam
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  #104  
Old 09.06.2014, 15:26
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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In the US anyway, there are Greek Orthodox and Byzantine Catholic. The Byzantine Catholic are somehow the same as Roman Catholic - at least, growing up, we could always go to Byzantine Catholic church instead of a regular old RC church.


And, if you want an example of some awesome Catholics, check out
"Nuns on the Bus"

http://www.networklobby.org/bus

I believe the Vatican censured these nuns, but they're not paying attention.
I did some googling. In the short version; some parts of the Greek Orthodox church decided to join with the Roman Catholic church and became the Byzantine Catholics.
Could be DB's friend went to one of these in Athens? The locals would describe it as RC but the Services are somewhat different from the West!

The longer version;
Beginning with the 15th century A. D. certain parts of the Orthodox Churches chose to separate from their Patriarch and reunite with the Pope of Rome therefore becoming the "Eastern Catholics" Churches. "Byzantine Catholics" are those Christians who followed the Byzantine style of spirituality and worship as practised in certain parts of the Middle East and Central Europe but who are now in full Communion the Pope of Rome.
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  #105  
Old 09.06.2014, 15:30
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

It was a Roman Catholic church.

If you like, imagine a Roman Catholic from Chicago attending a service in Manila, or a Roman Catholic from Lagos attending a service in Belfast, or a Roman Catholic from Munich attending a service in Colombo. I dunno... use your imagination!
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  #106  
Old 09.06.2014, 15:53
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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If you like, imagine a Roman Catholic from Chicago attending a service in Manila, or a Roman Catholic from Lagos attending a service in Belfast, or a Roman Catholic from Munich attending a service in Colombo. I dunno... use your imagination!
Catholic "services" all follow the exact same liturgy all over the world. The sermons even have to be about the same subject, week by week. There are minor differences in how the host is handed out. Other than that, mass is the same and a Roman Catholic from Lagos will have no problem following mass in Belfast, even if he or she doesn't speak English. The major difference between the world wide communities is their life circumstances, which may tempt them to distance themselves from church doctrines. Therin lies the reason that pope and curia have been unable to reform the church.
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  #107  
Old 09.06.2014, 15:55
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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Catholic "services" all follow the exact same liturgy all over the world. The sermons even have to be about the same subject, week by week. There are minor differences in how the host is handed out. Other than that, mass is the same all over the world. Therefore, a Roman Catholic from Lagos will have no problems following mass in Belfast, even if he or she doesn't speak Irish.
That's not what my English RC friend said. And anecdotal evidence counts on this thread - that's already been established.
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  #108  
Old 09.06.2014, 16:03
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

If I tell you that Lake Zurich is blue, will you ask for a reference ?
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  #109  
Old 09.06.2014, 16:03
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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Because regardless of what some chaps in funny hats in Italy say, an Irish nun remains an Irish nun, a banker from the Philippines remains a banker from the Philippines and an Argentine soup kitchen volunteer remains an Argentine soup kitchen volunteer.

The Roman church is simply too big to be considered a unified entity, except in the imaginations of some of its members.
I wonder if that argumentation would have worked for the leaders of UBS or CS when talking to the SEC/DOJ etc. Or maybe Starbucks and HMRC? Hmm.....
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  #110  
Old 09.06.2014, 16:06
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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That's not what my English RC friend said. And anecdotal evidence counts on this thread - that's already been established.

Well, i believe your friend. And while i know that the liturgy as practiced is pretty much the same around the world, i'm not so sure i could follow it in another country.
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  #111  
Old 09.06.2014, 16:28
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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I wonder if that argumentation would have worked for the leaders of UBS or CS when talking to the SEC/DOJ etc. Or maybe Starbucks and HMRC? Hmm.....
I'd answer you if I understood what any of that meant.
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  #112  
Old 09.06.2014, 16:35
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

Aren't you the experts.
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  #113  
Old 09.06.2014, 16:35
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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Catholic "services" all follow the exact same liturgy all over the world. The sermons even have to be about the same subject, week by week. There are minor differences in how the host is handed out. Other than that, mass is the same and a Roman Catholic from Lagos will have no problem following mass in Belfast, even if he or she doesn't speak English. The major difference between the world wide communities is their life circumstances, which may tempt them to distance themselves from church doctrines. Therin lies the reason that pope and curia have been unable to reform the church.
About "Catholic "services" all follow the exact same liturgy all over the world."

Look at this link!
http://www.catholic.com/quickquestio...atholic-church
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  #114  
Old 09.06.2014, 16:43
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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It was a Roman Catholic church.

If you like, imagine a Roman Catholic from Chicago attending a service in Manila, or a Roman Catholic from Lagos attending a service in Belfast, or a Roman Catholic from Munich attending a service in Colombo. I dunno... use your imagination!
About "It was a Roman Catholic church." But with a different liturgy . you know what they say "if it walks like a duck and it talks like a duck.........."!!
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  #115  
Old 09.06.2014, 16:47
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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Catholic "services" all follow the exact same liturgy all over the world. The sermons even have to be about the same subject, week by week. There are minor differences in how the host is handed out. Other than that, mass is the same and a Roman Catholic from Lagos will have no problem following mass in Belfast, even if he or she doesn't speak English. The major difference between the world wide communities is their life circumstances, which may tempt them to distance themselves from church doctrines. Therin lies the reason that pope and curia have been unable to reform the church.
Not quite, there are a number of officially permitted alternative rites (and also some unapproved ones that are tolerated nevertheless). The Eastern Rite of the Catholic Church is in the former category. Also in that category is the Anglican Rite, created by Pope Benedict for converts from High Church Anglicanism who wanted to continue using certain Anglican traditions and prayer forms. Some of the priests within that rite are even married.
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  #116  
Old 09.06.2014, 16:49
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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About "Catholic "services" all follow the exact same liturgy all over the world."

Look at this link!
http://www.catholic.com/quickquestio...atholic-church
The liturgy of the catholic mass was reformed in the 2nd Vatican council. Certain very conservative fraternities would have lost their right to exist with the new reforms. They were allowed to continue the old rites in order to keep them from seperating from the church. The official term is "recognized by and in full communion with the Bishop of Rome" as it says in your text.

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Not quite, there are a number of officially permitted alternative rites (and also some unapproved ones that are tolerated nevertheless).
Right. But for standard catholics (80%, 90%, whatever) mass is the same, 2nd council liturgy.
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  #117  
Old 09.06.2014, 16:49
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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I'd answer you if I understood what any of that meant.
If a company's employees break the law for a systemic, or percieved systemic, reason (or otherwise) in their daily business then you will often find the heads of said businesses being held personally accountable both by authorities and by shareholders. That's equally valid where there are way in excess of 50,000 employees. The big banks and American authorities being one case in point, Starbucks and the UK tax man another. It is perfectly valid to expect a CEO to lead a buiness in a way which ensures all employees act legally, and to implement a governance structure that is robust enough to control this and take necessary action where it does not happen.

Likewise if an army regularly rapes and pillages it is perfectly acceptable to hold the heads of that army toa ccount and expect them to lead their troops in such a way as to stop this, regardless of how many soldiers there are.

A similar analogy could be made for states - heads of state and national leaders should and are held accountable for things which are done by employees of that state.

Why should a religious institution be any different. Just because there are tens of thousands of clergy? Or because they work in all parts of the world? The same is true of at least two of the above anaolgies and I, personally, would expect at least the same level an quality of leadership from a pope and his cardinals as I would from the anglican synod or any other religious leadership. They are after all in the job of leading us all from a moral perspective.
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  #118  
Old 09.06.2014, 17:19
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

The liturgy and rites of the Roman Catholic Church are the same all over. However, the was it is delivered can be very different from country to country. Call it anecdotal, but I used to host a teacher from France in the UK regularly during our school to school exchange. She was a strictly practising Catholic, so the first time she was with us she asked me to take her to our local Catholic Church for mass on Sunday morning. She was amazed and amused- as she said that the Mass was just like it was in France 50 years ago. This Church was attended mainly by second/third generation Italians and many Polish newcomers. The next Sunday I took her to a second Catholic Church on the other side of town- and she said it was the same, again very much like Mass she knew as a youngster. And the next time she came, I took her to a third, in town this time- and she said it was also very 'old-fashioned'. She had mixed feelings about this, on the one hand she loved that yesteryear feel, on the other hand she felt it was good the Catholic Church she attends in France, and others she'd also attended, had modernised its approach.
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  #119  
Old 09.06.2014, 18:07
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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She had mixed feelings about this, on the one hand she loved that yesteryear feel, on the other hand she felt it was good the Catholic Church she attends in France, and others she'd also attended, had modernised its approach.
Have you considered that maybe the church that she is attending at home is the one that is different?
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  #120  
Old 09.06.2014, 18:23
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Re: I apologise [White English Scum]

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The great majority of Irish people have been very good at saying 'not in my name' for atrocities perpetrated by both sides, actually.
If you're referring to N. Ireland, it's still part of the UK, therefore British not Irish.
PS have you ever lived there for many years?
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