Hello,

When buying a house, has anyone had the seller drop out of a just before being due to sign at the notaire?

This has just happened to my wife and I, with no reason given - the deposit has been made for weeks, and all the documentation completed. The notaire has told us that he will not be charging us any fee's due to the "unhappy circumstances", despite doing a lot of work that is specific to us as buyers.

Over the weekend, I had noticed that the estate agent had re-advertised the property, which I thought of as being very odd but as we had agreed to sign at the notaire on Tuesday and had everything in place, did not think much more about it particularly as we had offered the full asking price, and the property was being re-advertised at the same price.

What makes it all the more annoying is the fact that it is a very unique house and my wife has already spent 1 month making detailed plans, and both of us have invested a lot of time and also paid for a detailed survey etc.

Anyone else had this, or got any ideas on what could have gone wrong? I must admit, I am very surprised as I did not expect this in Switzerland.

Patrious

all I can think of is something bad that they didn't tell you about that would of been a deal breaker for you when revealed at the notariat. What did the estate agent say?

Has your deposit been returned already..?

Thanks for the replies; deposit has not been returned yet, but have no reason to think there will be any problem here as the notaire has been consistently helpful.

I've yet to speak with the estate agent, who - by contrast - has been pretty awful through the whole transaction (after very happily accepting our asking price offer) and also quite unpleasant at times (shouting very loudly at my wife when there was a 2 day delay in transferring the deposit). In fact I think the reason for the deal going wrong is more down to her communication 'style' than the owners (she also shouted at the bank, and at first told them that she would not allow them to value the property due to the delay on the deposit, amongst other crazy stuff).

Wow, that sounds awful. So sorry to hear how badly it has gone. My husband and I are looking to buy in the Lausanne area as well and your story is my worst nightmare.

I have to stop myself from getting too personally invested in a place that we have just seen and like the look of, let alone make an offer, have it accepted, make deposits and then it all falls through. Really bad.

I would be interested to know who the agent is you dealt with so I can steer well clear. I have noticed a lot of the houses have multiple agents listed so it would be good not have to deal with someone if I know she is going to be rude and unhelpful.

Once again, sorry to hear what you went through but please keep us posted of anything further you find out about why this happened and whether you find something else to buy.

Good luck!
Mel

Shouldn't the buyer get a financial penalty for cancelling the deal? I know you are really interested in buying the house, however, there should be some sort of compensation with such things happen (either from the buyer or the seller side)

It all sounds a bit bizarre and it isn't usual. Especially no explanation and the property being remarketed at the same price. Your notaire or the selling agent should be able to give you some information about why this has happened. Are you sure the property is still being marketed? It could be that the agent(s) haven't updated their website if the property has been pulled from the market. One thing to bear in mind is that sometimes, due to forced inheritance rights, a property can be owned by multiple owners within the same family. Last minute disagreements can happen due to communication problems between the co-owners which can make the purchase process tortuous. That would explain a property being withdrawn but it wouldn't explain it being remarketed immediately at the same price. Any reputable selling agent/sellers notaire would give your notaire some explanation. If the property is being remarketed hasn't your notaire contacted the sellers? I'm surprised he hasn't offered an explanation but it's a sign of his integrity that he won't be charging you anything.

Been there, done that...

We were in similar situation - we had signed a Vorverkauf contract, paid a hefty sum as a reservation deposit - and suddenly the sellers got very squirrely, started making demands after the contract had been signed, etc. We did get it resolved in the end, but it cost us a fair amount.

(The Notäriat was useless...)

I don't want to worry you unduly, but if your deposit money isn't paid back ASAP, with interest, (and penalty if so specified in your reservation contract) - get a lawyer! Your own lawyer, not just the Notäriat.

Next property purchase I will use my own lawyer from day one of the transaction - I realize that most sales go smoothly, thus the general notion that a lawyer isn't necessary. But when things go wrong, it can be very, very expensive. And unless you know Swiss property law, you really do need someone on your side.

Hope this all works, and that you get your full deposit back. There will be other properties out there - once you have your money back, walk away.

As it happens, this was also in the Lausanne area. I'd rather not name the agent on the forum as I'm not familiar the 'name and shame' policy - but since I've been looking for some time, I've dealt with quite a few agents, and most are extremely professional. The bank has also told me that the behaviour of this particular person is 'unique'.

I will be speaking to the notaire tomorrow to see if I can uncover more of the background behind this. It is truly odd, as the property was newly relisted on Friday (according to comparis) which suggests it has not been withdrawn, and leads to the conclusion that the owners and / or estate agent simply did not want to sell to my wife and I, despite everything being set to be signed tomorrow. Maybe we committed some massive house buying faux pas?

Depending on what I hear from the notaire, I may consider making a claim for the survey fee's, but its not a big sum and unlikely to be worth the time that I'm sure I'd need to invest along with the general hassle.

Some Swiss have odd ideas about property and like to sell, not to the highest bidder, but the people they feel would best suit the neighbours! Yes really.

But why such a decision came at such a late stage is bizare...

Hi

Sorry to hear about your bad experience. Unfortunately we had a similar thing happen to us - 30 minutes before going to the notaire to sign the deal, we received a call from the seller to inform us that they had just signed with another couple.

Estate agents also don't all seem to be ethical. When we purchased our current place, the day before going to the notaire we received a call from the agent telling us that there was someone interested who was offering 10k more than we had and did we want to up our offer? Fortunately the sellers did "right" thing and said no thank you because they had accepted our offer.

Unfortunately it seems to be the quirks of the property market in Switzerland.

Good luck and hang in there, finding a place is a huge challenge in the Lausanne area.

Cheers
Nats

We had a solicitor because we were buying in a foreign country and the process was new to us, he also represented us at the Notariat. He was good at putting the wind up the caustic estate agent (and described her as a missile without a target, which was quite amusing but that sentence probably cost us 50chf)

Personally I wouldn't bother with a solicitor again, the piece of mind you get from legal representation is voided by the worries about being on the meter and how much this is costing you.

Thanks for all the replies and sympathy! Sorry to hear that I'm not alone in this kind of experience.

Just to conclude the story, or at least provide an update as I have not been able to get a conclusive answer from the notaire or the estate agent - most likely as there is not one that makes a great deal of sense.

Reading between the lines, it appears as though the principle reason was that the owners felt we were 'pushy' for offering the asking price very quickly, and therefore not giving other people the chance to make an offer. I don't really understand this, but when we agreed to buy the property with the estate agent, the owners looked *extremely* annoyed and my wife overheard them use the word 'pushy'. We talked about this at the time, and decided to take a cake to try and make amends when we met them for a 2nd time, but obviously first impressions last ... Ironically, the reason we made an offer so quickly was that we have previously lost opportunities by taking too long to make an offer!!

With one unwilling party in the transaction, and communication problems with the estate agent, in hindsight the deal was always one step away from the disaster that ultimately occurred.

Still, now I'm seasoned house 'almost' buyer at least I know the process, and also that cakes don't help to make friends with sellers

Patrious

Welcome to the strange world of Switzerland, where people choose whom they want to sell their things to.
Plus my condolences and good luck. Get a lawyer or a dependable swiss friend or colleague who can help with the culture and language.

We all reach that point sometimes.

Zepp

Only in Switzerland..... I feel really sorry for you and can't give you many tips really. I think you did the right thing making a quick offer. If the seller didn't see it that way, well their loss. I have bought and sold my share of properties and a quick, fair offer is almost always the best strategy.

Better luck next time and don't give up!

Bad luck but these things happen unfortunately. Put it down to experience and bake a better cake next time.

Do you have a signed contract? If you really want the house you might be able to sue the seller and insist on closing the deal at the agreed conditions. Ask an attorney - but you need to be quick before it's sold to someone else (then you might still be able to sue for damages).

It might actually be sufficient to call the seller and tell him that you contacted your lawyer who suggested this. The next step would then be a letter from your attorney to the seller and the real estate agent.

Hello there,
I disagree with this course of action. It will only hurt you more than it hurts him.

Even if you get this house, what would the neighbours think of you? What would you think of yourself too? You would have already started "badly".

Unless there is a financial cost which is the direct result of this "unfairness", and you should be able to ask for this back, with or without a lawyer, I would not agree with the suggestion that you try to buy the house after this "rejection".

It feels bad, but heh, life's like that sometimes. Just learn and move on.

Do you like the house "enough" to make this type of legal threat? If it is yours, it is yours. If it is not, live and let live.

ZEPP

I would look at this purely from an economical point of view. If the house was good value for money (better than alternative offers) I would sue the guy and not care too much about what he feels (he would probably do the same to you). I know of several similar cases - not in Switzerland though, but in Spain where the real estate market is a battle field.

Agreed, it hasn't been to the notariat so there is no concluded sales contract.

Somebody on here will know the correct terminology but sales are concluded by the seller. You have an invitation to buy (I'm sure the word tempt is in there somewhere), and offer to buy then a conclusion of the sale (contract).

You will waste a lot of money on a solicitor if you go down that route, and it will take months and months to get nowhere in addition to the issues highlighted by led_zepp in the unlikely event it did work out.