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Old 29.06.2015, 18:27
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Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

Greetings!

I have browsed through the various threads, but have not found what I'm looking for, so have to create this new post.

After leasing my car for 3 years, I paid the balance and bought out the car. That was almost 7 years ago. I did not notify the insurance company, because I had decided to keep the full casco coverage. That is the only thing I was warned of - call the insurance if you decide to have partial casco after the lease. What became clear to me recently, is that the insurer charged me 20-25% more all these years (after the lease), than they would had they known I was in fact the owner of the car. I asked them for a compensation for all these years saying they have a faulty system, and that they could not have charged more due to leasing for more than 10 years overall. Basically I have been overpaying a given service for no good reason for years, in fact financing the insurer. It's quite a significant sum of money actually, especially if you add the interest, as should be done.

Somehow I have no confidence that the insurance company will do what I expect them to do. Where can I get good advice on how to handle this situation? A lawyer specializing in these topics? The ombudsman?

Many thanks!
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Old 29.06.2015, 18:32
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

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After leasing my car for 3 years, I paid the balance and bought out the car. That was almost 7 years ago. I did not notify the insurance company, because I had decided to keep the full casco coverage. That is the only thing I was warned of - call the insurance if you decide to have partial casco after the lease. What became clear to me recently, is that the insurer charged me 20-25% more all these years (after the lease), than they would had they known I was in fact the owner of the car.
You didn't notify them, they had no reason to go back to the STVA to check for whether 178 had been removed and therefore whether the car was no longer leased.

I'd hazard a guess that in that time they sent you a renewal - did you check it? and sign it?
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Old 29.06.2015, 18:41
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

Getting popcorn...
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Old 29.06.2015, 18:55
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

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What became clear to me recently, is that the insurer charged me 20-25% more all these years (after the lease), than they would had they known I was in fact the owner of the car.!
And this based on some obscure clause in your contract which you just got aware of ? Or is it word of mouth of some friend or insurance agent?

If the former you have something which may uphold in a court, if the later forget it. It is what is commonly called a free economy.
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Old 29.06.2015, 18:59
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

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I did not notify the insurance company, because I had decided to keep the full casco coverage. That is the only thing I was warned of - call the insurance if you decide to have partial casco after the lease.
Nuff said really.... If you didn't notify them, chose to keep full cover, and paid accordingly... I'd say the problem don't lie with the insurer, and is an expensive lesson.

Last edited by Papa Goose; 29.06.2015 at 19:09.
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Old 29.06.2015, 19:20
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

If you lease a car, the insurance premium is up to 25% higher than for a car financed otherwise such as cash or a bank loan.

The terms of the insurance are EXACTLY the same

The insurance company considers their is far more risk with a leased car, therefore this justifies additional premiums.

Absolutely nothing to do with the fact a lot of people can only afford to drive a shinny piece of tin via a leasing contract......and please do not suggest otherwise as i don't believe you
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Old 29.06.2015, 19:57
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

Thank you for your comments so far.
Just to be clear: I am not complaining about the fact that I could have opted for lower coverage and didn't. No, I wanted the same coverage, but they charged me more than they should, based on the fact that they thought (so to speak, their system did) I am still leasing the car. And because I didn't know of this extra premium for leases, I didn't notify them of anything. Fair enough, I should have. But what I really want is money back and advice on how to do that (address of good specialist lawyer, e.g.)

@dodgyken - nobody sent me any proposal for renewal, I'm pretty sure. And I certainly didn't sign anything. I changed cantons at some point. Anyway, wha are my options now, according to you?

@k_and_e You don't have my problem, obviously

@ aSwissInTheUS. I called the insurance company asking for a meeting saying I'm paying too much for insurance (2,600 per year). When I came to the meeting, the agent had a proposal without the leasing which was about 500 cheaper, from what ai remember. He said I assume you finished the leasing... (Yeah, good guess)

@Papa Goose - no, that's not what happened, have another look at what I wrote please

@ Today only - thank you for these clarifications.
Regarding the motivations for leasing, that's another topic, and of course, without it you'd have fewer nice cars on the streets
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Old 29.06.2015, 20:02
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

It is your responsibility to advise the insurance company of any changes, you did not, therefore it is your fault.

Go get a lawyer, go to court, whatever, however i really can't see you getting any money back, as the problem arises from your lack of attention to advising the insurance company.
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Old 29.06.2015, 20:11
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

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@Papa Goose - no, that's not what happened, have another look at what I wrote please
It's taken straight from your post... thats what is A QUOTE, as opposes to a quote you would get from and insurance company had you notified the... which you didn't
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Old 29.06.2015, 20:23
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

@ Today only - Since "leasing" it is mentioned nowhere in the contract, I am not supposed to know I am supposed to notify them. Yes, I will hire a lawyer and will have a nice vacation thanks to it, I think.

@ Papa Goose - it's one thing to take a quote, and it's another one to understand it, or the context. Thanks for the grown also, must make you feel better
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Old 29.06.2015, 20:34
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

What bit of your responsibility do you not get? Did you or did you not tell them the car was no longer on a lease... You have written no twice, so guess it is a no. Now you've found out how much your failure to notify has cost you and you are unhappy. I think the only person who will be getting a holiday will be the lawyer you go to.

The groan was for you trying to make your lack of action someone else problem.
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Old 29.06.2015, 20:38
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

With leasing the insurance may have to pay out more than the market value of the car, the risk to the insurer is higher hence a higher premium.
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Old 29.06.2015, 20:42
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

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With leasing the insurance may have to pay out more than the market value of the car, the risk to the insurer is higher hence a higher premium.
I never paid higher while leasing, but I was at 35% and Swiss at the time.

Tom
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Old 29.06.2015, 20:52
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

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@ aSwissInTheUS. I called the insurance company asking for a meeting saying I'm paying too much for insurance (2,600 per year). When I came to the meeting, the agent had a proposal without the leasing which was about 500 cheaper, from what ai remember. He said I assume you finished the leasing... (Yeah, good guess)
2k insurance for a 7 year old car is still a lot
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Old 29.06.2015, 20:55
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

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2k insurance for a 7 year old car is still a lot
Only depends on the new price of the car (and the discount level).

Tom
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Old 29.06.2015, 21:02
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@ Today only - Since "leasing" it is mentioned nowhere in the contract, I am not supposed to know I am supposed to notify them. Yes, I will hire a lawyer and will have a nice vacation thanks to it, I think.

The leasing is mentioned in the contract, where you put an X into the box for how the car was financed. It is also mentioned on the grey card.

Now if you didn't bother about this or didn't tell the insurance that the car was no longer on lease, which is 100% your responsibility, the leasing company give you a paper at the end of the lease to this effect, then how does this make it the responsibility of the insurance company?

Ignorance is no defense,

Don't bother to thank for the groan, it was free.

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I never paid higher while leasing, but I was at 35% and Swiss at the time.

Tom
Yes you did !

Check on any insurance site, keep all the same details 35%, Swiss, whatever you want but change the way the car is financed from own finacing to leasing

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With leasing the insurance may have to pay out more than the market value of the car, the risk to the insurer is higher hence a higher premium.

Why does insurance pay out higher to leasing company than private, makes no sense. The risk (driver) remains same.

Take a lease car back with any damage and they charge you for the damage, so i could argue you are more careful with a lease car than your own because of this sword hanging over your head, and if you plan on keeping it,. then there is still no reason for higher premiums, apart from the insurance companies have worked out people like new cars, they cannot afford than apart from leasing and wow.....a loophole to charge people more for their insurance !!

Last edited by 3Wishes; 30.06.2015 at 15:21. Reason: merging consecutive replies
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Old 29.06.2015, 21:06
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

@Papa Goose I came here to get advice on where to find a specialist, not to be abused. Your first answer pointed to my failure to ask for lower coverage, showing you didn't read or understand my original post. Kindly direct your attention to another thread if you are unable or not willing to help.

@fatmanfilms - thank you for the explanation

Others, yes, 2000 is still expensive. Value of the new car was around 60K.
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Old 29.06.2015, 22:18
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

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@Papa Goose I came here to get advice on where to find a specialist, not to be abused. Your first answer pointed to my failure to ask for lower coverage, showing you didn't read or understand my original post. Kindly direct your attention to another thread if you are unable or not willing to help.

@fatmanfilms - thank you for the explanation

Others, yes, 2000 is still expensive. Value of the new car was around 60K.


Nobody is abusing you. They are simply pointing out that the mistake was YOURS and the insurance Company has NO reason, legal or otherwise to refund you any fees. You didn't inform them of a pertinent fact in a timely manner. The fact that you kept paying their premiums is evidence that you accepted the conditions AND the Price. They aren't ripping you off, rather they are merely upholding their side of the contract. If you don't like the fact that they didn't figure out what you were doing through telepathy, change to a different insurer. Good luck finding one that can guess what you want.
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Old 29.06.2015, 22:46
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Re: Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

I have to admit to not having thoroughly reading through my own insurance policy in complete detail, but based on experience from the UK the insurance companies always require you to tell them of any changes in circumstances, failure to do so could invalidate your policy - again this is based on UK experience but I'm sure the basic principles apply.

So I'm afraid I agree with the majority, you didn't tell of the change so how would they know to charge you less? About the only chance you have is to prove the day you owned it and no longer leased it and prove what the difference in premiums was - but to be honest I think you are on a hiding to nothing.
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Old 29.06.2015, 22:57
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Overpaid car insurance - need legal advice

When we traded in our car for a new one, the car dealership "forgot" to tell our insurance company in a timely manner to cancel the old car and we ended up paying to insure 2 cars for 3 months. I didn't get any sort of statement in the mail, nothing to sign, no contract correction - I only found out because I called about something and they asked me if I still had two cars.

In the end the insurance company said they wouldn't refund our money because they were informed on such and such date and on that date the policy was changed - I had to recoup my costs from the car dealership.

So best of luck, but I don't think that a lawyer will get you anywhere, beyond losing more money.
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