Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Insurance
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #41  
Old 03.03.2016, 17:47
Papa Goose's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Ägeri
Posts: 3,607
Groaned at 233 Times in 190 Posts
Thanked 4,042 Times in 1,742 Posts
Papa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

This all sounds a little odd to me, if you know you have insurance/bills to pay but don't in 8 months, why:

- only call them twice, as they must have know the bills were mounting?
- was post not on redirect is like CHF 25?
- was as a registered letter with change of address not sent in month 1?
- was money not being set aside to cover the bills they knew were coming?
- was a registered letter only mentioned after the insurance went legal?
- not go to social hilfe when requested to by the insurance company?

I sympathise with anyone in financial difficulty through job loss, but you have to get on the front foot to stop things like this happening. I think the insurance company is playing hardball now, as there seems no reasonable explanation other than they didn't, to any of the things that could have possibly prevented this situation from getting out of hand.
__________________
How do you know if a Frenchman has been in your garden.... your rubbish is gone, your dog is pregnant.... but at least your cabbages are pest free
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Papa Goose for this useful post:
  #42  
Old 03.03.2016, 17:49
Belgianmum's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Was Belgium now Neuchâtel
Posts: 8,227
Groaned at 60 Times in 57 Posts
Thanked 10,245 Times in 4,928 Posts
Belgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
This all sounds a little odd to me, if you know you have insurance/bills to pay but don't in 8 months, why:

- only call them twice, as they must have know the bills were mounting?
- was post not on redirect is like CHF 25?
- was as a registered letter with change of address not sent in month 1?
- was money not being set aside to cover the bills they knew were coming?
- was a registered letter only mentioned after the insurance went legal?
- not go to social hilfe when requested to by the insurance company?

I sympathise with anyone in financial difficulty through job loss, but you have to get on the front foot to stop things like this happening. I think the insurance company is playing hardball now, as there seems no reasonable explanation other than they didn't, to any of the things that could have possibly prevented this situation from getting out of hand.
The post was on redirect which is how they received the bills, the rest of your points are valid though.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 03.03.2016, 17:50
Papa Goose's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Ägeri
Posts: 3,607
Groaned at 233 Times in 190 Posts
Thanked 4,042 Times in 1,742 Posts
Papa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond reputePapa Goose has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
The post was on redirect which is how they received the bills, the rest of your points are valid though.
That would mean the insurance didn't send ANY bills for 8 months... you think?
Reply With Quote
This user groans at Papa Goose for this post:
  #44  
Old 03.03.2016, 17:51
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 8,411
Groaned at 141 Times in 122 Posts
Thanked 14,611 Times in 6,217 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
The post was on redirect which is how they received the bills, the rest of your points are valid though.
But if the bills were received, why were they not payed?
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank amogles for this useful post:
  #45  
Old 03.03.2016, 18:03
Belgianmum's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Was Belgium now Neuchâtel
Posts: 8,227
Groaned at 60 Times in 57 Posts
Thanked 10,245 Times in 4,928 Posts
Belgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
That would mean the insurance didn't send ANY bills for 8 months... you think?
No, if you read all the posts ( which admittedly are a bit convoluted as people misunderstood things along the way) you'll see that they received the bills and contacted the insurance company by phone, email, letter etc to try to sort out a payment plan but the insurance company didn't accept that and told them to get social aid.
The mistake the family made is in not paying anything at all to the health insurance company and allowing the debt to escalate over such a prolonged period of time.

As I understand it the issue now is that the insurance are issuing a betreibung but as they have the incorrect address ( despite allegedly being informed of the move on several occasions albeit not by registered letter) this can't be served.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Belgianmum for this useful post:
  #46  
Old 03.03.2016, 18:05
dodgyken's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Democratic Republic Kenistan
Posts: 9,840
Groaned at 340 Times in 276 Posts
Thanked 17,510 Times in 6,686 Posts
dodgyken has a reputation beyond reputedodgyken has a reputation beyond reputedodgyken has a reputation beyond reputedodgyken has a reputation beyond reputedodgyken has a reputation beyond reputedodgyken has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

TBH the OP has done the right thing - in posting a poor sequence of events on an English forum instead of allowing the neighbours in question to use their computer and look for answers in German.
Reply With Quote
The following 5 users would like to thank dodgyken for this useful post:
  #47  
Old 03.03.2016, 18:06
ZuriRollt's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Zürich
Posts: 1,793
Groaned at 41 Times in 31 Posts
Thanked 2,063 Times in 926 Posts
ZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
That is exactly the case.


I wish I coud help but I cannot.
No you can't. At the end of the day they need to help themselves.
They don't even have the language problem, and have created this situation themselves. They need to get themselves out of it - I've provided a few links - it's up to them if they pursue it.

Nice that you've tried to help .
Reply With Quote
The following 8 users would like to thank ZuriRollt for this useful post:
  #48  
Old 03.03.2016, 18:28
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Neuchatel
Posts: 19,394
Groaned at 369 Times in 276 Posts
Thanked 22,395 Times in 10,078 Posts
Odile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

As said, it is very likely they will lose their B permit if they can't pay and require social help. It has happened many times before. Whether we, on EF, find it fair or not- is pretty irrelevant to the authorities.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Odile for this useful post:
  #49  
Old 03.03.2016, 18:42
ZuriRollt's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Zürich
Posts: 1,793
Groaned at 41 Times in 31 Posts
Thanked 2,063 Times in 926 Posts
ZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
My first thought is that you're impatient and that if someone wants to help they'll do so when they have the time.
I think that what dodgyken means is that we're all here on a voluntarily basis.

We've potentially made our own experiences over the past months / years / decades / centuries and are happy to provide advice based on our experiences further.

It's quite amazing who you'll find on this site - usually the advice provided is diverse (qualified lawyers, well established ex-pats with specialism etc.), but you can only use it if you're in a position to be able to determine between what's fun, real advice etc.

I guess that's social media.

I do hope that my links can help to point in a direction that could help.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank ZuriRollt for this useful post:
  #50  
Old 03.03.2016, 18:45
Sbrinz's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Murten - Morat
Posts: 10,978
Groaned at 542 Times in 342 Posts
Thanked 10,579 Times in 5,411 Posts
Sbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

The notice of objection: "Rechtsvorschlag" must be made to the Betreibungsamt in writing within a week (or maybe it's 10 days?) of receiving the registered letter (with the payment order from the Betreibungsamt). This is important, the clock will be stopped & the future interest will then not be added to the debt.

They can then work out a repayment plan together with the Betreibungsamt. They would be seen to be at least trying to pay their way if they had paid only 10%. To pay nothing gets zero sympathy.

The next step would be to get budget advice from Caritas, as mentioned above by ZuriRollt, http://www.caritas-schuldenberatung.ch/

He could still go to the RAV and look for work, even take a menial job.

The Cantonal health insurance subsidy is not backdated and is based on the last final, and accepted, tax declaration, probably for the tax year 2014. So they should apply for this subsidy immediately.

I cannot understand why they didn't apply for help. For a married couple the social services would top up their income to around Fr 4'500 per month, but it isn't a grant, it is a loan, which must be repaid if they suddenly receive wealth (Lottery, inheritance, etc).
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Sbrinz for this useful post:
  #51  
Old 03.03.2016, 18:47
Sbrinz's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Murten - Morat
Posts: 10,978
Groaned at 542 Times in 342 Posts
Thanked 10,579 Times in 5,411 Posts
Sbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond reputeSbrinz has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
As said, it is very likely they will lose their B permit if they can't pay and require social help. It has happened many times before. Whether we, on EF, find it fair or not- is pretty irrelevant to the authorities.
Their Permit is also endangered with a heavy registered debt (Betreibung) so they are done for any way.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Sbrinz for this useful post:
  #52  
Old 03.03.2016, 18:49
roegner's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Zurich
Posts: 3,058
Groaned at 88 Times in 66 Posts
Thanked 3,089 Times in 1,583 Posts
roegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond reputeroegner has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

What I find strange is that they come from a country where health insurance is also mandatory and health insurances will get a debt collector if you do not pay. So the importance should have been known
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank roegner for this useful post:
  #53  
Old 03.03.2016, 18:57
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 18,147
Groaned at 926 Times in 722 Posts
Thanked 19,739 Times in 9,484 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
Their Permit is also endangered with a heavy registered debt (Betreibung) so they are done for any way.
Maybe, maybe not.

I know someone (Italian) with no job and around 20k of debt, and he still has his B.

Even gets social help.

Tom
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank st2lemans for this useful post:
  #54  
Old 03.03.2016, 19:03
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Zurich
Posts: 1,168
Groaned at 29 Times in 21 Posts
Thanked 455 Times in 349 Posts
blackbird has no particular reputation at present
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

In Germany the health insurance will be deducted from the salary, even when you are unemployed, it will be deducted from the monthly payment.
In Germany you can't make the decision, not to pay the health insurance.
They simply can not argue, that would be possible here in switzerland.
It is mandatory to pay the health insurance(everybody knows this matter when
he is registering at the town/city). You have to choose an insurance company, otherwise the city/town will make the decision.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank blackbird for this useful post:
  #55  
Old 03.03.2016, 19:05
ZuriRollt's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Zürich
Posts: 1,793
Groaned at 41 Times in 31 Posts
Thanked 2,063 Times in 926 Posts
ZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
If the Health Insurance company has initiated the debt collecting procedure (Betreibung) not much will happen till the local debt collecting agency (Betreibungsamt) sends the registered letter to your neighbours.
What on Earth do you mean? Please elaborate. Many thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old 03.03.2016, 19:06
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 8,411
Groaned at 141 Times in 122 Posts
Thanked 14,611 Times in 6,217 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
In Germany the health insurance will be deducted from the salary, even when you are unemployed, it will be deducted from the monthly payment.
In Germany you can't make the decision, not to pay the health insurance.
They simply can not argue, that would be possible here in switzerland.
It is mandatory to pay the health insurance(everybody knows this matter when
he is registering at the town/city). You have to choose an insurance company, otherwise the city/town will make the decision.
But seeing the OP did phone the health insurance and did ask them to change the address, this would indicate that they did know they needed to pay.
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 03.03.2016, 19:07
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 8,411
Groaned at 141 Times in 122 Posts
Thanked 14,611 Times in 6,217 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
Maybe, maybe not.

I know someone (Italian) with no job and around 20k of debt, and he still has his B.

Even gets social help.

Tom
me too, I know a New Zealander who has the Betreibungsamt at his throat non stop and is on social support but still somehow manages to get his permit renewed.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank amogles for this useful post:
  #58  
Old 03.03.2016, 20:54
ZuriRollt's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Zürich
Posts: 1,793
Groaned at 41 Times in 31 Posts
Thanked 2,063 Times in 926 Posts
ZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
If the Health Insurance company has initiated the debt collecting procedure (Betreibung) not much will happen till the local debt collecting agency (Betreibungsamt) sends the registered letter to your neighbours. The best thing they can do upon receipt is to go to the Betreibungsamt and speak to the person handling their case. The Betreibungsamt will then advise them as to what the next steps should be.
No way... it has nothing whatsoever to do with the neighbours . What on Earth are your credentials that you're trying to give advice here?
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users groan at ZuriRollt for this post:
  #59  
Old 03.03.2016, 21:36
pilatus1's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Luzern
Posts: 919
Groaned at 118 Times in 76 Posts
Thanked 2,211 Times in 859 Posts
pilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond reputepilatus1 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Zurirollt, I think you've gotten confused. It has everything to do with the neighbors, as the OP strated this thread on behalf of his/her neighbors. The registered letter would not be sent to your ('your' in the general sense) neighbors, but to OP's neighbors specifically - the ones in CHF 8000 debt.
Reply With Quote
The following 7 users would like to thank pilatus1 for this useful post:
  #60  
Old 03.03.2016, 21:54
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: ZH
Posts: 717
Groaned at 5 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 648 Times in 338 Posts
daffy99 has an excellent reputationdaffy99 has an excellent reputationdaffy99 has an excellent reputationdaffy99 has an excellent reputation
Re: Due health Insurance - Drastic consequences?

Quote:
View Post
but the insurance company didn't accept that and told them to get social aid.
... and social aid may have solved the problem.

http://www.jgk.be.ch/jgk/de/index/pr...verfahren.html

The insurance company is right and your neighbours should have acted much earlier, in a different fashion (see above).

To fix the current situation, it would be best to not address random strangers on a random forum on the Internet, but to search for professional advice: http://www.caritas-schuldenberatung....ratungsstellen provides local, reputable contacts.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank daffy99 for this useful post:
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
European Health Insurance Card coverage and complementary private insurance SilviaGiorgetti Insurance 10 19.08.2015 22:20
Health insurance breached my health confidentiality Switzerland12 Complaints corner 26 19.05.2015 23:46
Cancelling complementary health insurance outside deadlines due to hardship jobseekeronedge Insurance 3 16.04.2015 16:12
When are 2013 Health Insurance premiums due to be announced. SeafordSteve Insurance 12 28.09.2012 14:54
health care/ health insurance/customs/American outlining Insurance 5 16.05.2012 11:52


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 18:42.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0