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  #2021  
Old 10.07.2016, 12:38
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

A few cold facts from Nate Silver: The police are killing people as often as they were before Ferguson.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...fore-ferguson/
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  #2022  
Old 10.07.2016, 14:19
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I appreciate the sentiment here, but is a territory dispute really an appropriate analogy for centuries of slavery and institutionalized racism??
There's no need to look for analogy. It's about peaceful solution and approach taken to every conflict between angry sides, whether it's racial or territorial. It's about time to put in action "enough is enough", walk the walk instead of talk the talk, cease the tit-for-tat retaliatory feelings and act more insightfully, become big and stop wasting lives.
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  #2023  
Old 10.07.2016, 21:30
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

I'm hoping this isnt too random, but as someone who agrees with gun ownership, open carry is just for law enforcement and the army

and what person brings a gun to a peaceful rally.

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  #2024  
Old 10.07.2016, 21:52
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I'm hoping this isnt too random, but as someone who agrees with gun ownership, open carry is just for law enforcement and the army

and what person brings a gun to a peaceful rally.

Attachment 116170
I see open carry as bulls showing their big balls. They might be big but doesn't help them to fight...
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  #2025  
Old 11.07.2016, 10:43
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I see open carry as bulls showing their big balls. They might be big but doesn't help them to fight...
Yes, like certain groups of people having pitbulls or similar. Except that the dogs don't run away when the going gets tough.
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  #2026  
Old 11.07.2016, 10:49
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I'm hoping this isnt too random, but as someone who agrees with gun ownership, open carry is just for law enforcement and the army

and what person brings a gun to a peaceful rally.

Attachment 116170
Not only did they not deter the attack, or mitigate it, they made the job of the police reacting to an evolving situation significantly more difficult. It borders on a miracle that none of the people carrying were shot.
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  #2027  
Old 11.07.2016, 10:58
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

Cops. Always.

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........ and what person brings a gun to a peaceful rally.

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  #2028  
Old 11.07.2016, 11:35
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

Speaking of open carry:
Alva Braziel, a black man, has been shot dead while walking along the street, reportedly holding a gun in his hand. Police say after holding it in the air he aimed it at them.

The surveillance camera video shows the victim standing still, facing the car and even waving his arms (seconds 30-35), but at sec38 there appears to be a dark horzontal "bar" across his white shirt, that could well be him aiming the gun at the cops, just as they say is what happened. At sec40 he's lieing on the pavement...

This may well be a case of Darwin's law at work, if the cop's story is true that was really stupid of him.

Here's an article by the DM, and one by the Washington Post.
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  #2029  
Old 11.07.2016, 12:12
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I'm hoping this isnt too random, but as someone who agrees with gun ownership, open carry is just for law enforcement and the army

and what person brings a gun to a peaceful rally.

Attachment 116170
well there was also lots of law enforcement present and they didnt prevent those deaths either...
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  #2030  
Old 11.07.2016, 12:54
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Not only did they not deter the attack, or mitigate it, they made the job of the police reacting to an evolving situation significantly more difficult. It borders on a miracle that none of the people carrying were shot.

Unbelievable actually, considering all US police are racist, lynch mob types itching to kill people of color.

Or so I'm told.

On a less aggressive note, OC at a rally like this is representing the 2nd Amendment in its purest form. Citizens are protesting the tyranny of the police and are reminding our government that by law, they are allowed to be armed in case the tyranny is not addressed. Its emulating the Black Panther movement of the 60's.

If anything, the NRA should be protesting the MPLS shooting* alongside the BLM movement (or any other protest where the police shoot a legally armed citizen without due cause).

But, both organizations are misguided and don't really represent what they say they do.




*of the two recent cases, the MPLS shooting appears to be the most damning. I will reserve judgment, however, until the investigation is complete.
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  #2031  
Old 11.07.2016, 13:03
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I'm hoping this isnt too random, but as someone who agrees with gun ownership, open carry is just for law enforcement and the army

and what person brings a gun to a peaceful rally.

Attachment 116170

Many here don't get the purpose of OC.

OC does not equal law enforcement.

OC is a statement. (When done correctly)

It's also illegal to act as a LEO while OC'ing.

The protesters were following the law.
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  #2032  
Old 12.07.2016, 09:45
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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A few cold facts from Nate Silver: The police are killing people as often as they were before Ferguson.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...fore-ferguson/
How certain members of US police behave with the black community is disgraceful, however let's not forget the following "facts", that in the US:

Black men commit a disproportionately high amount of crime.
Most Black murders are committed by other black people.
Despite making up about 10% of the population, black people commit over half of all murders in the US.
It would take well over 40 years for US police to kill as many black people as die at the hands of other black people in one year alone.

Now look at these morons, marching down Oxford street with their stupid slogan. Ironic that the last black murder on Oxford Street was committed by another black guy in a Footlocker. Perhaps they'd do better to march through some of the gang infested areas of south London?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7129656.html

What we can learn out of all this is that black on black violence doesn't make half the political statement that a white cop killing a black guy can.

Last edited by Loz1983; 12.07.2016 at 11:08.
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  #2033  
Old 12.07.2016, 11:01
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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How certain members of US police behave with the black community is disgraceful, however let's not forget the following "facts", that in the US.

Black men commit a disproportionately high amount of crime.
Most Black murders are committed by other black people.
Despite making up about 10% of the population, black people commit over half of all murders in the US.
It would take well over 40 years for US police to kill as many black people as die at the hands of other black people in one year alone.

Now look at these morons, marching down Oxford street with their stupid slogan. Ironic that the last black murder on Oxford Street was committed by another black guy in a Footlocker. Perhaps they'd do better to march through some of the gang infested areas of south London?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7129656.html

What we can learn out of all this is that black on black violence doesn't make half the political statement that a white cop killing a black guy can.
I think BLM would gain more legitimacy if it diverted its focus to violence within the black community. If it directs its focus on white people, then its a racist platform falsely claiming to protest racism. If it directs its focus on the police, many of whom are black, then its really more a classist platform with a socialist agenda.

BLM has legitimate cause and reason, but its objectives beyond mere protest is not clearly defined, which fogs its legitimacy. They need to identify clear and implementable objectives to accomplish anything more than mere protest. I think it already has heart. Now it needs brain.
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  #2034  
Old 12.07.2016, 11:18
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I think BLM would gain more legitimacy if it diverted its focus to violence within the black community. If it directs its focus on white people, then its a racist platform falsely claiming to protest racism. If it directs its focus on the police, many of whom are black, then its really more a classist platform with a socialist agenda.
I've never seen any statistic, but when travelling in the US I do get the impression that a lot of police officers are black. In Chicago for example my admittedly anecdotal impression is that there are more black police officers than white police officers. I don't think the same can be said of the population as a whole, but maybe this is subjective depending on the parts of town I was in.

Maybe this is the result of an intentional drive to recruit black staff so as to gain more acceptance and cooperation among the black population?

I once witnessed police intervening when an individual was acting in a threatening manner on the street. Possibly he was under the influence of drugs. The individual and the two policemen who attended were all black and I was pretty amazed by how they handled him, applying some wit and humor to make him calm down and deescalate and so avoid direct and potentially violent confrontation, but being firm and authoritative at the same time.
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  #2035  
Old 12.07.2016, 11:33
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I've never seen any statistic, but when travelling in the US I do get the impression that a lot of police officers are black. In Chicago for example my admittedly anecdotal impression is that there are more black police officers than white police officers. I don't think the same can be said of the population as a whole, but maybe this is subjective depending on the parts of town I was in.

Maybe this is the result of an intentional drive to recruit black staff so as to gain more acceptance and cooperation among the black population?

I once witnessed police intervening when an individual was acting in a threatening manner on the street. Possibly he was under the influence of drugs. The individual and the two policemen who attended were all black and I was pretty amazed by how they handled him, applying some wit and humor to make him calm down and avoid direct confrontation but being firm and authoritative at the same time.

Interesting article here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.1c77d1021481

Somewhere, I think it says that from the data set, non-white cops are more likely to shoot people of color than white cops. To your point - it may be that areas of higher crime (urban areas) also have a higher percentage of minority police officers. As with all stats, they don't always tell us how they normalize the data.

More importantly, almost all the shootings, whether white or black victims, appear justified with the victim being armed and acting aggressively against the police or the public.

FYI - There was no expectation that after Fergusson, overall police shootings would go down (@ Zappa) and it is the type of misguided, incendiary news articles that make all police officers targets.
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  #2036  
Old 12.07.2016, 11:39
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Maybe this is the result of an intentional drive to recruit black staff so as to gain more acceptance and cooperation among the black population?
I am sure it is that.

OR

As society progresses each group strives for improvement. The "old" group that were police officers have had children and encouraged them into college to gain a degree so they can be lawyers or bankers or consultants or baristas.

Meanwhile the group below them worked hard at 3 jobs, strived to give the best they could give their children - but a college education was beyond them. They are smart enough to want more than repeating the 3 jobs their parents did and so choose a career path which gives them a good wage and a long career.

The group below them tend to work illegally, earning what they can, when they can. They may have a legal part time job. When their children grow up they are legal but in general are poorly educated. They want more than their parents had and work 3 jobs to provide for their family.

The first group are most likely to be white; the second group black; and the third groups latino.

The groups change over time but the progression in an immigration based country will be similar across the generations - arrival, integration, flourish
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Old 12.07.2016, 11:43
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I've never seen any statistic, but when travelling in the US I do get the impression that a lot of police officers are black. In Chicago for example my admittedly anecdotal impression is that there are more black police officers than white police officers. I don't think the same can be said of the population as a whole, but maybe this is subjective depending on the parts of town I was in.

Maybe this is the result of an intentional drive to recruit black staff so as to gain more acceptance and cooperation among the black population?

I once witnessed police intervening when an individual was acting in a threatening manner on the street. Possibly he was under the influence of drugs. The individual and the two policemen who attended were all black and I was pretty amazed by how they handled him, applying some wit and humor to make him calm down and deescalate and so avoid direct and potentially violent confrontation, but being firm and authoritative at the same time.
There have been concerted efforts to diversify law enforcement through quotas. According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, 12% of local police officers are black, which is close to the 13% of the national percentage of the population.
http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/lpd13ppp_sum.pdf

I don't see how addressing this problem through classifications of race or other class constructs can lead to anything other than more divisiveness and more racism.
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  #2038  
Old 12.07.2016, 12:49
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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There have been concerted efforts to diversify law enforcement through quotas. According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, 12% of local police officers are black, which is close to the 13% of the national percentage of the population.
http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/lpd13ppp_sum.pdf

I don't see how addressing this problem through classifications of race or other class constructs can lead to anything other than more divisiveness and more racism.
Better than the days when the cops and KKK were one and the same maybe?
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  #2039  
Old 12.07.2016, 13:01
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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There have been concerted efforts to diversify law enforcement through quotas. According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, 12% of local police officers are black, which is close to the 13% of the national percentage of the population.
http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/lpd13ppp_sum.pdf

I don't see how addressing this problem through classifications of race or other class constructs can lead to anything other than more divisiveness and more racism.
I think law enforcement is one of the few areas where I see quotas working.

Building bridges to different communities and gaining their trust and cooperation is something that takes people who understand the cultures of those communitiues.
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  #2040  
Old 12.07.2016, 17:20
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

This report is on local forces only.

Info on 3k sherif offices can be found here. They employ 189k fulltime sworn officers and 163k nonsworn employees. Among the fulltime sworn, 78% are white, 11% hispanic, 9% black, 2% other; 14% females. Since 2007, black sworn officers increased from 15.6k to 16.6k whereas hispanics increased from 13.9k to 19.4k.

That leaves out state and federal forces.
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