Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Off-Topic > Off-Topic > International affairs/politics
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #81  
Old 01.12.2014, 02:32
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CH
Posts: 5,125
Groaned at 189 Times in 148 Posts
Thanked 6,089 Times in 3,293 Posts
greenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
Not my projection. Cameron's speech from a year ago applauded Indians and their contributing values, and then chastised Eastern European welfare recipients.
....and that is in response to what?


But O.K., yes, Indians can vote. And some Indians are also welfare recipients. I feel as if I'd teach arithmetics.
Anyway, I like Indians and many other people, please leave them alone.

You're really entertaining at times. Adorable.. even.

Last edited by greenmount; 01.12.2014 at 02:45.
Reply With Quote
  #82  
Old 01.12.2014, 09:15
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CH
Posts: 5,125
Groaned at 189 Times in 148 Posts
Thanked 6,089 Times in 3,293 Posts
greenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
But isn't it a normal consequence in the short and middle-terms considering that the EU is a supranational project? I mean, of course, a huge influx of immigrants from the member countries with weaker economy is foreseen to flow into the member countries with larger economy, which will bring down wages in the latter. But then in the longer term, everything will be equalised as shortages of labour in the EU countries with weaker economy will expectedly raise wage level.
Good points here. As far as I know there's also a shortage of labour in Eastern Europe because many people are working outside of the country, for better salaries. And the salaries increased there too, in many industries. For instance, as an ITist you have enough incentives (now) to stay home.
From my very extended family, I have one example of a cousin who many years ago worked in Germany for 6 months (it wasn't illegal, but it was somehow in the grey area - seasonal construction worker with no social protection, no pension contribution etc.), and after he draw the line and saw how little he could save, and how much can he lose - no pension, no social protection in case he would lose his job had the company went down, no time with family, he returned home, there was no point for him.

The whole discussion about people going to U.K. for benefits is rather depressing and unfair. There might be some cases who land there broke and homeless, as someone else pointed out, but that's not what most people are doing or wanting. I don't think it's a crime to want to sell your skills/labour for better money.
But yeah, they should stay home and not "invade" U.K. And if they get there, they should accept a second class status. There are enough methods to get rid of those who would only want to "milk" the system, without restricting the rights of people who contribute. It is so obvious.

Last edited by greenmount; 01.12.2014 at 09:50.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank greenmount for this useful post:
  #83  
Old 01.12.2014, 09:24
Loz1983's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zürich
Posts: 1,064
Groaned at 295 Times in 172 Posts
Thanked 5,189 Times in 1,853 Posts
Loz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
But, I must admit, the UK ambivalence towards their own poor and destitute is striking for a north-western Europe - to see a mobile home park and a social housing project was really a lesson learned. Maybe that's the heritage you were boasting about.
Ambivalence!? What, by providing free education, free healthcare, free rent and free money to their poor and destitute? It surely can't be that bad or else there wouldn't be that many people queuing up trying to enter the country.

This maybe seen as targeting eastern Europeans, but at the end of the day something has to be done. 260,000 per year net immigration is just unsustainable, in the same way that many believe 80,000 is too much here.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Loz1983 for this useful post:
  #84  
Old 01.12.2014, 09:54
MidfieldGeneral's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Zürich
Posts: 1,415
Groaned at 54 Times in 51 Posts
Thanked 2,573 Times in 1,084 Posts
MidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond reputeMidfieldGeneral has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
Ambivalence!? What, by providing free education, free healthcare, free rent and free money to their poor and destitute? It surely can't be that bad or else there wouldn't be that many people queuing up trying to enter the country.

This maybe seen as targeting eastern Europeans, but at the end of the day something has to be done. 260,000 per year net immigration is just unsustainable, in the same way that many believe 80,000 is too much here.
I agree with this EXCEPT that imho most people emigrate in search of a better life. Not to scrounge off benefits but to work hard, get a good job, make the most of the economic situation
Reply With Quote
The following 8 users would like to thank MidfieldGeneral for this useful post:
  #85  
Old 01.12.2014, 09:58
Loz1983's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zürich
Posts: 1,064
Groaned at 295 Times in 172 Posts
Thanked 5,189 Times in 1,853 Posts
Loz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
I agree with this EXCEPT that imho most people emigrate in search of a better life. Not to scrounge off benefits but to work hard, get a good job, make the most of the economic situation
Of course you're right. I think most European migrants are coming for work which for whatever reasons Brits don't want to do. These proposed measures would unlikely have a great impact on migration figures in my opinion.

What would likely have a greater impact would be if the UK was able to somehow get her population back to work. It really grates when you see people moaning about Eastern Europeans "taking our jobs".
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank Loz1983 for this useful post:
  #86  
Old 01.12.2014, 11:00
Dougal's Breakfast's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: GL
Posts: 15,417
Groaned at 969 Times in 737 Posts
Thanked 38,724 Times in 12,120 Posts
Dougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

I was thinking about this a bit more last night, trying to get a grip on why I feel so strongly about the subject, and I think it goes back to an experience I had several years ago.


A Greek friend visited me in England. After doing the usual castles and pubs and stuff, I took him to Birmingham. We wandered around the city centre surrounded by Brummies - Brummies with brown skin and black skin, Brummies with turbans and beards, Brummies in saris and shalwar kameezes, Brummies with dreads and braids: all Brummies.


My friend turned to me and said - in his thick Athenian accent - "you know, you have too many foreigners in your country."


I took the piss out of him mercilessly for the rest of his visit.


But his comment struck a nerve, and I've heard similar comments since. Many Europeans think they have some kind of God-given right to move to the United Kingdom just because they're European and (naturally) white, Christian, "just like us". The only problem is that they are not "just like us". They are foreign in a way that no Jamaican or Pakistani or Australian or Bangladeshi will ever be foreign. Europeans have got a legal right, sure - but a moral right? I don't think so.


We owe Europeans nothing and they owe us nothing. Our relationship with people from the former Empire, on the other hand, is a bit more complicated. For all the difficulties with idiot boys joining ISIS and paedoes in Rotherham, they simply have more right to settle in the United Kingdom than Europeans - for all their Christianness, whiteness, lovingMozartandMichaelangeloness - ever will.


To put it in a nutshell: over the last 500 years, Europe has given us the Spanish Armada, Napoleon and Hitler. The Empire has given us tea, curry and late night shopping.

I know which I prefer.
Reply With Quote
The following 10 users would like to thank Dougal's Breakfast for this useful post:
  #87  
Old 01.12.2014, 11:16
olygirl's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: d' Innerschwiiz
Posts: 5,062
Groaned at 225 Times in 148 Posts
Thanked 10,872 Times in 3,321 Posts
olygirl has a reputation beyond reputeolygirl has a reputation beyond reputeolygirl has a reputation beyond reputeolygirl has a reputation beyond reputeolygirl has a reputation beyond reputeolygirl has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Careful DB. When I go to Ireland, I can't help but think how the English abused their neighbours not too long ago.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank olygirl for this useful post:
  #88  
Old 01.12.2014, 11:18
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CH
Posts: 5,125
Groaned at 189 Times in 148 Posts
Thanked 6,089 Times in 3,293 Posts
greenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
A Greek friend visited me in England. After doing the usual castles and pubs and stuff, I took him to Birmingham. We wandered around the city centre surrounded by Brummies - Brummies with brown skin and black skin, Brummies with turbans and beards, Brummies in saris and shalwar kameezes, Brummies with dreads and braids: all Brummies.

My friend turned to me and said - in his thick Athenian accent - "you know, you have too many foreigners in your country."
Yes, there are people like your friend who are obviously ignorant of British history. On the other hand, I bet that those "foreigners" you were talking about are similarly able to pass this type of comments. Feel threatened by those "lazy" Eastern-Europeans, support anti-immigration parties, adopt some attitude. It's easy to antagonise people.

And, I think it's fair to say that surely there are much more white natives who would say the same things. I don't want anymore to search for how many articles, films on youtube are posted re. those Brummies. And they are not done by the up-nosed "Europeans". It reflects an attitude many people have, even though they would often resort to publicly supporting/accepting multiculturalism.
Reply With Quote
  #89  
Old 01.12.2014, 11:24
Loz1983's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zürich
Posts: 1,064
Groaned at 295 Times in 172 Posts
Thanked 5,189 Times in 1,853 Posts
Loz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond reputeLoz1983 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
I was thinking about this a bit more last night, trying to get a grip on why I feel so strongly about the subject, and I think it goes back to an experience I had several years ago.


A Greek friend visited me in England. After doing the usual castles and pubs and stuff, I took him to Birmingham. We wandered around the city centre surrounded by Brummies - Brummies with brown skin and black skin, Brummies with turbans and beards, Brummies in saris and shalwar kameezes, Brummies with dreads and braids: all Brummies.


My friend turned to me and said - in his thick Athenian accent - "you know, you have too many foreigners in your country."


I took the piss out of him mercilessly for the rest of his visit.


But his comment struck a nerve, and I've heard similar comments since. Many Europeans think they have some kind of God-given right to move to the United Kingdom just because they're European and (naturally) white, Christian, "just like us". The only problem is that they are not "just like us". They are foreign in a way that no Jamaican or Pakistani or Australian or Bangladeshi will ever be foreign. Europeans have got a legal right, sure - but a moral right? I don't think so.


We owe Europeans nothing and they owe us nothing. Our relationship with people from the former Empire, on the other hand, is a bit more complicated. For all the difficulties with idiot boys joining ISIS and paedoes in Rotherham, they simply have more right to settle in the United Kingdom than Europeans - for all their Christianness, whiteness, lovingMozartandMichaelangeloness - ever will.


To put it in a nutshell: over the last 500 years, Europe has given us the Spanish Armada, Napoleon and Hitler. The Empire has given us tea, curry and late night shopping.

I know which I prefer.
But isn’t this a similar set of circumstances that Britain went through in the fifties and sixties when the borders were first opened up to the Commonwealth? There was great opposition and fear of the first wave of migrants (Rivers of blood, East is East etc.) yet 50 years later they are fully integrated, or accepted depending on who you ask, into the country such as that described in your (rather romanticised) account. Will this not be the same in another 50 years?
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Loz1983 for this useful post:
  #90  
Old 01.12.2014, 11:40
Dougal's Breakfast's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: GL
Posts: 15,417
Groaned at 969 Times in 737 Posts
Thanked 38,724 Times in 12,120 Posts
Dougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond reputeDougal's Breakfast has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
Will this not be the same in another 50 years?

No, because the British people will never be persuaded that cabbage soup is a fitting end to a Friday night down the pub.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank Dougal's Breakfast for this useful post:
  #91  
Old 01.12.2014, 12:07
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CH
Posts: 5,125
Groaned at 189 Times in 148 Posts
Thanked 6,089 Times in 3,293 Posts
greenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
No, because the British people will never be persuaded that cabbage soup is a fitting end to a Friday night down the pub.
I sincerely hope British people could/will vote for getting out from E.U. It seems there's so much tension there, such a waste.
Indeed, you can skip the cabbage soup.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank greenmount for this useful post:
  #92  
Old 01.12.2014, 12:14
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Neuchatel
Posts: 19,408
Groaned at 369 Times in 276 Posts
Thanked 22,412 Times in 10,086 Posts
Odile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
Switzerland could not possibly care less about British or American individuals, it is the billions upon billions of tax revenue and corporate investment spending that comes along with them that it cares about, i.e. Switzerland needs the companies that employ those individuals. this makes Switzerland, just like Luxembourg and Liechtenstein, a totally different case when it comes to "immigration".
I really do not know about the situation in Zurich and Zug- but certainly talking to Swiss friends in Geneva and Lausanne Riviera- they do mind the effects the expats are having on their local life and culture- as well as the huge hikes in rental prices and total disappearance of better housing availibility (as all rentals go direct to large firms via relos)- the huge increase in private schools, etc, etc. Remember Somaruga talking about 'parrallel lives for expats' and the effect on Swiss Society and culture.

Actually here is one of the many articles on the subject about Zurich area:

The "Bubble" Of Elite Expat Life In Switzerland

Some Swiss are questioning the parallel lifestyle of rich and highly skilled migrants, some of whom come for tax breaks. The foreign residents are often set apart, for good, in their choice of schools. Can this be remedied?

Anne Fournier (2012-05-31) Share :
Share on facebook Share on twitter Share on linkedin Share on google_plusone_share Share on reddit Share on email
Read Later
Living the high life on Lake Zurich (krusenstern)
ZURICH - It's 7:30 a.m. when a private school bus stops in front of the entrance to a luxury apartment building constructed in Zurich’s old Hürlimann brewery. Mothers buckle in their kids. They say “Bye bye!” and the children are brought to one of the region’s private - and naturally, Anglophone - schools.
German-speaking Switzerland is increasingly worried about what is seen as a growing cluster of highly skilled foreign expats, increasingly living in a bubble. It manifests in large part by the snubbing of one of the essential institutions that enables social relations to flourish: public schools. In Zoug, a county famed for its fiscal advantages, city vice-president Andreas Bossard says 80% of expatriates aren’t involved in local city life despite attempts to reach out with aperitifs, gifts and tax information services.
“Not long ago, we were trying to attract these migrants by all means, especially fiscal. Now, the discussion is much more cautious,” says Ueli Mäder, a sociologist from Basel, who is studying the potential discrimination of highly qualified working migrants. “I doubt that a sudden move to integrate will work, since it is viewed as a correction, as though it were righting a wrong." Mäder also notes that the debate is often limited to financial considerations.
Private vs. Public
Jérôme V. is a French father of two children and a financial expert. He confirms that there are two parallel worlds in his village. He has been living in the northern Swiss city of Feusisberg for the past four years, mainly for taxation reasons. His children go to a private school on the banks of Lake Zurich. “If public schools had the same bilingual teaching opportunities, we would reconsider our decision. Our children are surrounded by 400 young people from around the world. So don’t talk about an excluded society!”
So far, his family has not set out to join any of the regional organizations. “I understand how the locals might feel, like they are being invaded,” says Jérôme V. He is skeptical about the potential integration processes put in place by the authorities. “These commitments must stay personal. However, I appreciate that my county can inform me on the taxation policies of the next few years, at any time.”
Around Basel, 36,000 people belong to this community of highly skilled foreigners, mostly German or Anglophone and especially active in the pharmaceutical industry. A year ago, Green party president Guy Morin insisted on the will to greet these “expats” with welcoming sessions, training for media awareness and developing day-care in schools.
Today, Nicole von Jacobs, who works on integration issues for the Greens, denies that there are specific programs targeting this community. “We adapt to their needs. We try to ensure they know what opportunities they have in the region. Our prevailing integration policy of “encouraging and requiring” applies to them as well, even though many believe, for instance, that English is now sufficient, and that mastering German is no longer necessary.” To encourage this, the city organizes information sessions at Novartis to present the Swiss public schools and its virtues.
A similar policy prevails in Zurich, where Julia Morais heads the integration office. “We inform and present the school system and all of its possibilities, like we do for all other foreigners,” she says.
German newcomers, who are more numerous, have access to specific outings where they are introduced, “via humor,” to potential culture shock. Julia Morais also expects Zurich’s inhabitants to make an effort. “We must avoid the jealousies these newcomers are arousing. We need to get used to their presence.”

Read more from Le Temps in French


Read the full article: The "Bubble" Of Elite Expat Life In Switzerland
Worldcrunch - top stories from the world's best news sources
Follow us: @worldcrunch on Twitter | Worldcrunch on Facebook

Last edited by Odile; 01.12.2014 at 12:40.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Odile for this useful post:
  #93  
Old 01.12.2014, 12:24
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Vaud
Posts: 1,950
Groaned at 127 Times in 89 Posts
Thanked 3,510 Times in 1,339 Posts
Mikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
Pay taxes and claim benefits. What's the problem?
the increase in population providing strain on the public service infrastructure and the risk of disturbance to social cohesion due to cultural difference.

These are the main two in current debate, anyway. Its nothing to do with European migration, its inbound migration in general.
Reply With Quote
  #94  
Old 01.12.2014, 12:37
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CH
Posts: 5,125
Groaned at 189 Times in 148 Posts
Thanked 6,089 Times in 3,293 Posts
greenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
the increase in population providing strain on the public service infrastructure and the risk of disturbance to social cohesion due to cultural difference.

These are the main two in current debate, anyway. Its nothing to do with European migration, its inbound migration in general.
Same old same old...

Quote:
View Post
But isn’t this a similar set of circumstances that Britain went through in the fifties and sixties when the borders were first opened up to the Commonwealth? There was great opposition and fear of the first wave of migrants (Rivers of blood, East is East etc.) yet 50 years later they are fully integrated, or accepted depending on who you ask, into the country such as that described in your (rather romanticised) account.
Reply With Quote
  #95  
Old 01.12.2014, 12:44
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Vaud
Posts: 1,950
Groaned at 127 Times in 89 Posts
Thanked 3,510 Times in 1,339 Posts
Mikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond reputeMikers has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
Same old same old...
I thought the main fear was the type of people arriving, not the weight that they would place on the public service infrastructure ?
Reply With Quote
  #96  
Old 01.12.2014, 12:46
jacek's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Aargau
Posts: 7,446
Groaned at 96 Times in 76 Posts
Thanked 4,827 Times in 2,766 Posts
jacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
the increase in population providing strain on the public service infrastructure and the risk of disturbance to social cohesion due to cultural difference.

These are the main two in current debate, anyway. Its nothing to do with European migration, its inbound migration in general.
This is very important point. If I look at other examples like Switzerland where e.g. public roads need upgrade for smooth transit. Or another example outside of Europe, in South Africa where Eskom cannot cope with generating the required amount of electricity to all household hence scheduled load shedding. The system was previously designed to service minority but in new socio-economic reality its simply not enough. This is all result of growing population and add on top of that immigration. The only way is to limit quota to reasonable number which given country can handle and do not allow free movement that will affect already strained infrastructures.
__________________
🎾That's what we do to help English speaking expats community in Switzerland:
General Information About Swiss Tennis
Tennis Lessons Summer Winter Seasons
🎾🎾Our charity organization to help unprivileged kids to realize their dreams:
FMTF Supports Tennis For Children in Southern Africa
Reply With Quote
  #97  
Old 01.12.2014, 12:50
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Letzeburg
Posts: 1,971
Groaned at 68 Times in 51 Posts
Thanked 5,005 Times in 1,780 Posts
crazygringo has a reputation beyond reputecrazygringo has a reputation beyond reputecrazygringo has a reputation beyond reputecrazygringo has a reputation beyond reputecrazygringo has a reputation beyond reputecrazygringo has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
I really do not know about the situation in Zurich and Zug- but certainly talking to Swiss friends in Geneva and Lausanne Riviera- they do mind the effects the expats are having on their local life and culture- as well as the huge hikes in rental prices and total disappearance of better housing availibility (as all rentals go direct to large firms via relos)- the huge increase in private schools, etc, etc. Remember Somaruga talking about 'parrallel lives for expats' and the effect on Swiss Society and culture.
I am completely sympathetic to the concerns of Swiss individuals regarding overcrowding, rental pricing, motorway traffic, etc., which is precisely where the disconnect lies. just like Luxembourg and Liechtenstein (though admittedly to a somewhat lesser degree), the business model of Switzerland is built in significant part upon its tax and corporate capital structures. Swiss business and financial interests, and certain Swiss individuals, have become incredibly wealthy on the back of that business model. and that business model does not require integration or fitting in, language understanding or local schools (in fact it specifically requires international school options), and the principal winners when rent prices increase are the real estate owners (who are often Swiss).

it really is no different today than it was 40 years ago in Switzerland, if the country's citizens really want to address their immigration concerns then they need to first revisit the business model upon which much of the country's growth is premised. because let's face it, US, UK, Dutch and German expats are not generally immigrating to Switzerland in search of a "better life" or with any intent whatsoever of becoming Swiss, they are more often then not immigrating because they were recruited to do so.
Reply With Quote
The following 7 users would like to thank crazygringo for this useful post:
  #98  
Old 01.12.2014, 12:59
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CH
Posts: 5,125
Groaned at 189 Times in 148 Posts
Thanked 6,089 Times in 3,293 Posts
greenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
I thought the main fear was the type of people arriving, not the weight that they would place on the public service infrastructure ?
I don't know exactly what other things were being debated at that time in U.K., but because of living in CH I can draw parallels between this theme - "weight on the public service infrastructure" and the arguments used for persuading the Swiss to vote yes at the latest referendum. Yet they voted against immigration "caps". (I can't say I'm surprised because of the vote results, but that's not the point here)
Reply With Quote
  #99  
Old 01.12.2014, 13:15
FuriousRose's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: nearby the lake
Posts: 849
Groaned at 21 Times in 17 Posts
Thanked 890 Times in 424 Posts
FuriousRose has a reputation beyond reputeFuriousRose has a reputation beyond reputeFuriousRose has a reputation beyond reputeFuriousRose has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

Quote:
View Post
the increase in population providing strain on the public service infrastructure and the risk of disturbance to social cohesion due to cultural difference.

These are the main two in current debate, anyway. Its nothing to do with European migration, its inbound migration in general.
But they pay taxes, don't they? And their contribution to the whole economy is profiting the companies, and hence more tax revenue as well for the state. Hence, more people, more money coming in, and more money going out. Overall, that depends on how the state is managing its public spending.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank FuriousRose for this useful post:
  #100  
Old 01.12.2014, 13:26
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Neuchatel
Posts: 19,408
Groaned at 369 Times in 276 Posts
Thanked 22,412 Times in 10,086 Posts
Odile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond repute
Re: UK targets East Europe immigrants

There is a lot of 'paid in cash no questions asked in the UK'. The lovely Bulgarian cleaners where I was last 2 weeks were paid that way- cash left on the kitchen table (and way above the minimum wage too). Brits complain like crazy, but when it suits them (cheaper) are very happy to pay cleaner, plumber, builder, etc, etc, cash in hand, either to Brits or furiners.

Last edited by Odile; 01.12.2014 at 13:43.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank Odile for this useful post:
Reply

Tags
ban, cameron, immigration, welfare




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Swiss government plans to limit the arrival of Southern Europe immigrants Steno Permits/visas/government 2 05.02.2013 20:30
Best english speaking around Basel Land for UK immigrants bookfans Family matters/health 19 30.03.2012 12:39
Immigrants are 30 percent more likely to start businesses than non-immigrants miss_bean International affairs/politics 1 17.07.2010 00:53
O2 UK Bolt on - My Europe Extra Pike TV/internet/telephone 2 29.10.2009 11:54


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 15:55.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0