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  #321  
Old 09.01.2015, 15:27
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

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no, it's not, especially not when dealing with topics that are considered "sacred". 99% of the purpose of satire is "to go there", and to ridicule topics or figures that are deemed beyond the reach of ridicule. there is absolutely nothing at all about satire that is supposed to be "constructive", although good and effective satire can promote discussion and thereafter constructive criticism.

the purpose of satire, to grossly oversimplify, is to provoke. period.
The purpose of satire is humour. It is not made with the intention to provoke. It uses irony and exaggeration to expose stupidity or vices. Which is .. well humorous. Let's remember that every other religion prophets are made fun of. No prophet should be considered sacred!
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  #322  
Old 09.01.2015, 15:28
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

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Simple

1) No non Muslim may kill a Muslim, whether or not the Muslim is true. The reverse, however, is allowed.
2) No "non-true" Muslim may kill a true Muslim. Likewise, the reverse is allowed.
But the Paris killers killed "true" Muslims?
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  #323  
Old 09.01.2015, 15:30
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

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One previously suspected called the police saying he had a watertight alibi. If they intended to not survive this whole affair there would be no need to be particularly careful. And there are tons of examples of perpetrators acting incredibly stupid, including burglars sleeping at the place they broke in, or dropping their IDs.
Interesting. The original gunmen were masked.

If you're willing to die in a hail of gunfire to try to "discredit" the police* would it be worth laying a false trail and have the watertight alibi released after your death?


*Especially if they can coax the police into shooting them without threatening anybody themselves - they don't have hostages in the printshop, do they?
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  #324  
Old 09.01.2015, 15:36
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

Apparently there is one hostage in the printshop.

There is now another situation in a kosher supermarket in Paris.
An armed gunman has taken hostages, including women and children, reports of two dead.
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  #325  
Old 09.01.2015, 15:36
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

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*Especially if they can coax the police into shooting them without threatening anybody themselves - they don't have hostages in the printshop, do they?
They allegedly have one hostage at the moment.

Several hostages in the supposedly linked attack at the grocery.
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  #326  
Old 09.01.2015, 15:36
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

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Interesting. The original gunmen were masked.

If you're willing to die in a hail of gunfire to try to "discredit" the police* would it be worth laying a false trail and have the watertight alibi released after your death?


*Especially if they can coax the police into shooting them without threatening anybody themselves - they don't have hostages in the printshop, do they?
The have one hostage apparently in the print shop.

If the brothers had not left the ID card in the car.. Would they be clean away??
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  #327  
Old 09.01.2015, 15:37
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

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The purpose of satire is humour. It is not made with the intention to provoke. It uses irony and exaggeration to expose stupidity or vices. Which is .. well humorous.
sorry, but this is just plain and simply wrong. it is certainly a bonus when satire comes with a laugh or even a chuckle, but it is hardly a requirement.

just in case, here are two examples. there are moments in both of these which are certainly funny, but it should be pretty self-evident that the principal purpose of neither of these bits is to be funny - although of course the cynics amongst us will no doubt point out that the principal purpose of both of these bits is to get paid.



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  #328  
Old 09.01.2015, 15:40
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

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But the Paris killers killed "true" Muslims?

you're really fixating on this aren't you!!

you stick a machine gun in my face I'll tell you I'm mother teresa

He was a policeman, with a gun, even though he was shot (before they talked to him) he could have shot them and or given his colleagues useful information, if you think about it it makes sense for them to kill him.

And of course you've totally ignored the many replies stating his was the 'enemy' in there eyes.
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  #329  
Old 09.01.2015, 15:47
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

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But the Paris killers killed "true" Muslims?
Define "true" Muslims. As far as these people are concerned they're the only true ones in this situation. Everyone else isn't, even if they profess to be Muslim.
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  #330  
Old 09.01.2015, 16:19
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

Seems the trocaderois in lock down now??

And seems that the cops are holding back on the brothers because they think they are in contact with the second hostage taker.

Couple of hours ago the news sources thought the things was coming to a conclusion .. hmmm
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  #331  
Old 09.01.2015, 16:21
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

I did not realize that the traffic cop killer had not been caught yet :-O
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  #332  
Old 09.01.2015, 16:22
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

If people are acting as "roving reporters" on this thread quoting live news, then unless they are actually at the scene, isn't it correct form to also quote a news source with a link irrespective of whether it is Reuters or the Daily Mail's own?
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  #333  
Old 09.01.2015, 16:25
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

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If people are acting as "roving reporters" on this thread quoting live news, then unless they are actually at the scene, isn't it correct form to also quote a news source with a link irrespective of whether it is Reuters or the Daily Mail's own?
Can't you look it up?
http://www.20minutes.fr/societe/1513...anement-fermes
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  #334  
Old 09.01.2015, 16:27
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

So looks like two definitely killed at the kosher place siege and the image of the two suspects has been released.

Looks at her eyes in the photo

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...yesterday.html

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  #335  
Old 09.01.2015, 16:30
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

Someone help me keep up at the back...

Two gunmen from the Charlie Hebdo attack are now holed up in a warehouse with at least one hostage.

There's at least one other person holding hostages at a Kosher shop, seems likely he knows the other two.

Somewhere a cop was shot? By one of the bad guys mentioned above?

Someone is holding a hostage in a print shop?

I'm with Tom1234, please include links when you're talking about a development because it gets confusing quite quickly.
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  #336  
Old 09.01.2015, 16:32
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

Print shop and warehouse must be the same place. Although that industrial looking building is huge based on CNN live feed, maybe there are separate units inside?
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  #337  
Old 09.01.2015, 16:34
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

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Someone help me keep up at the back...

Two gunmen from the Charlie Hebdo attack are now holed up in a warehouse with at least one hostage.

There's at least one other person holding hostages at a Kosher shop, seems likely he knows the other two.

Somewhere a cop was shot? By one of the bad guys mentioned above?

Someone is holding a hostage in a print shop?

I'm with Tom1234, please include links when you're talking about a development because it gets confusing quite quickly.
It's many hours old news now.. Confirmed news by the police / interior ministry no longer live speculation.

The 2 hebdo shooters are in the print shop with one hostage.

The police woman shooter is in a kosher food shop with around 5 hostages.

The link between all of the shooters is confirmed and they are thought to be in contact with each other.

A further woman is being sought in relation to the above.

The trocadero was evacuated and re-opened.

Nothing else confirmed that i've seen.

EDIT : But I still think something stinks around the ID card stuff i mentioned before.

Last edited by John_H; 09.01.2015 at 16:36. Reason: ID card
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  #338  
Old 09.01.2015, 16:35
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

So, there are now 2 hostages situations in and around Paris which are likely taking the majority of police resources. The current belief is that the hostage takers from the different situations are in contact, and it's all but confirmed that they are part of the same cell.

The police resource situation is made worse as a result of the police guarding the remaining members of the Charlie Hebdo staff who have temporarily setup shop in the HQ of Liberation

This leaves the rest of Paris with little police presence.

Although I can't believe it was planned this way, If there are any further cell members then now would be a tactically opportune time to kick something else off.

Hence I'm sitting here wondering what's next.
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  #339  
Old 09.01.2015, 16:37
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

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What is the rule here? Do I have to make multiple useless posts before I can take part in any debate?
welcome to the Forum, assuming you're not a sockpuppet?
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  #340  
Old 09.01.2015, 16:37
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Re: France: Charlie Hebdo Office shootings

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Someone help me keep up at the back...

Two gunmen from the Charlie Hebdo attack are now holed up in a warehouse with at least one hostage.
Yes, but in a print shop
There's at least one other person holding hostages at a Kosher shop, seems likely he knows the other two.
Correct
Somewhere a cop was shot? By one of the bad guys mentioned above?
Correct, by the guy in the Kosher shop
Someone is holding a hostage in a print shop?
See above
I'm with Tom1234, please include links when you're talking about a development because it gets confusing quite quickly.
Daily Telegraph
Someone has probably already beaten me to it
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