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  #41  
Old 29.01.2015, 23:15
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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Firenze, Pisa, Rome, St Peter's in Rome- etc. Same in Barcelona and Madrid, to name but a few.

'Do respect religion. The church is still an integral part of Spanish life and wearing shorts or being scantily dressed whilst visiting a church will not be appreciated. If visiting Barcelona Cathedral men should wear long trousers and women should have a shawl or a full top covering their shoulders.' from official Barcelona guide. There are guides at the entrance, stopping people who are unsuitably dressed, or lending them big cover-ups.

And from Trip-Advisor:

We stood in line at St. Peter's today (a late start...don't do that!) only to be turned away for not wearing more respectful clothing. We were in longish shorts and
that did not cut it with the guards/security at the entrance.
It seems to me that your guide was published in the 50's.

Never experienced it myself, and I tend to visit churches and cathedrals because I like religious arquitecture.

Happy to be proven wrong, though. When was it?
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  #42  
Old 29.01.2015, 23:18
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

This summer, we visited the Sistine Chapel in Rome. Every woman there in sleeveless attire was given a paper shawl to cover her arms and shoulders. So while it may not be true for every cathedral, it is true for some.

Likewise, when visiting Israel the summer before, we were told to cover shoulders and knees for a tour of Jerusalem.

And while we used to wear head coverings in Catholic churches, i've not worn a head covering in years.
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  #43  
Old 29.01.2015, 23:23
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

Barcelona was quite a few years ago, I admit, in the late 80s, Madrid 6 years ago. St Peter's in Rome and the Sistine Chapel recently. And I've seen many women stopped in larger Churches in Tuscany in recent years too. Notre Dame Paris last year.

Whether it is forbidden or not, and whether guards are there to enforce or not- I would not dream of going into any Church in shorts or short skirt and skimpy top- way out of order and disrespectful for the users of the Church.

But as far as Michele is concerned, I think her attire is OK, but she should have had a matching head covering for the funeral if they attended some sort of ceremony.
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  #44  
Old 29.01.2015, 23:40
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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Firenze, Pisa, Rome, St Peter's in Rome- etc. Same in Barcelona and Madrid, to name but a few.

'Do respect religion. The church is still an integral part of Spanish life and wearing shorts or being scantily dressed whilst visiting a church will not be appreciated. If visiting Barcelona Cathedral men should wear long trousers and women should have a shawl or a full top covering their shoulders.' from official Barcelona guide. There are guides at the entrance, stopping people who are unsuitably dressed, or lending them big cover-ups.

And from Trip-Advisor:

We stood in line at St. Peter's today (a late start...don't do that!) only to be turned away for not wearing more respectful clothing. We were in longish shorts and
that did not cut it with the guards/security at the entrance.
Sounds great in a book but certainly not true in reality.
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  #45  
Old 29.01.2015, 23:53
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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This summer, we visited the Sistine Chapel in Rome.
Umm, the Sistine Chapel isn't in Rome.

It's in Vatican City, a totally different country.

Tom
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  #46  
Old 30.01.2015, 00:09
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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Sounds great in a book but certainly not true in reality.
Guide after guide states this is the case in Barcelona, so I am surprised. It certainly was the case when we visited- although it was some years back. Why would I make it up? Whether it is enforced or not, anyone who visits a Catholic Church or Cathedral without covering arms/shoulders, low cut top and knees- is disrespectful. And I am not religious at all.



Cover Shoulders and Knees in Churches
Remember that showing bare shoulders and knees in churches is a sign of disrespect, and strictly enforced at the entrance to the Barcelona Cathedral. When planning to visit a religious site in Barcelona, carry a pashmina or long scarf to cover your exposed shoulders or legs.
- See more at: http://www.bcnescapes.com/bcn_wear.h....d8qZVHq5.dpuf
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  #47  
Old 30.01.2015, 03:34
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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I've never seen that in Italy or France, nor in CH.

Tom
I have. Most prominently in the Vatican and it's really hard to miss there. In Greece did my mum even have to cover her long trousers with some cloth as women were apparently only modest when wearing a skirt.
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  #48  
Old 30.01.2015, 05:45
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Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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Umm, the Sistine Chapel isn't in Rome.

It's in Vatican City, a totally different country.

Tom

Technically correct. Yawn.
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  #49  
Old 30.01.2015, 06:29
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

...still practiced right here on Malta, however the churches will provide long skirts and kind of jacket at the enterance.
Nude or even topless bathing will get you fined as will running around town in a bikini.
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  #50  
Old 30.01.2015, 06:54
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

Just for the record, the last time a Saudi King died was in 2005 when George W. Bush was in office. I'm assuming George W. Bush flew to Riyadh just like Barack Obama. Did Laura Bush accompany her husband, and if so, what was the protocol at the time?
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  #51  
Old 30.01.2015, 07:01
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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Would Michelle Obama have worn this same outfit to a funeral in the United States or would she have chosen more subdued colors? (She wore a very conservative black dress to Dorothy Height's funeral.)

Also, if I want to visit a Cathedral I am REQUIRED to cover my shoulders, regardless of my beliefs.

Personally, I think when attending a funeral in a Muslim country, one should follow the local traditions. It is not the time or place for a political statement.
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Guide after guide states this is the case in Barcelona, so I am surprised. It certainly was the case when we visited- although it was some years back. Why would I make it up? Whether it is enforced or not, anyone who visits a Catholic Church or Cathedral without covering arms/shoulders, low cut top and knees- is disrespectful. And I am not religious at all.



Cover Shoulders and Knees in Churches
Remember that showing bare shoulders and knees in churches is a sign of disrespect, and strictly enforced at the entrance to the Barcelona Cathedral. When planning to visit a religious site in Barcelona, carry a pashmina or long scarf to cover your exposed shoulders or legs.
- See more at: http://www.bcnescapes.com/bcn_wear.h....d8qZVHq5.dpuf
Is there something that I'm missing in the picture of Michelle Obama? She's wearing a jacket covering her arms. I don't see any bare arms or shoulders that others are complaining about. What gives?
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  #52  
Old 30.01.2015, 09:22
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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Is there something that I'm missing in the picture of Michelle Obama? She's wearing a jacket covering her arms. I don't see any bare arms or shoulders that others are complaining about. What gives?
The colour, some people think it should have been black or similar. Also she didn't cover her head, another allegedly faux pas. *yawn*

And apparently most people here were subjected to some church modesty police as tourists, which I am (luckily) yet to encounter, even though I like visiting cathedrals and churches when I'm in a new place, mostly for their architecture and history. What one should wear when attending a church mass, is an entirely different discussion.
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Old 30.01.2015, 10:04
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

Why are (some) religious types offended by shoulders and knees? Don't they have any and are jealous?

I'm going to start a religion where noses are offensive and everyone should have to cover them up.
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  #54  
Old 30.01.2015, 10:20
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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It seems to me that your guide was published in the 50's.

Never experienced it myself, and I tend to visit churches and cathedrals because I like religious arquitecture.

Happy to be proven wrong, though. When was it?
A few years ago I was physically expelled from an Italian cathedral in Cuomo because I was wearing a tank top and just above the knees skirt in the middle of summer. Guards told me my outfit was indecent. All men wearing shorts were expelled too.

In Milan, you need to cover your shoulders to enter the cathedral. There's a nice little business at the entrance where beggars rent scarves to tourists in summer.
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Old 30.01.2015, 10:45
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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...still practiced right here on Malta, however the churches will provide long skirts and kind of jacket at the enterance.
Nude or even topless bathing will get you fined as will running around town in a bikini.
You're not working for the Maltese Tourism Board then? Sounds like a dull place to want to live then.
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  #56  
Old 30.01.2015, 10:56
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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Barcelona was quite a few years ago, I admit, in the late 80s, Madrid 6 years ago. St Peter's in Rome and the Sistine Chapel recently. And I've seen many women stopped in larger Churches in Tuscany in recent years too. Notre Dame Paris last year.
I see where the problem is: you are too sexy, woman.

I, on the other hand, was never asked to cover any part of my anatomy.

Draw your own conclusions.
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  #57  
Old 30.01.2015, 11:05
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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I see where the problem is: you are too sexy, woman.

I, on the other hand, was never asked to cover any part of my anatomy.

Draw your own conclusions.
You've got me thinking!

I wear jeans and t shirts (even when it's very hot because I have problems with sunburns and my shoulders are the most sensitive) all the time so maybe that's my problem: too unsexy.
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  #58  
Old 30.01.2015, 11:12
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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I see where the problem is: you are too sexy, woman.

I, on the other hand, was never asked to cover any part of my anatomy.

Draw your own conclusions.

LOL- I actually was hot when we went to Barcelona 25 years ago (Daughter reminded me just the other day with a photo on FB of our visit).
Now they'd ask me to cover up for very different reasons

Agree with ou PaddyG- I have no problems with shoulders or knees- but if I visit another country and culture, it's not up to me to decide whether people should, or not, be offended by them. If they are- then I'm happy to cover up out of respect. Simples.

And agree to, that Michelle was decently dressed, no arms, knees, shoulders to cleavage on show- but a matching scarf she could have pulled on her hair for the more formal moments wouldn't have gone amiss.
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Old 30.01.2015, 11:14
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

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And agree to, that Michelle was decently dressed, no arms, knees, shoulders to cleavage on show- but a matching scarf she could have pulled on her hair for the more formal moments wouldn't have gone amiss.
Why? As far as I am aware, female foreign dignitaries are not required to obey the local customs with regard to headwear.
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Old 30.01.2015, 11:21
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Re: Michelle Obama unveiled in Saudi Arabia

Of course not 'obey' - just 'respect'.
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