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Old 28.04.2015, 09:49
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Baltimore riots

What's up there? A curfew for all residents indicates that things are way out of control...

BALTIMORE — Maryland’s governor activated the National Guard on Monday and the city of Baltimore announced a curfew for all residents as a turbulent day that began with the funeral of 25-year-old Freddie Gray, the nation’s latest symbol of police brutality, ended with rioting by rock-throwing youths, arson, looting and at least 15 police officers injured.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/28/us...ddie-gray.html
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Old 28.04.2015, 10:08
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Re: Baltimore riots

The riots will blow over in a few nights and this will all be forgotten soon.

This moonwalk however, will be remembered for quite some time:

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Old 28.04.2015, 10:26
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Re: Baltimore riots

Seeing as you're in Zurich, just wait until Friday.

Tom
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Old 28.04.2015, 10:50
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Re: Baltimore riots

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The riots will blow over in a few nights and this will all be forgotten soon.
Meaning....that there will be no investigation re. death of Freddie Gray?

I wonder whether the police consider violence legitimate. Also, are there any grounds for believing that without "protests" there will be no investigation?
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Old 28.04.2015, 13:13
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Re: Baltimore riots

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Meaning....that there will be no investigation re. death of Freddie Gray?
there is already an ongoing investigation into the circumstances surrounding Freddie Gray's death, and the DOJ will likely get involved, as well. the riots have nothing whatsoever to do with the death of any single individual - some of the rioters are just looking for an excuse to do something stupid, but many of them are releasing years and even decades of pent-up frustration at being completely disenfranchised and alienated by what they perceive to be "the system".

although I absolutely loathe violence, the sad reality is that the communities where the rioting is happening do not have the resources or political power to effect meaningful change through "normal" avenues of protest.
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Old 28.04.2015, 14:13
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Re: Baltimore riots

http://blackwestchester.com/2015/04/...protest-bmore/
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Old 28.04.2015, 14:56
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Re: Baltimore riots

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Meaning....that there will be no investigation re. death of Freddie Gray?

I wonder whether the police consider violence legitimate. Also, are there any grounds for believing that without "protests" there will be no investigation?


So you know what happened ,please tell us so far as I know the kid ran away from the police run into a wall and hurt himself . The cop should have called the Paramedic That's the way I see it.


Now you can see with what kind of dugs the cops have to deal with, Burning down old age home ,guess where my sympathies lies
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Old 28.04.2015, 15:10
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Re: Baltimore riots

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...the riots have nothing whatsoever to do with the death of any single individual - some of the rioters are just looking for an excuse to do something stupid...
I agree with this bit. From the article above:

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...Cars were set on fire, store windows were shattered, a CVS drugstore was looted, and the cafe inside a century-old Italian deli was destroyed...Looters pulled junk food from convenience stores...
There are probably some legitimately upset folks who feel disenfranchised. However I have a hard time seeing how stealing things and destroying the property of individuals not involved in the case in any way honors the deceased or improves the situation for anyone.
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Old 28.04.2015, 16:41
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Re: Baltimore riots

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There are probably some legitimately upset folks who feel disenfranchised. However I have a hard time seeing how stealing things and destroying the property of individuals not involved in the case in any way honors the deceased or improves the situation for anyone.
I am sure I'll get another drive-by groan for this, but it's worth pointing out the following:

the riots in places like Watts, Detroit, Flint, Newark, Cleveland and others in the late 1960's left those communities completely devastated, and resulted in tremendous loss of property and even unfortunately life. they also resulted in "white flight", loss of public and private investment capital, etc. if you look at the events in any of those cities individually, they look like pretty much your typical destruction caused by your typical thugs, bums, criminals and general malcontents. if you look at those events in the aggregate, however, they played a pretty critical role in the quantum shift taken by the US in the late 1960's with respect to race relations and racial equality. things are certainly not perfect today in the US, but they are exponentially better than they were 40 years ago.

I agree that stealing things or burning cars and buildings is criminal and stupid, but then again I am white, Protestant male who could call his local senator tomorrow and have his phone call answered and listened to. it is certainly important to punish the commission of crimes in connection with these kinds of events, but it would be tremendously shortsighted not to listen to and address the undercurrents that are the real catalysts behind them.
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Old 28.04.2015, 16:54
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Re: Baltimore riots

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I am sure I'll get another drive-by groan for this, but it's worth pointing out the following:

the riots in places like Watts, Detroit, Flint, Newark, Cleveland and others in the late 1960's left those communities completely devastated, and resulted in tremendous loss of property and even unfortunately life. they also resulted in "white flight", loss of public and private investment capital, etc. if you look at the events in any of those cities individually, they look like pretty much your typical destruction caused by your typical thugs, bums, criminals and general malcontents. if you look at those events in the aggregate, however, they played a pretty critical role in the quantum shift taken by the US in the late 1960's with respect to race relations and racial equality. things are certainly not perfect today in the US, but they are exponentially better than they were 40 years ago.

I agree that stealing things or burning cars and buildings is criminal and stupid, but then again I am white, Protestant male who could call his local senator tomorrow and have his phone call answered and listened to. it is certainly important to punish the commission of crimes in connection with these kinds of events, but it would be tremendously shortsighted not to listen to and address the undercurrents that are the real catalysts behind them.
This is a good point.

History tends to paint the picture that it was the peaceful, almost saintly people like Martin Luther King who brought about the seismic shift in Civil Rights simply by being big nice and cuddly leaders and speaking soft words of love and understanding.

Probably, without the unrest and pressure form the streets, not much would really have ever happened.

Not every riot mob is spontaneous. There are often people behind it. Communities are organized and sometimes protesters are even bussed in from other locations. But even if there aren't, the fact that there is pressure from the streets, be it spontaneous or organized, does eventually cause change.
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Old 28.04.2015, 17:22
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Re: Baltimore riots

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I am sure I'll get another drive-by groan for this, but it's worth pointing out the following:

the riots in places like Watts, Detroit, Flint, Newark, Cleveland and others in the late 1960's left those communities completely devastated, and resulted in tremendous loss of property and even unfortunately life. they also resulted in "white flight", loss of public and private investment capital, etc. if you look at the events in any of those cities individually, they look like pretty much your typical destruction caused by your typical thugs, bums, criminals and general malcontents. if you look at those events in the aggregate, however, they played a pretty critical role in the quantum shift taken by the US in the late 1960's with respect to race relations and racial equality. things are certainly not perfect today in the US, but they are exponentially better than they were 40 years ago.

I agree that stealing things or burning cars and buildings is criminal and stupid, but then again I am white, Protestant male who could call his local senator tomorrow and have his phone call answered and listened to. it is certainly important to punish the commission of crimes in connection with these kinds of events, but it would be tremendously shortsighted not to listen to and address the undercurrents that are the real catalysts behind them.
Sorry but how would a senator know that you're white and protestant? You made me curious.
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Old 28.04.2015, 17:34
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Re: Baltimore riots

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Sorry but how would a senator know that you're white and protestant? You made me curious.
because only a white, Protestant male would be stupid enough to believe that calling his local senator would make a difference.



it was intended metaphorically, meaning I am fortunate enough to be able to still believe that the my political system takes my concerns into consideration when making and enforcing decisions.
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Old 28.04.2015, 17:39
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Re: Baltimore riots

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because only a white, Protestant male would be stupid enough to believe that calling his local senator would make a difference.



it was intended metaphorically, meaning I am fortunate enough to be able to still believe that the my political system takes my concerns into consideration when making and enforcing decisions.
even still. if you've been to baltimore, you can certainly figure out who you are talking to on the phone- there are pretty distinct differences depending...
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Old 28.04.2015, 17:52
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Re: Baltimore riots

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Sorry but how would a senator know that you're white and protestant? You made me curious.
The freemason handshake.

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Old 28.04.2015, 18:06
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Re: Baltimore riots

Yes there will be change, the police will resemble more and more the executive arm of the Gestapo but with bigger guns and not as organized.
I wonder if the riots of the last few years are not the first shots in a coming American racial war, you can´t deny that the tensions between whites and blacks are rapidly approaching boiling point.
I hear a lot of people saying: "well they are rioting because they are disenfranchised!"
Uhh! What? Ever since the Brown vs. the School Board stopped segregation in schools way back in 1955, blacks have had an equal playing field in education, education leads to jobs, jobs lead to security, so why do the cites burn, why are the majority of inner city blacks semi-literate? Has every law passed that gives blacks an equal stake in the American dream been for nothing?
I don´t buy the (blacks) assumption that their situation is whitey´s fault, whites passed Brown vs. the School Board, white feds and white troops made it work, almost the entire congress was white in the civil rights act in 1964, and above all whites fought and died ending slavery.
Whites support affirmative action and welfare systems, without which blacks would starve in the inner cities, all the programs and initiatives to bring blacks out of the slums has failed. They won´t or simply can´t assimilate, during my time in the States I heard the term "it´s because of cultural heritage" tossed around, from people who can´t find Africa on a globe, name a single country or speak any one of the African languages.
Sometimes I wonder if Apartheid would be the way to go, whites and blacks hate each other, white police in black neighborhoods isn´t a good idea, nor is having black cops in a white one, forcing blacks into overly white schools doesn´t work, without black studies and sports most wouldn´t graduate, (ok so there is a sliding scale) the few low income jobs still around in Detroit or Chicago or Birmingham are taken by better qualified whites, so why not have schools for blacks, black neighborhoods patrolled by black police, before Brown vs. the School Board there was the separate but equal doctrine, and that kind of worked, perhaps a 21st century version could avoid the mistakes of Jim Crow.
Would it be worth a shot? Perhaps if more cities burn..!
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Old 28.04.2015, 18:18
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Re: Baltimore riots

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Sorry but how would a senator know that you're white and protestant? You made me curious.
Because he'd not start off by saying "Senator, this is Tyrell ...."
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Old 28.04.2015, 18:36
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Re: Baltimore riots

Law enforcement need better non-lethal tools. A taser does not always sufficiently do the job, so you will see many cases where they use a gun.

We also need new protocols for engagement. When a cop says to stay there and be quiet, people really ought to stay there and be quiet. But no, they get belligerent, argue back, struggle, run or sometimes attack. I've seen what takes place on those streets, and can't always blame law enforcement all the time. Sure, some are hardened and really should be taken off the force. But some of the things they have to put up with by citizenry they are trying to police is beyond ridiculous.

These cops are asked to put their lives in danger, and can over-react to threats, because hey, they're thinking their children deserves to live life with a father too.
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Old 28.04.2015, 18:42
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Re: Baltimore riots

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Because he'd not start off by saying "Senator, this is Tyrell ...."
No, I meant he could have been a Catholic, agnostic or something else...

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even still. if you've been to baltimore, you can certainly figure out who you are talking to on the phone- there are pretty distinct differences depending...
I'm sure Amaraya.
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Old 28.04.2015, 18:48
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Re: Baltimore riots

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No, I meant he could have been a Catholic, agnostic or something else...
the catholics are up north. the agnostics too. the atheists are out west...
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Old 28.04.2015, 19:08
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Re: Baltimore riots

You can play the a**h*** rioter but you can't escape the maternal vigilance...

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