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  #21  
Old 01.07.2015, 13:17
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Re: Barack Obama

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Isn't it time the right wing side of politics ate their sour grapes and admired the achievements of Barack Obama?

In his time: his team have:

a) introduced a much needed national health insurance.

b) brought Iran back to the negotiating table on limiting nuclear weapons.

c) introduced nationwide homosexual marriages.

d) opened diplomatic relations in Cuba.

e) kept the economy on track after disastrous banking failures.

I cannot see any future president beating that wonderful record. Well done sir!

What we said in November 2008, mainly positive! Barack Obama Elected President
far too many people, including Americans, lack a basic understanding of what powers are actually enumerated to the President.

a. "Obamacare" actually dates back to the early 90's in concept, and much of what ultimately ended up in the legislation was copped from the program implemented in Massachusetts under Governor Romney. all Obama did was sign the legislation.

b. The verdict is still out on the Iran negotiations.

c. Obama had nothing whatsoever to do with the recognition of gay marriages, which resulted from state initiatives.

d. The verdict is likewise still out on Cuba.

e. The President's ability to actually impact the US economy is next to nil.

as I am prone to telling other Americans - the US spent decades and sacrificed countless lives to rid itself of a King, and has spent nearly the entire time since trying to go back to having a King. with the exception of foreign policy, the Presidency comes with very little actual power.
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  #22  
Old 01.07.2015, 13:53
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Re: Barack Obama

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since fracking has got off to a good start in the US
Yeah fracking is the way forward....

Glad to see that NY state has officially banned use of fracking earlier this week for obvious reasons

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repor...ticle25190768/.
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  #23  
Old 01.07.2015, 14:09
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Re: Barack Obama

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Yeah fracking is the way forward....

Glad to see that NY state has officially banned use of fracking earlier this week for obvious reasons

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repor...ticle25190768/.
That it isn't very lucrative in New York. Great move by the oil industry to move to fracking and sending the US up as the largest oil producer in 2014. Their R&D paid off, and it freed up some foreign policy linkages.

Oh, but credit goes to Obama? All hail Obama!
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Old 01.07.2015, 14:15
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Re: Barack Obama

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That it isn't very lucrative in New York. Great move by the oil industry to move to fracking and sending the US up as the largest oil producer in 2014. Their R&D paid off, and it freed up some foreign policy linkages.

Oh, but credit goes to Obama? All hail Obama!

Does the US produce more oil than Saudi Arabia and Russia?
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  #25  
Old 01.07.2015, 14:17
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Re: Barack Obama

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Does the US produce more oil than Saudi Arabia and Russia?
They did briefly in 2014, but Russia and SA are outproducing this year. Fracking brought the price of oil so low, that its margins got smaller, so natural market pricing is curtailing its US production at the moment.
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  #26  
Old 01.07.2015, 14:24
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Re: Barack Obama

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Senator Obama, along with Senators Levin and Coleman, started the assault on Americans living abroad with the "Stop Tax Haven Abuse Act" in 2007. This led to the passing of Fatca in 2010, signed by Obama, and the criminalization of ordinary personal finance of Americans living abroad.

Sorry, I have no time for Obama.

http://www.hsgac.senate.gov/subcommi...buse-act-s-681


To be fair, they are chasing after the bigger fish, although not knowing your own position I concede maybe it feels unfair. I think its great, especially as it challenges how tax havens like Switzerland operate and forces them to be more transparent. These are issues most governments are scared of tackling as their funding and sponsorship is often dependant on turning a blind eye to those tax dodgers.
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  #27  
Old 01.07.2015, 14:32
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Re: Barack Obama

Seriously Sbrinz? I thought you were a little bit more experienced that this.

All the things you list there are pretty-much based on Democratic (as in the party) and, dare I say it, European values. Therefore achieving them is NOT a good thing for anyone who is Republican or a "middling" Democrat.

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  #28  
Old 01.07.2015, 14:48
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Re: Barack Obama

Who are those big fish they are after, when the tax dodgers can hide their money right in the US's tax havens?

My very own "conspiracy theory" is that Uncle Sam would like a slice of every international pie the average American sets foot on, no pre-req on being a big shot necessary, and as supported by spying on everybody who's anybody, but supported more by the banks who have to report you to the US. Then Uncle Sam gains control of that country's economy by forcing it to comply with US rules and regulations.
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  #29  
Old 01.07.2015, 14:49
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Re: Barack Obama

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Seriously Sbrinz? I thought you were a little bit more experienced that this.

All the things you list there are pretty-much based on Democratic (as in the party) and, dare I say it, European values. Therefore achieving them is NOT a good thing for anyone who is Republican or a "middling" Democrat.

We are in Switzerland, not EU.

Swiss values are closer to the US Repulicans rather than the Democraps.

Tom
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  #30  
Old 01.07.2015, 14:58
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Re: Barack Obama

What did he win the Nobel Peace Prize for again
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  #31  
Old 01.07.2015, 15:10
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Re: Barack Obama

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To be fair, they are chasing after the bigger fish, although not knowing your own position I concede maybe it feels unfair. I think its great, especially as it challenges how tax havens like Switzerland operate and forces them to be more transparent. These are issues most governments are scared of tackling as their funding and sponsorship is often dependant on turning a blind eye to those tax dodgers.
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Who are those big fish they are after, when the tax dodgers can hide their money right in the US's tax havens?

My very own "conspiracy theory" is that Uncle Sam would like a slice of every international pie the average American sets foot on, no pre-req on being a big shot necessary, and as supported by spying on everybody who's anybody, but supported more by the banks who have to report you to the US. Then Uncle Sam gains control of that country's economy by forcing it to comply with US rules and regulations.
Exactly. They go after individuals and small time operators, and after sensational attention grabbing headlines like "Swiss Banks... la lal la", while they operate tax havens of their own in places like Delaware. It's all a show for the gullible.
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  #32  
Old 01.07.2015, 22:50
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Re: Barack Obama

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We are in Switzerland, not EU.

Swiss values are closer to the US Repulicans rather than the Democraps.

Tom
I don't care either way. My point is that no one who didn't support Obama already is going to applaud these mostly Democratic (as in party) achievements.

And for the record CH is in Europe last time I checked.
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  #33  
Old 01.07.2015, 22:57
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Re: Barack Obama

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I don't care either way. My point is that no one who didn't support Obama already is going to applaud these mostly Democratic (as in party) achievements.

And for the record CH is in Europe last time I checked.
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In his time: his team have:

a) introduced a much needed national health insurance... etc etc
If you look carefully, on the second line I mentioned his team...
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  #34  
Old 01.07.2015, 23:14
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Re: Barack Obama

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Mine weren't.


... and I'm disappointed to see that my cynicism back then was entirely justified.


Mr Obama has just been more of the same old, same old.


So it goes.
Much of Obama's presidency has been hamstrung by not having a majority in both houses which has severely impeded attempts to pass the legislation he wanted. You might remember the Republicans refusing to approve successive budgets without severe public spending cuts. There was a near default, with the US civil service having to shut down temporarily. These aren't excuses, but they are facts that should be take into account.

I think the main reason we feel some disappointment about Obama's presidency is that his victory speech in Grant Park was so electrifying. In retrospect, the reality couldn't live up to the expectations that were set that night.

All that said, I still believe he is a thoroughly decent man and a talented, charismatic politician. But like most leaders, he (and we) have been reminded of the truth of that old maxim that politicians must "campaign in poetry but govern in prose".
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  #35  
Old 01.07.2015, 23:17
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Re: Barack Obama

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I still believe he is a thoroughly decent man
Thoroughly decent men don't get to the top in American politics.
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  #36  
Old 01.07.2015, 23:22
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Re: Barack Obama

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If you look carefully, on the second line I mentioned his team...
So we should admire him or his team?



Either way, my point stands: people who already like Obama will say "yay Obama!" those who don't wont. Especiallywith the policy achievements you highlight.

People complain of UK politics being two-party bipartisan (that's certainly changed...). Well, it hasn't got a patch on the "entrenchment" you get in the US.
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Old 01.07.2015, 23:29
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Re: Barack Obama

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Thoroughly decent men don't get to the top in American politics.
Or anywhere else.
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  #38  
Old 01.07.2015, 23:32
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Re: Barack Obama

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I think its great, especially as it challenges how tax havens like Switzerland operate and forces them to be more transparent. These are issues most governments are scared of tackling as their funding and sponsorship is often dependant on turning a blind eye to those tax dodgers.
I think you forgot the emoticon to denote your obvious sarcasm.

I hope.
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  #39  
Old 01.07.2015, 23:45
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Re: Barack Obama

I quite liked Obama. I knew by his eloquence was exceptional even as he addressed the Democratic convention as a Senator, and I certainly favored him over McCain/Palin. Yet I didn't vote, as my state was heavily tilted already. I thought he was promising, and his election for me signified a big sigh of relief that our electoral process worked, and a new era dawned. I thought he brought fresh insight, and I expected him to cut through the usual equations that gridlocked politics and offer new insight.

My disenchantment began when he became President. When he encountered resistance, he fell back on the aura and mystic of his campaign instead of addressing reality. He seemed to me to be more interested in this attribute of his persona, as a form of political capital, instead of really do much about import and pending issues. That quickly took on the likes of a cult of personality, or egotism - which I had no interest in.

You see, the best Presidents are the ones who are able to cut through resistance and deliver results. Its the ones who have had to meet the opposition head on, and deliver a result. Not the ones who had no opposition at all. And in hindsight, I'm quite satisfied he met ample opposition. Because with his trajectory, and having carte blanche to dictate what he wanted would have been quite un-American. We don't elect royalty, kings and dictators. We elect guardians of our democracies for a limited amount of time. If he wasn't effective because of the opposition, it was because he wasn't listening , not seeing clearly and didn't really have the wherewithal to lead.

Well, recent dynamics indicate he has learned and adapted to how to preside. Let's see what he does with the rest of his term. Although he is nearly a lame-duck at this point.

The dude is cool though. I would rather hang with him on a person to person basis than any of the US politicians in office. I do like him, just not the best person to have as President. Consultant maybe?
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  #40  
Old 01.07.2015, 23:50
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Re: Barack Obama

What I find disheartening from Mr Obama and US politics is the polarisation and inability to avoid demonising those who disagree for political, economic, religious, moral, or other reasons. (Mr Cameron could give Mr Obama some productive lessons on this.) Seems disagreeing that a particular initiative from OP original list is positive/affordable/whatever brings down on-line wrath...just for having a different opinion
Today the winds blow liberal, they can easily blow the other way in a decade. Those flying a kite in the middle get wind-torn both ways.
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