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  #101  
Old 01.09.2015, 14:19
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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Meanwhile...

Migrants using fake Syrian passports to enter EU: border agency

http://news.yahoo.com/migrants-using...094700556.html
In other news a "Syrian" (maybe) refugee said the whole route (Turkey-Greece-Macedonia-Serbia-Hungary) cost him 2000-3000 euros.
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  #102  
Old 01.09.2015, 14:31
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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Yes, and Merkel even mentioned which countries in her eyes are not doing their fair share: UK, Ireland and Denmark. Hardly the poorest part of Europe, is it?

And very honestly: Which part of the EU is so poor that they could technically not afford to house and feed at least some refugees? All I see is that small countries like Poland were happy to send 2000 soldiers to Iraq with all expenses paid... but feeding a few refugees? "We don't want terrorists here"... as if the Iraqis really wanted them to come and kill.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...dont-like-them
Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Kuwait, Saudi and Qatar are also very wealthy. But remarkably the migrants don't want to go there. Perhaps Merkel should pick up the telephone and tell them to take their "fair share" too?

Even if Poland offered to take more on, do you really think the migrants would go there? They can hardly keep hold of their own population.
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  #103  
Old 01.09.2015, 14:41
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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All I see is that small countries like Poland were happy to send 2000 soldiers to Iraq with all expenses paid... but feeding a few refugees? "We don't want terrorists here"... as if the Iraqis really wanted them to come and kill.
And of course it was Poland (as a small country as you put it) to take part in sharing the profits made in those wars...no? Polish companies took the lions part, eh?
Anyway, I don't know what Poland says (it's unfortunate if they used the term terrorists for refugees) but I'm sure a Pole has to literally break his back on construction sites in Western countries in order to save 2000-3000 euros.
Yes, it is everyone's obligation to take some refugees, but Frau Merkel is not managing this crisis very well IMO. Giving hopes when she should be much more careful.
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  #104  
Old 01.09.2015, 14:41
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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Yes, and Merkel even mentioned which countries in her eyes are not doing their fair share: UK, Ireland and Denmark. Hardly the poorest part of Europe, is it?

And very honestly: Which part of the EU is so poor that they could technically not afford to house and feed at least some refugees?
Maybe Mrs Merkel needs to accept that Europe is not an extended Germany and that there are still countries that don't jump to it just because she says they should.

I would have thought that after the Greek crisis she might have noticed that Germany <> Europe. But the message didn't get there somehow.

Without wishing to Godwinize, but maybe she should also read a history book and find out what happened the last time when Germans thought other nations couldn't run their own countries as well as the Germans could.

They really need to learn to suppress that Besserwisser reflex.

"We may have changed our opinion since then, but we're still right" is not really the right argument IMHO.

Last edited by amogles; 01.09.2015 at 14:51.
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  #105  
Old 01.09.2015, 14:51
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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Maybe Mrs Merkel needs to accept that Europe is not an extended Germany and that there are still countries that don't jump to it just because she says they should.

I would have thought that after the Greek crisis she might have noticed that Germany <> Europe. But the message didn't get there somehow.
UK profited from all these wars in Middle East, if Frau Merkel is right on something - that's the thing.
But then she should tell the same thing to the USA...


But seriously, she's not playing this scene very well.
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  #106  
Old 01.09.2015, 15:13
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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Ok, reading the article about the refugees in Hungary heading to Germany, it becomes a little more clear, they are running into the arms of "Mama Merkel", ie: a rich country with a compassionate leader towards refugees. I guess why should refugees stay in a country like Hungary, where they are not so welcome and social payments are much lower.
Is this really the conduct of refugees though? Genunine refugees would not be denouncing the name of the country that is providing sanctuary, if anything they should be glad to be there. This is the behaviour or economic migrants with a sense of entitlement.
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  #107  
Old 01.09.2015, 15:51
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

Budapest police are stopping hundreds of Migrants trying to board trains to Vienna,

http://www.theguardian.com/world/gal...tion-evacuated

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34112930

The EU crisis meeting will be held in 2 weeks time.....

Quote: But it is far from certain her view will prevail when EU ministers hold a crisis meeting on 14 September. Britain, which is outside the Schengen zone, has said the border-free system is part of the problem, and a bloc of central European countries plans to oppose any binding quotas.
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  #108  
Old 01.09.2015, 15:59
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

Enter Iceland http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...yrian-refugees
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  #109  
Old 01.09.2015, 16:01
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

The EU should be giving all these fit young men some weapons and take them back to Syria, asking them to clean up the ISIS mess there!
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  #110  
Old 01.09.2015, 16:05
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

LOL, if the refugees don't want to stay in Hungary, how's the Iceland thing going to go over with them: "Hi, sorry, Germany is currently full, so we are going to move you to a frozen volcanic island in the middle of nowhere...."
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  #111  
Old 01.09.2015, 16:07
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest


Haha! They could offer direct flights for free and access for all 800,000. I still bet they'd have only a handful more than the 100 which are there at the moment. Who the hell want's to go and live in Iceland?!
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  #112  
Old 01.09.2015, 16:10
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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The EU should be giving all these fit young men some weapons and take them back to Syria, asking them to clean up the ISIS mess there!
yeah....sounds like a good idea. ISIS mess caused by the US and british invading Iraq for the oil and killing hundreds of thousands of civilians. It's called boomerang effect. The US should get more than a "fair share" of refugees.
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  #113  
Old 01.09.2015, 16:29
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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yeah....sounds like a good idea. ISIS mess caused by the US and british invading Iraq for the oil and killing hundreds of thousands of civilians. It's called boomerang effect. The US should get more than a "fair share" of refugees.
True, US and UK screwed up the already screwed up Middle East even more, but I don't know how long you can pin everything on them. The US has pulled out of Iraq, and tried training and supplying the Iraqi's, but they just can't seem to manage on their own. At least now other Arab countries are finally getting involved (in the fight against ISIS).

In any case, the bulk of the refugees in Hungary are coming from Syria, where Russia is propping up Assad by supplying weapons and funding for the war there. Russia should be getting it's "fair share" of refugees as well...
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  #114  
Old 01.09.2015, 16:53
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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Fewer than 10 of about 3,600 people who arrived in Austria had applied for asylum there, the authorities said. The rest said they wanted to go to Germany.

As the German authorities also questioned why Vienna had let many of the trains carry on to Germany, Austria’s interior minister Johanna Mikl-Leitner accused Berlin of bringing the situation on itself. Merkel’s government had “awakened hopes” in refugees when it stated last week it would not turn those from Syria back, he said.


Refugees who arrived at Munich station on overnight trains chanted” “Ich liebe Angela Merkel”, “I love Angela Merkel”.
Wow, looks like Germany is only making things worse for themselves, clearly the asylum seekers are favoring Germany for a reason....

http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...dapest-station
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  #115  
Old 02.09.2015, 02:16
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

A crowdfunding site has been launched today:

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/b...hungary#/story
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  #116  
Old 02.09.2015, 10:40
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

Migrants were protesting outside Budapest train station yesterday after being prevented from boarding trains to Austria and Germany.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/0...0R13F620150901

Watch the video. Not many women and children visible are there?
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  #117  
Old 02.09.2015, 11:11
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Kuwait, Saudi and Qatar are also very wealthy. But remarkably the migrants don't want to go there. Perhaps Merkel should pick up the telephone and tell them to take their "fair share" too?

Even if Poland offered to take more on, do you really think the migrants would go there? They can hardly keep hold of their own population.

Qatar, UAE, Saudi Arabia and Kuwait may have a lot of Money but only about the stability Syria had 5 years ago. NO, the Destination is Western Europe
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  #118  
Old 02.09.2015, 11:36
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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Qatar, UAE, Saudi Arabia and Kuwait may have a lot of Money but only about the stability Syria had 5 years ago. NO, the Destination is Western Europe
Quatar, Saudi etc are stable because they don't have hordes of unemployed or underemployed young men. In the case of Syria this was a ticking timebomb (and 90% of third world countries be warned).

I believe at some point the populations of at least some of the rich oil states will seek more democracy, but I don't expect the transition to be especially violent, or if it is, the violence will not be initiated by the people but by the state. Rich fat people have too much to lose to attempt desperate things. Individuals maybe, but not sufficient for a mass movement.

Continuing with the theme that underemployed angry young men are a cause of instability, what exactly is Germany trying to do by importing them in such numbers?
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  #119  
Old 02.09.2015, 11:40
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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True, US and UK screwed up the already screwed up Middle East even more, but I don't know how long you can pin everything on them. The US has pulled out of Iraq, and tried training and supplying the Iraqi's, but they just can't seem to manage on their own. At least now other Arab countries are finally getting involved (in the fight against ISIS).
(...)
Infrastructure, state & institutions destroyed, integrity of country dismantled. Huge geographic area involved from Afghanistan to Syria. This is not the reconstruction of Germany after WWII which took 10y with a funded plan. We will see the aftermath of that disastrous invasion for several decades if not even more.

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Migrants were protesting outside Budapest train station yesterday after being prevented from boarding trains to Austria and Germany.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/0...0R13F620150901

Watch the video. Not many women and children visible are there?
Preconception lead you to filtering and selective viewing of the video. Kids and women can be seen (00:12-00:15) or longer on (00:36-00:43).
Please bear in mind that BBC should follow child protection policy when reporting and showing footage including children. There are clear guidelines from UNICEF on not showing or identifying children in reports. Of course if you don't consider the "refugees" or "migrants" as human persons then you obviously don't care about that policy.
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  #120  
Old 02.09.2015, 11:41
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Re: Donations for Syrian refugees in Budapest

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...they were left stranded by a field in the wee hours of the morning in Austria, where they were spotted by police patrols. But rather than being grateful for the lift to a safe spot where she and her son could drink and eat, the 32-year old Iraqi was near tears in desperation. Her son has a birth defect, she said and only the doctors in Germany can help her.


"I must get to Germany,” she pleaded. “I can't stay here.”
When told that Austria, like Germany, has an advanced medical system, Aly looked doubtful. She had never heard anyone in Baghdad talk about Austria. Germany is rich. Germany's ruler has said they will take refugees. Germany, she said, is nice. Surely then, she reasoned, doctors in Germany can help her son regain full use of his right arm.
----
Ahmet Hussein, 40, said he wants to go to Belgium because “they will give me a house.” Hussein had left his wife and children in Iraq while he found a safe place for them to live. He said the family had saved money for months to pay the human trafficker 1,500 euros for what had been promised as a safe journey.


“In Belgium, there is a good chance for my children to study,” Hussein said. Then he thought about it and added, “In Germany there are many jobs available if I learn German.”


But when challenged: How did Hussein know that? He said people talked along the way. They passed information as they passed the time.
Good read in DW. It seems Germany is the top destination because of half-truths, rumors, etc. spread by other asylum seekers, in the media, etc. It sounds kind of like the mass migration of Europeans to the USA in the early 1900's who believed the "streets were paved in gold", only to be let down by the hard reality. I think ultimately these refugees will end up in large housing ghettos with little chance of the better life they think awaits them, eg. the Muslim ghettos around Paris.
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