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View Poll Results: What would you personally prefer to happen?
I want the UK to stay in an ever-closer union 49 23.11%
I want the UK to stay in a loosely connected EU 68 32.08%
I want the UK out because the EU is bad for the UK 22 10.38%
I want the UK out because the EU is a bad thing 23 10.85%
I want the UK out because this would be good for the rest of us 17 8.02%
I don't really care 33 15.57%
Voters: 212. You may not vote on this poll

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  #4421  
Old 25.07.2016, 11:02
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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the German Empire never became democratic
ssssssssssshhhhhhhhhh, they might hear you
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  #4422  
Old 25.07.2016, 11:05
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Not at all, the more talks now the better. Just wanted to make the point that anything Hollande promises may not happen as he's unlikely to be president after next election. Latest polls have Sarkozy and Le Pen way out in front.

https://twitter.com/europeelects/sta...40010971283456
And every further terrorist attack by an Islamist is helping one of those candidates.
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  #4423  
Old 25.07.2016, 13:59
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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And every further terrorist attack by an Islamist is helping one of those candidates.
What? Did you just say it's a conspiracy?
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  #4424  
Old 25.07.2016, 20:42
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

EU ready to let UK off the hook on FMOP while still permitting full market access

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/eu-consider...ews&yptr=yahoo
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  #4425  
Old 25.07.2016, 20:49
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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EU ready to let UK off the hook on FMOP while still permitting full market access

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/eu-consider...ews&yptr=yahoo
In return for what? Continued EU membership? The UK has to follow through on Brexit in any case. How did this happen without negotiations?

I think the EU is just trying to bait. Some are very keen to inflict pain on the UK, and would hate to see the UK get away scot free. They believe it would encourage other arsonists. The real issue is supremacy of EU courts.

I would love to see them get realistic on FMOP, and even respect Switzerland's democratic principles in the process. Clearly, their spineless is on display here.
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  #4426  
Old 25.07.2016, 21:23
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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EU ready to let UK off the hook on FMOP while still permitting full market access

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/eu-consider...ews&yptr=yahoo
Sounds sensible; so nothing changes for UK except UK no longer has a vote on what happens/changes in the EU.

Hurrah for Brexit
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  #4427  
Old 25.07.2016, 21:27
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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In return for what? Continued EU membership? The UK has to follow through on Brexit in any case. How did this happen without negotiations?

I think the EU is just trying to bait. Some are very keen to inflict pain on the UK, and would hate to see the UK get away scot free. They believe it would encourage other arsonists. The real issue is supremacy of EU courts.

I would love to see them get realistic on FMOP, and even respect Switzerland's democratic principles in the process. Clearly, their spineless is on display here.
ECJ; Ensuring EU law is interpreted and applied the same in every EU country; ensuring EU countries and EU institutions abide by EU law.
Not relevant for non EU countries like UK; assuming UK will be no longer in the EU!
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  #4428  
Old 25.07.2016, 21:28
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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EU ready to let UK off the hook on FMOP while still permitting full market access

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/eu-consider...ews&yptr=yahoo
It won't be accepted: too little & too late.

The leavers are much more unhappy with the EU, it isn't just free movement of EU citizens. It is also the "Un-elected" in EU imposing new unwanted laws on the well managed Brits. (Of course the House of Lords and the Queen are not considered un-elected when arguing about democracy in government...) And of course paying the EU membership fees.

The UK is looking at China for fresh trading agreements.

I am not at all happy with a Brexit, but it is going to happen, so we might as well get used to it.
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  #4429  
Old 25.07.2016, 22:49
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Sounds sensible; so nothing changes for UK except UK no longer has a vote on what happens/changes in the EU. Hurrah for Brexit
What changes for the UK is not paying the £350m (or whatever the real figure is) per week into the EU, and not having its courts/parliament overruled by the EU. We don't want/need a vote on what the club does if we're not a member of the club.
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  #4430  
Old 25.07.2016, 23:17
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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What changes for the UK is not paying the £350m (or whatever the real figure is) per week into the EU, and not having its courts/parliament overruled by the EU. We don't want/need a vote on what the club does if we're not a member of the club.
If the UK attempts to stay in the EEA it will still pay. Amount TBD.

It will still be subject to the jurisdiction of the EFTA court.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EFTA_Court

Also, the application of the migration safeguard clause by the UK would be monitored by the EFTA court.
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  #4431  
Old 25.07.2016, 23:35
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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What changes for the UK is not paying the £350m (or whatever the real figure is) per week into the EU, and not having its courts/parliament overruled by the EU. We don't want/need a vote on what the club does if we're not a member of the club.
Not really

If the UK wants to stay in the single market then UK will have to pay and have its courts overruled by an European court.
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  #4432  
Old 25.07.2016, 23:40
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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It won't be accepted: too little & too late.

The leavers are much more unhappy with the EU, it isn't just free movement of EU citizens. It is also the "Un-elected" in EU imposing new unwanted laws on the well managed Brits. (Of course the House of Lords and the Queen are not considered un-elected when arguing about democracy in government...) And of course paying the EU membership fees.

The UK is looking at China for fresh trading agreements.

I am not at all happy with a Brexit, but it is going to happen, so we might as well get used to it.
"The UK is looking at China for fresh trading agreements. " Is China planning to be a net exporter or a net importer?
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  #4433  
Old 25.07.2016, 23:46
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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It won't be accepted: too little & too late.
I don' think FMOP is the biggest problem with the EU. On the contrary, I guess I could live with FMOP if some of the other stuff were sorted out.
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  #4434  
Old 25.07.2016, 23:56
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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It will still be subject to the jurisdiction of the EFTA court.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EFTA_Court
.
My understanding of EFTA courts is it is limited to trade issues, and not to all encompassing social issues as the ECJ is often used today for EU members.
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  #4435  
Old 26.07.2016, 00:20
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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My understanding of EFTA courts is it is limited to trade issues, and not to all encompassing social issues as the ECJ is often used today for EU members.
The ECJ does not deal with social issues.

The ECHR does.

Leaving the EU does not change the UKs participation in the ECHR.
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  #4436  
Old 26.07.2016, 00:23
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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The ECJ does not deal with social issues.

The ECHR does.

Leaving the EU does not change the UKs participation in the ECHR.
Here's an example:
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36419525
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  #4437  
Old 26.07.2016, 00:37
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

From the EFTA court wiki:
" Under these rules, the EFTA Court shall follow the relevant case law of the ECJ on provisions of Union law that are identical in substance to provisions of EEA law rendered prior to the date of signature of the EEA Agreement (2 May 1992) and shall pay due account to the principles laid down by the European Court of Justice's relevant case law rendered after that date."

So if it falls in their jurisdiction, the EFTA courts take into account relevant ECJ case law.
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  #4438  
Old 26.07.2016, 01:10
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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From the EFTA court wiki:
" Under these rules, the EFTA Court shall follow the relevant case law of the ECJ on provisions of Union law that are identical in substance to provisions of EEA law rendered prior to the date of signature of the EEA Agreement (2 May 1992) and shall pay due account to the principles laid down by the European Court of Justice's relevant case law rendered after that date."

So if it falls in their jurisdiction, the EFTA courts take into account relevant ECJ case law.
I posted this more than once but it falls on deaf ears; always deaf or selectively
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  #4439  
Old 26.07.2016, 01:14
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I posted this more than once but it falls on deaf ears; always deaf or selectively
Also, kind of disappointing, that in all the huge complications and implications of Brexit, all that some immediately focus on is, that just maybe, the UK may be able to force women to take off their headscarves in the future.
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  #4440  
Old 26.07.2016, 01:15
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

This is an example of compliance (or not) with EU anti-discrimination laws which is within the remit of the ECJ.

I assume if people do not like the final ECJ judgement then they could appeal to the ECHJ?
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