Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Off-Topic > Off-Topic > International affairs/politics
View Poll Results: What would you personally prefer to happen?
I want the UK to stay in an ever-closer union 49 23.11%
I want the UK to stay in a loosely connected EU 68 32.08%
I want the UK out because the EU is bad for the UK 22 10.38%
I want the UK out because the EU is a bad thing 23 10.85%
I want the UK out because this would be good for the rest of us 17 8.02%
I don't really care 33 15.57%
Voters: 212. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #4581  
Old 12.08.2016, 00:37
Wollishofener's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Glattbrugg
Posts: 19,028
Groaned at 333 Times in 258 Posts
Thanked 11,712 Times in 6,857 Posts
Wollishofener has a reputation beyond reputeWollishofener has a reputation beyond reputeWollishofener has a reputation beyond reputeWollishofener has a reputation beyond reputeWollishofener has a reputation beyond reputeWollishofener has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
If you mean EU countries, no they can't. It is illegal under EU law for an EU member state to make (or even negotiate) its own trade deals. On trade the EU must legally operate as a single block.


Nothing else makes sense anyway for a trade block.

There was no SINGLE BLOCK for Switzerland but CH had to gain approvals for all the bilaterals from all EU countries (THIS is what I mean)

Last edited by 22 yards; 12.08.2016 at 09:45. Reason: Fixed quote formatting & punctuation
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Wollishofener for this useful post:
  #4582  
Old 12.08.2016, 00:52
marton's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Zürich
Posts: 7,516
Groaned at 164 Times in 139 Posts
Thanked 8,532 Times in 4,674 Posts
marton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
There was no SINGLE BLOCK for Switzerland but CH had to gain approvals for all the bilaterals from all EU countries (THIS is what I mean)
All major EU decisions have to be approved by every EU country; the Swiss bilaterals would have been blocked if one EU country had not approved.

Last edited by 22 yards; 12.08.2016 at 09:46. Reason: Fixed quote formatting
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank marton for this useful post:
  #4583  
Old 12.08.2016, 08:51
baboon's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Rheintal
Posts: 2,463
Groaned at 73 Times in 64 Posts
Thanked 2,928 Times in 1,462 Posts
baboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
There was no SINGLE BLOCK for Switzerland but CH had to gain approvals for all the bilaterals from all EU countries (THIS isv what I mean
I think you're confusing "Block" as in a collective group of countries and "Block" as in a veto.

1. The EU is a trading block.

2. Any one EU country could block (veto) the Swiss bilaterals

Two completely different meanings.
Reply With Quote
  #4584  
Old 12.08.2016, 09:47
22 yards's Avatar
Only in moderation
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Basel-Land
Posts: 6,602
Groaned at 188 Times in 147 Posts
Thanked 10,957 Times in 4,526 Posts
22 yards has a reputation beyond repute22 yards has a reputation beyond repute22 yards has a reputation beyond repute22 yards has a reputation beyond repute22 yards has a reputation beyond repute22 yards has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
I think you're confusing "Block" as in a collective group of countries and "Block" as in a veto.

1. The EU is a trading block.

2. Any one EU country could block (veto) the Swiss bilaterals

Two completely different meanings.
Which is why we differentiate between them by spelling: trade bloc vs any other sort of block.
Reply With Quote
  #4585  
Old 12.08.2016, 14:28
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Ostschweiz
Posts: 3,022
Groaned at 99 Times in 79 Posts
Thanked 3,745 Times in 1,935 Posts
Urs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
the Swiss bilaterals would have been blocked if one EU country had not approved.
I would like to add that this only applies to the Bilaterals1 and is only correct due to the all-or-nothing clause (Guilloutineklausel). Only FMOP actually required ratification by all national parliaments.
Reply With Quote
  #4586  
Old 12.08.2016, 14:32
baboon's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Rheintal
Posts: 2,463
Groaned at 73 Times in 64 Posts
Thanked 2,928 Times in 1,462 Posts
baboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Which is why we differentiate between them by spelling: trade bloc vs any other sort of block.
Oops - true. My excuse is that the spelling changed since I was a school
Reply With Quote
  #4587  
Old 12.08.2016, 19:48
lewton's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Berlin, Deutschland
Posts: 608
Groaned at 16 Times in 14 Posts
Thanked 507 Times in 292 Posts
lewton has earned some respectlewton has earned some respect
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Oops - true. My excuse is that the spelling changed since I was a school
So now you're not a school anymore? What have you turned into?
Reply With Quote
  #4588  
Old 13.08.2016, 14:13
marton's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Zürich
Posts: 7,516
Groaned at 164 Times in 139 Posts
Thanked 8,532 Times in 4,674 Posts
marton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Not really relevant but anyway;
One of former UKIP leader Nigel Farage’s closest political allies faces years in jail after he was detained in Chicago on suspicious of offering to launder money for drug lords.

George Cottrell, 22, is in custody in the US awaiting trial on 21 charges including attempted extortion, money laundering and fraud, after he was led away in handcuffs.

Cottrell’s bank and email accounts have been frozen, leaving Mr Farage unable to access his personal diary, it has been claimed.

Source
Reply With Quote
  #4589  
Old 14.08.2016, 11:20
marton's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Zürich
Posts: 7,516
Groaned at 164 Times in 139 Posts
Thanked 8,532 Times in 4,674 Posts
marton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Good to have this point clarified
"U.K. Vows to Match EU Subsidies for Farmers Post-Brexit
Treasury chief Philip Hammond seeks to reassure amid concerns over economic uncertainty"

"The government will also pick up the tab for any EU funding agreed for economic development or scientific research that extends beyond the U.K.’s departure, the Treasury said in a statement."

Source
Reply With Quote
  #4590  
Old 16.08.2016, 08:44
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Zürich
Posts: 784
Groaned at 87 Times in 56 Posts
Thanked 1,206 Times in 549 Posts
TobiasM has a reputation beyond reputeTobiasM has a reputation beyond reputeTobiasM has a reputation beyond reputeTobiasM has a reputation beyond reputeTobiasM has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Interesting article on the consequences that Britain might feel being similar to the restrictions that have Switzerland are starting to feel after the immigration referendum. Its quite something to be so staunchly anti-immigration and not expect consequences in a global economy.

Theresa May’s Swiss holiday will show her just how bad Brexit could be
Reply With Quote
  #4591  
Old 16.08.2016, 10:02
marton's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Zürich
Posts: 7,516
Groaned at 164 Times in 139 Posts
Thanked 8,532 Times in 4,674 Posts
marton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Three Brexit ministers - Mr Johnson, the foreign secretary, David Davis, the Brexit secretary, and Liam Fox, international trade secretary.

I wonder how they will divide the Brexit work between them, who does what?

David Davis has the title Brexit secretary so could take the lead but only a third of the people in the Foreign Office European directorate moved over to him. Consequently Boris has more "European" people and anyway is the more senior in the Cabinet hierarchy.

Lots of scope for disputes over responsibilities
As forecast the first sign of turf wars; Liam Fox tried to wrest control of Foreign Office duties from Boris Johnson Source.

Quote "Emily Thornberry, the shadow foreign secretary, said May was to blame for the jostling between the departments. “She created these three separate departments, not because it made sense in terms of coordinating Whitehall’s management of Brexit, but just to buy the loyalty of Liam Fox, Boris Johnson and David Davis,” she said."
Reply With Quote
  #4592  
Old 16.08.2016, 11:44
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Zurich
Posts: 89
Groaned at 2 Times in 2 Posts
Thanked 68 Times in 39 Posts
Zurichowl has made some interesting contributions
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

And Theresa May's response is to tell them to just get on with it:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...-games-and-ge/

And for all the people who are negative about BREXIT, some counter news. I know someone who works in a London Bank and they're all looking forward to it, can't come soon enough. Corporation Tax will be lowered or something and then companies will come. London is planning to build many sky scrapers and develop.

Sure it's only word of mouth and I have no links, but so what, the truth is no one knows what will happen.
Reply With Quote
  #4593  
Old 16.08.2016, 12:35
marton's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Zürich
Posts: 7,516
Groaned at 164 Times in 139 Posts
Thanked 8,532 Times in 4,674 Posts
marton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
And Theresa May's response is to tell them to just get on with it:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...-games-and-ge/

And for all the people who are negative about BREXIT, some counter news. I know someone who works in a London Bank and they're all looking forward to it, can't come soon enough. Corporation Tax will be lowered or something and then companies will come. London is planning to build many sky scrapers and develop.

Sure it's only word of mouth and I have no links, but so what, the truth is no one knows what will happen.
"Theresa May's response is to tell them to just get on with it" instead of better defining their roles

"Corporation Tax will be lowered" The published proposal is to lower it from 20% to 18%; compare this with Ireland where it is 12.5% and companies will have guaranteed access to the "single market".

Does not look so exciting to me
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank marton for this useful post:
  #4594  
Old 16.08.2016, 12:43
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Zürich
Posts: 784
Groaned at 87 Times in 56 Posts
Thanked 1,206 Times in 549 Posts
TobiasM has a reputation beyond reputeTobiasM has a reputation beyond reputeTobiasM has a reputation beyond reputeTobiasM has a reputation beyond reputeTobiasM has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
AI know someone who works in a London Bank and they're all looking forward to it, can't come soon enough.
Doubtful that they are all looking forward to it, as its going to screw most of them over in their professional lifetimes, because that is how long it will take to recover.
Reply With Quote
  #4595  
Old 16.08.2016, 13:13
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Zurich
Posts: 89
Groaned at 2 Times in 2 Posts
Thanked 68 Times in 39 Posts
Zurichowl has made some interesting contributions
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Doubtful that they are all looking forward to it, as its going to screw most of them over in their professional lifetimes, because that is how long it will take to recover.
Just a matter of interest why do you say doubtful they said that, when in fact that's exactly what they said.

As I say you and I both have no idea what will happen. You take the negative angle, I use my views for the positive angle.

The telegraph article says that sources close to May say she's pressing ahead and is not wavering.

True it can all change and we believe what we want.

It was stated during the referendum that the UK has a trade deficit with Europe. So isn't it in Europe's interest to keep the UK on-board. All this hard-talk from the Euro ministers has been ignored so far.

Everyone who is negative plays the angle of how great Europe is to be in. Is it really doing so well at the moment when you look at it and if so why? I'm willing to be convinced.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Zurichowl for this useful post:
  #4596  
Old 16.08.2016, 13:38
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 13,721
Groaned at 209 Times in 181 Posts
Thanked 11,032 Times in 6,257 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Doubtful that they are all looking forward to it, as its going to screw most of them over in their professional lifetimes, because that is how long it will take to recover.


The Banks are all in effect Bankrupt & should be wound up rather than supported.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post:
  #4597  
Old 16.08.2016, 13:53
Jim2007's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Kt. Bern
Posts: 2,086
Groaned at 34 Times in 32 Posts
Thanked 2,065 Times in 1,054 Posts
Jim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
"Corporation Tax will be lowered" The published proposal is to lower it from 20% to 18%; compare this with Ireland where it is 12.5% and companies will have guaranteed access to the "single market".
It's not just that, there is also cheap office space and facilities, although colleagues tell me certain banks have negotiated options on their preferred location just in case... It's been a few years since I was in the IFSC area, but since the building boom, there were lots of new office buildings standing empty, even new trams and bus stops, space for newsagents, coffee shops etc...

For staff transfers it's an English speaking environment within easy reach of home and you'll still get the papers, the BBC and the fried breakfast, but watch out for the builder's breakfast roll:



The only really issue for staff would be the cost of housing which is rising.
__________________
"There is no passion to be found playing small - in settling for a life that is less than the one you are capable of living." - Nelson Mandela
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Jim2007 for this useful post:
  #4598  
Old 16.08.2016, 14:31
marton's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Zürich
Posts: 7,516
Groaned at 164 Times in 139 Posts
Thanked 8,532 Times in 4,674 Posts
marton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Just a matter of interest why do you say doubtful they said that, when in fact that's exactly what they said.

As I say you and I both have no idea what will happen. You take the negative angle, I use my views for the positive angle.

The telegraph article says that sources close to May say she's pressing ahead and is not wavering.

True it can all change and we believe what we want.

It was stated during the referendum that the UK has a trade deficit with Europe. So isn't it in Europe's interest to keep the UK on-board. All this hard-talk from the Euro ministers has been ignored so far.

Everyone who is negative plays the angle of how great Europe is to be in. Is it really doing so well at the moment when you look at it and if so why? I'm willing to be convinced.
"how great Europe is to be in" It is because of the "single market".
Without that it would mean that businesses were subject to steep tariffs on goods exported to the EU, including a 10% duty on cars and 12% on clothing, and having no access to the EU’s service markets or financial service markets.
Currently the proportion of all UK goods and services exported going to the EU was 44% last year so it is vital to retain that.
Reply With Quote
  #4599  
Old 16.08.2016, 15:43
Jim2007's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Kt. Bern
Posts: 2,086
Groaned at 34 Times in 32 Posts
Thanked 2,065 Times in 1,054 Posts
Jim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond reputeJim2007 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
It was stated during the referendum that the UK has a trade deficit with Europe. So isn't it in Europe's interest to keep the UK on-board. All this hard-talk from the Euro ministers has been ignored so far.
Well there is a very big difference between trying to keep someone on board and giving up you fundamental principles. And since recent UK exports to the EU accounted for 48% of it's exports, the possibility of loosing preferential access to it's biggest market, a relatively wealth market within easy proximity, should make the UK more accommodating don't you think???

You also have to keep in mind that trade with the UK benefits some countries more than others, who are even less likely to break with fundamental principles. And then there are others like Spain who sees it as a golden opportunity to gain some control over Gibraltar and Ireland has stated that they will not tolerate an international border on the island of Ireland, which seems to suggest that NI would need to remain in some kind of customs union with the EU, which no doubt would lead to Scotland demanding the same. This means that there are at least two potential vetos on the EU side. EFTA membership now also seems in doubt with Norway stating that it would veto such an application as it feels the UK would create an imbalance within the group.

One thing about article 50 that people overlook, is that all trade agreements the UK benefits from as an EU member will also have to be addressed at the same time. And with limited negotiators available this will also be a challenge.

There are definitely very serious challenges ahead.
__________________
"There is no passion to be found playing small - in settling for a life that is less than the one you are capable of living." - Nelson Mandela
Reply With Quote
  #4600  
Old 16.08.2016, 17:36
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Zurich
Posts: 89
Groaned at 2 Times in 2 Posts
Thanked 68 Times in 39 Posts
Zurichowl has made some interesting contributions
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

So the single market is the big benefit. But if I understand it correctly, the UK has a trade deficit with Europe at the moment. How can that be a positive?

The way the UK trades with the European market has to now be re-negotiated and everything is then open. Do you really think the single market will go away for the UK? The UK does have a strong hand, it gave a lot to Europe (more than it took). Both sides realize this, regardless of what they say publicly.

People are quoting precedents like Canada, Norway and Switzerland, but the UK is different and there is nothing to stop it negotiating it's own deal and hopefully it does that.

Free movement of people is open for debate and can now be controlled. The leaders of the EU have less control over the UK.

Whether this all works out well or not is unknown for us all, but the reason people voted for BREXIT is the opportunity to have these changes. I have seen a lot of the coverage in the UK and it doesn't change. They are willing to wait it out. The remainers had their chance to put their case and failed miserably.
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 12 (4 members and 8 guests)
greenmount, JoeUK, Mikers, Aeneas
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Latest Referendum, what will be consequences for EU (C permit and B permit) holders? expat2014 Permits/visas/government 3 11.02.2014 08:59
Importing vehicles and the VAT consequences in Switzerland from France BEFO Finance/banking/taxation 6 07.08.2013 15:11
The (Available in CH) Dog Food Review Thread meloncollie Pet corner 44 08.05.2012 20:15
Common-law marriage and consequences in CH Mishto Family matters/health 9 01.10.2011 22:03
Something for the Brits: M&S in CH mark Daily life 11 15.11.2007 12:18


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 12:39.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0