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View Poll Results: What would you personally prefer to happen?
I want the UK to stay in an ever-closer union 49 23.11%
I want the UK to stay in a loosely connected EU 68 32.08%
I want the UK out because the EU is bad for the UK 22 10.38%
I want the UK out because the EU is a bad thing 23 10.85%
I want the UK out because this would be good for the rest of us 17 8.02%
I don't really care 33 15.57%
Voters: 212. You may not vote on this poll

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  #6481  
Old 07.11.2016, 23:55
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Where's the fraud? The slogan said:

"We send the EU £350 a week, let's fund our NHS instead"

There was no promise, no fraud, it was merely a suggestion of what could be done.
If it was only £350, I doubt we'd be having this discussion Devil's in the detail.

It pissed me off that all this was 'promised' / 'suggested' by a bunch of people who didn't have the power and authority to act upon it, but regardless, they banged on about this 'pledge' for months on end.

And now we've got the Empress defending the freedom of the press over the independence of the judiciary, when she should be telling them that they have to take ownership and responsibility for what they print and peddle. I haven't bought a newspaper for almost 20yrs, since the endless weeks of dross after Diana's death.
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  #6482  
Old 08.11.2016, 00:59
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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You just need to look at the FTSE 100 index to realise leaving will be good for British.
Really? What is the relationship then? Do British companies employ more staff or increase business as a result of a change in their stock price?

Or is it that everything is on sale due to the FX rate and investor's expect to make a killing short term due to company profits being boosted by the FX rather than economic activity?
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  #6483  
Old 08.11.2016, 09:18
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Really? What is the relationship then? Do British companies employ more staff or increase business as a result of a change in their stock price?

Or is it that everything is on sale due to the FX rate and investor's expect to make a killing short term due to company profits being boosted by the FX rather than economic activity?
Of course. It's also why the FTSE 250 is about flat nominally, which including the £ drop means about 10% loss in value.
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  #6484  
Old 08.11.2016, 09:21
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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It pissed me off that all this was 'promised' / 'suggested' by a bunch of people who didn't have the power and authority to act upon it, but regardless, they banged on about this 'pledge' for months on end.
You simply fail to realize that it's Ok for Leave to lie but not for the former government (Cameron).
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  #6485  
Old 08.11.2016, 09:26
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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It pissed me off that all this was 'promised' / 'suggested' by a bunch of people who didn't have the power and authority to act upon it, but regardless, they banged on about this 'pledge' for months on end.
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I'm a British person.

I was never, for one moment, under the impression that the referendum was legally binding.

I was never, for one moment, under the impression that Theresa disMay was able to invoke Article 50 without either winning a General Election of having a Parliamentary vote on the matter.

I did take legal counsel on the matter and had that much confirmed a few days after Cameron resigned.
Lol.

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And now we've got the Empress defending the freedom of the press over the independence of the judiciary, when she should be telling them that they have to take ownership and responsibility for what they print and peddle.
Normally it's only thick Scousers that want to see newspapers banned.
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  #6486  
Old 08.11.2016, 09:48
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I know several people who voted remain, would vote to leave if there was a second vote. I don't know anyone who voted leave who regrets it.
Of course "several people" statistically outweighs any opinion poll.


Happily I only know 1 person that voted to leave in my personal circles so remain must have won by a landslide.
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  #6487  
Old 08.11.2016, 09:54
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Well I get your point - polls were indeed pretty close.

31.4 against 4.2 is a bit more convincing that 48 / 52 though, no?
Personally I would take them all with a pinch of salt.
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  #6488  
Old 08.11.2016, 12:48
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Lol.



Normally it's only thick Scousers that don't want to see newspapers banned prosecuted for contempt of court.
Fixed that for you

Last edited by marton; 08.11.2016 at 13:13.
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  #6489  
Old 08.11.2016, 13:04
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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You clearly fail to understand the principle of the separation of powers.

The principle of separation of powers states that the executive, legislative, and judiciary powers of government should be divided into different branches and not concentrated in one.
These departments should be separate and distinct because of the corrupting nature of power.

The UK is not alone in this approach, democratic countries do this.

You only have to look at the example of Turkey to see how power can be abused by blurring this situation.

Allowing May to push through major changes without Parliament is the first step down a slippery path
I see the irony of it was lost some how and I should have littered the post with various smileys. Suggesting a "Henry the 8th" solution was obviously too subtle a signal for this readership.
But, anyway, following up on what you say, the USA would have been a far better example than Turkey for corrupt power. There, the court system is firmly under the control of the executive, allowing the president to make all sorts of threats of massive financial penalties against the allies and others who do not toe the line, and acting on them, or simply using these allies to fund the massive deficit.
BP (GB) c. $50Bn
Credit Lyonnais (FR) c. $10Bn (More if FR had sold 2 boats to Russia)
Volkswagen (DE) $??Bn
UBS (CH) $??Bn
etc. etc.
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  #6490  
Old 08.11.2016, 13:31
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I see the irony of it was lost some how and I should have littered the post with various smileys. Suggesting a "Henry the 8th" solution was obviously too subtle a signal for this readership.
But, anyway, following up on what you say, the USA would have been a far better example than Turkey for corrupt power. There, the court system is firmly under the control of the executive, allowing the president to make all sorts of threats of massive financial penalties against the allies and others who do not toe the line, and acting on them, or simply using these allies to fund the massive deficit.
BP (GB) c. $50Bn
Credit Lyonnais (FR) c. $10Bn (More if FR had sold 2 boats to Russia)
Volkswagen (DE) $??Bn
UBS (CH) $??Bn
etc. etc.
Sigh!

The separation of power means that legislative arm makes the laws. The responsibility of the judiciary arm is to enforce the law and where the law is not clear then to interpret it.

If the US executive and legislative arms make laws against pollution or financial fraud then the judges have to uphold these laws.

The situation in Turkey is different where judges who enforce the law are fired or jailed to be replaced by more "flexible" judges.

Consequently I reject your US example.

The whole point of the Brexit case was May was considered not to have followed the Constitution.
Of course May could have gone to Parliament in the first place to create a new law to fix her problem but she chose not to do this and not to follow the risk free route.

The executive and legislative arms can always create new laws.
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  #6491  
Old 08.11.2016, 14:16
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Normally it's only thick Scousers that want to see newspapers banned.
Where did I say I want to see papers banned?

Freedom of the press and free speech go hand in hand. You say it. You own it. You take responsibiity for it. The law of each land has the right to contest what you say or print, in or out of court. If you tell your neighbour that you're going to kill them on Friday, and keep saying it every day, don't be shocked when the police turn up at your door on Thursday. It's common sense.
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  #6492  
Old 08.11.2016, 14:21
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Where did I say I want to see papers banned?

Freedom of the press and free speech go hand in hand. You say it. You own it. You take responsibiity for it. The law of each land has the right to contest what you say or print, in or out of court. If you tell your neighbour that you're going to kill them on Friday, and keep saying it every day, don't be shocked when the police turn up at your door on Thursday. It's common sense.
Freedom of speech is one thing, incitement to violence is another. And there's already laws in place for the latter.
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  #6493  
Old 08.11.2016, 14:26
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Freedom of speech is one thing, incitement to violence is another. And there's already laws in place for the latter.
Precisely, so when the press say judges should be hanged for treason, is that not incitement to violence?
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  #6494  
Old 08.11.2016, 14:43
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Precisely, so when the press say judges should be hanged for treason, is that not incitement to violence?
No newspapers have said they should be hanged for treason.
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  #6495  
Old 08.11.2016, 15:00
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Oh no, the Scots are trying to scupper Brexit.

Scottish government to intervene in Brexit case
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  #6496  
Old 08.11.2016, 15:53
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

The woman can't have it both ways. Either Scotland stays in the UK and abides by the decisions of the whole of the UK's population or she goes independent and tries to manage on her own.

As has been said by others on this thread the UK Parliament is sovereign, not Scottish, not Welsh, not Northern Irish.

Edit: Perhaps Ms Sturgeon should be careful. Presumably the UK Parliament could decide to undevolve the powers it's granted.
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  #6497  
Old 08.11.2016, 16:04
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

I doubt that the current government would have a sufficient majority to reverse Scottish devolution, unless all the Tories actually supported that, or that it would get past a Labour and Lib-Dem dominated House of Lords.
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  #6498  
Old 08.11.2016, 22:24
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

The EU were talking about toasters and kettles again today

Could someone explain how having less powerful kettles will save energy?
I mean to boil a litre of water takes a certain amount of energy; whether you have a high power kettle or a low power kettle makes no difference.

A low power kettle will take a longer time to boil water so will lose more energy to the surrounding atmosphere and therefore will use slightly more energy than a fast boiler?
Or did I miss an important point somewhere?

A kettle that senses the water has reached boiling point and switches off automatically will save energy versus manual off switching; more so if it senses this very quickly?
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  #6499  
Old 08.11.2016, 23:15
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Associated British Foods reported today its business would benefit from the Sterling weakness.

Berlin is claiming today that five small companies have relocated from London and a further 39 are in discussions.

Meanwhile in Parliament the Chancellor reported more than 30 individuals and companies are under investigation for tax fraud and financial crime linked to revelations made in the Panama Papers.

Looks like bread prices will rise due to increased commodity prices even though British bakers are switching to British wheat.
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  #6500  
Old 09.11.2016, 00:00
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7403161.html

To be honest I hope they throw the book at key reps of both sides. This kind of campaigning should never be allowed again.

Treating the electorate as idiots who will swallow any old BS in the insane ways they did just to get votes is unforgivable.

Not to mention the renewed and heightened hatred festering in communities.
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