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View Poll Results: What would you personally prefer to happen?
I want the UK to stay in an ever-closer union 49 23.11%
I want the UK to stay in a loosely connected EU 68 32.08%
I want the UK out because the EU is bad for the UK 22 10.38%
I want the UK out because the EU is a bad thing 23 10.85%
I want the UK out because this would be good for the rest of us 17 8.02%
I don't really care 33 15.57%
Voters: 212. You may not vote on this poll

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  #6801  
Old 25.11.2016, 13:44
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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It's a shame we don't have Mrs Thatcher as PM, you could be sure wastage would be cut, not this continual borrowing of extra money thats bizarrely dubbed austerity.
We can't live on perceived 'past glories' and do a Lazarus on Maggie.

We're stuck with 'Spreadsheet Phil and The Egotistical Charlatans' doing a two year Farewell tour of Europe before embarking on their World 'Begging Bowl' tour.

We should relocate Parliament to Churchill's Bunkers for the next three years whilst Westminster is tarted up, link up the air con to their public approval ratings, anyone who can't be wedged into to bunkers must attend compulsory video conferences from a cave, and only when we all approve of the progress made, should the wizened creatures be allowed to see the sun again.
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  #6802  
Old 25.11.2016, 14:21
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

From Politico: Brexit voters less likely to change their underpants every day

"The polling organization YouGov carried out a survey into the U.K.’s clothes washing habits. It found that 84 percent of those surveyed changed their underpants every day.

That figure rose to 89 percent for those who voted Remain, and fell to 81 percent for Leave voters.

That’s a large enough gap to have swung the referendum result.

Of the four biggest political parties, UKIP voters were most likely not to change their underwear every day, with just 79 percent saying they made a daily change. For Labour and Liberal Democrat voters, the figure was 87 percent, and for Tories it was 85 percent.

One percent of all those surveyed did not know how often they changed their underpants."


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  #6803  
Old 25.11.2016, 18:15
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Even John Major's weighing in on this now. Didn't expect that!

Quote:
John Major: case for second Brexit referendum is credible

‘Tyranny of majority’ should not dictate manner of exit from EU, says former PM in remarks likely to anger pro-Brexit Tories



https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ond-referendum
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  #6804  
Old 25.11.2016, 18:41
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

That's interesting. Perhaps Major and Blair are coordinating their efforts.
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  #6805  
Old 25.11.2016, 18:58
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Even John Major's weighing in on this now. Didn't expect that!


https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ond-referendum
yes its turning into a powerful old-guard of people. I think they have the best chance of altering course because they all know what they are doing unlike the current collection of infant chimpanzee's that pass off as a government and opposition. If I were Farage, if Major, Blair and other big old timers join us, I would be worried. People might not like Tony Blair or John Major, but they know what they are doing.
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  #6806  
Old 25.11.2016, 19:43
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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yes its turning into a powerful old-guard of people. I think they have the best chance of altering course because they all know what they are doing unlike the current collection of infant chimpanzee's that pass off as a government and opposition. If I were Farage, if Major, Blair and other big old timers join us, I would be worried. People might not like Tony Blair or John Major, but they know what they are doing.
I am not sure if they are really powerful; maybe just bored and dabbling.
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  #6807  
Old 25.11.2016, 20:52
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Even John Major's weighing in on this now. Didn't expect that!


https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ond-referendum
John Major would do well to remember he ran a government which the majority of the population didn't vote for. He can shove his "tyranny of the majority" up his arse.
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  #6808  
Old 25.11.2016, 22:04
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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John Major would do well to remember he ran a government which the majority of the population didn't vote for. He can shove his "tyranny of the majority" up his arse.
You mean like the majority of the population who didn't vote for Brexit?
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  #6809  
Old 25.11.2016, 23:42
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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John Major would do well to remember he ran a government which the majority of the population didn't vote for. He can shove his "tyranny of the majority" up his arse.
You mean like every UK government ever?

OK apart from a couple of coalitions.
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  #6810  
Old 25.11.2016, 23:47
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Net savings of 200 million a week, whats not to like
Perhaps that according to the same set of forecasts it costs about 500 million a week
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  #6811  
Old 26.11.2016, 12:37
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

This would be an interesting option if it came to fruition...

Quote:
Britons could pay to keep EU benefits post-Brexit under new plans

The European Parliament's lead Brexit negotiator backs plans to let UK citizens "opt in" individually to EU membership.
http://news.sky.com/story/britons-co...plans-10672332
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  #6812  
Old 26.11.2016, 13:09
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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This would be an interesting option if it came to fruition...

http://news.sky.com/story/britons-co...plans-10672332
To have substance it would require a treaty change....

Of course there is always room for something like the Certificate of Irish Heritage that the Irish government sell to mainly Americans! After all 17m * €150 pa is a nice little earner and it has potential to go global.
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  #6813  
Old 28.11.2016, 08:44
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

And yet another legal challenge to end up in the courts.

"The government is facing a legal battle over whether the UK stays inside the single market after it has left the EU, the BBC has learned.

Lawyers say uncertainty over the UK's European Economic Area membership means ministers could be stopped from taking Britain out of the single market.

They will argue the UK will not leave the EEA automatically when it leaves the EU and Parliament should decide.

But the government said EEA membership ends when the UK leaves the EU."

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-38126899
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  #6814  
Old 28.11.2016, 10:24
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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And yet another legal challenge to end up in the courts.

"The government is facing a legal battle over whether the UK stays inside the single market after it has left the EU, the BBC has learned.

Lawyers say uncertainty over the UK's European Economic Area membership means ministers could be stopped from taking Britain out of the single market.

They will argue the UK will not leave the EEA automatically when it leaves the EU and Parliament should decide.

But the government said EEA membership ends when the UK leaves the EU."

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-38126899
As I wrote in post 5281 "The whole thing is new and potentially a legal minefield. "

So far we have had legal challenges from Northern Ireland and UK which have been referred to the Supreme Court where Scotland and Wales plus two other groups have been given permission to join in.

Now this latest challenge is a question about EEA rules so potentially could be finally decided in a European court; the article did not mention this possibility!
Quote:
At the judicial level [EEA] disagreements may, depending on the parties to the dispute and the issue at stake, be brought before ECJ, the EFTA Court of Justice, national courts and ad hoc arbitration tribunals.
It is interesting to mention the referendum was specifically about leaving the EU; it did not mention leaving the EEA.

Quote:
the EU rules largely apply within EEA Member States. In particular, the four fundamental freedoms of the EU – free movement of capital, goods, services and persons – apply in full to all EEA Member States,
Quote:
The EEA Agreement provides that all EU legislation in the policy areas of the Single Market shall be incorporated into the EEA Agreement
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the EEA Agreement does not cover EU policies such as: common agriculture and fisheries policies; customs union; common trade policy; common foreign and security policy; justice and home affairs; taxation or economic and monetary union.
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  #6815  
Old 28.11.2016, 10:36
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Interesting article here (might be behind a paywall) in the FT today about which cards UK could play in the Brexit negotiation.

One new one is an attempt to split the EU negotiating power and solidarity of the 27 countries by offering Eastern European countries special terms for their citizens in UK or even offering them financial support; how well this would be accepted by the Brexiteers is a good question!
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  #6816  
Old 28.11.2016, 11:22
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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They will argue the UK will not leave the EEA automatically when it leaves the EU and Parliament should decide.
How exactly is that UK's decision?

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As I wrote in post 5281 "The whole thing is new and potentially a legal minefield. "
Of course it is. That makes explicit order by UK Parliament all the more important.

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It is interesting to mention the referendum was specifically about leaving the EU; it did not mention leaving the EEA.
§50.3:
"The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2 [.. unless extension is agreed upon ...]"

"Treaties" applies to the treaties of Nice, Amsterdam, Maastricht and the Single European Act (yes, not the Single European Market Act). If challenged (who could? certainly not just any EU individual?) the ECJ will have to decide what is included, in my mind there is no doubt on what they'll rule.

Last edited by Urs Max; 28.11.2016 at 11:37.
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  #6817  
Old 28.11.2016, 13:03
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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How exactly is that UK's decision?


Of course it is. That makes explicit order by UK Parliament all the more important.


§50.3:
"The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2 [.. unless extension is agreed upon ...]"

"Treaties" applies to the treaties of Nice, Amsterdam, Maastricht and the Single European Act (yes, not the Single European Market Act). If challenged (who could? certainly not just any EU individual?) the ECJ will have to decide what is included, in my mind there is no doubt on what they'll rule.
BTW, membership of EEA is not automatic for an EU country. They have to apply and the membership agreement will only enter into force once formally ratified by EU Member States and the EEA/EFTA countries; Norway, Iceland and Lichtenstein.
For example Croatia ran into problems and had a long negotiation with Norway before membership was agreed.
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  #6818  
Old 29.11.2016, 14:09
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Apparently May aims for a hard Brexit, i.e. no EEA, according to info leaked by the telegraph.
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  #6819  
Old 29.11.2016, 14:18
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Almost 7000 posts and the UK is still part of the EU.
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  #6820  
Old 29.11.2016, 22:36
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Holy cow! This would put the cat amongst the pigeons if it happened....

Quote:
Advocate general Eleanor Sharpston QC said Luxembourg would not interfere with the Government's Supreme Court appeal against a ruling that the Brexit process cannot begin without a parliamentary vote.
However, she said the ECJ was "fully aware of the sensitivity and delicacy and constitutional importance of the issue" - anticipating that the Supreme Court may refer it for a hearing in the European court's 28-member chamber of judges, which includes one British judge.
http://news.sky.com/story/european-c...le-50-10677193
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