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  #201  
Old 25.05.2016, 10:53
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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You're ignoring central parts of the story:

The piper offered to rid the city of all mice and rats, for a fee of course. Once the city notables had agreed, he played his tune upon which the mice and rats came to him. He walked into the Weser (a river) with the animals following him to their wet death. But the notables refused to pay, so he left the city angy and embittered. Some time later he returned in a different shape(body?) to play his pipe once again during church service time. Only this time the children came forward, and followed him out of town when he left. Nobody ever heard of them.

How is this antisemitic?
ah yes, and no doubt you also believe George Orwell's animal farm is just a nice story about some cute farm animals who get rid of the nasty farmer and then have some fun adventures together. All those who see allegory in it, or god forbid, a criticism of socialism, are just deluding themselves, right?
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  #202  
Old 19.07.2016, 01:06
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

Commons votes for Trident renewal by majority of 355
Motion to update nuclear deterrent passed by 472 to 117, with support of over half Labour MPs but not Jeremy Corbyn.

Source

Labour party needs to somehow become unified!

In total, 140 Labour MPs voted in favour of the motion and 47 against, with 40 absent and one abstention.
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  #203  
Old 19.07.2016, 08:55
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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ah yes, and no doubt you also believe George Orwell's animal farm is just a nice story about some cute farm animals who get rid of the nasty farmer and then have some fun adventures together. All those who see allegory in it, or god forbid, a criticism of socialism, are just deluding themselves, right?
It is a critique of the Russian Revolution and its aftermath, not socialism in general. Orwell was a socialist himself.

First time I've ever heard of the Pied Piper being anti-semitic. I am aware that the story was appropriated by Nazi propaganda, but that's just guilt by association.

1) looked foreign
2) wore different clothes from anybody else
3) was a skilled musician
4) could communicate with vermin, and could make rats vanish
5) would only save his fellow citizens from their destruction if they promised him money for it
6) stole children, possibly ate them.

Now if that isn't a medievil caricature of a Jew, I don't know what is.


Hmm. Not proven.

1) Applies to many - but not actually part of every version of the story. In one, a man claims the piper is his great grandfather come back from the grave.
2) But were they especially multi-coloured while everyone else wore drab clothes?
3) Applies to many - not just Jews could play music, or even flutes.
4) Not aware that this was ever an anti-semitic slur
5) Applies to many. It's called "capitalism".
6) Blood libel. <-- yay, got one.

I'm further not convinced as there seems to be no scholarly articles, or even trendy left wing articles decrying the Pied Piper as an anti-semitic story. Reading the various versions, there's not much I can see that identifies the Piper as Jewish. If the story were truly anti-semitic, why would it not specifically say the he's a Jew? It's not as though medieval Europe was subject to the rigours of Political Correctness.

I did find this Jewish blog that links the Piper with the Messiah. Again, if the story were widely understood to be anti-semitic, why would a Jewish writer speak positively of it?

It's a bit like "handicapped" meaning "cap-in-hand" and therefore demeaning to the differently-abled - it isn't. Or niggardly being a racist word - it isn't.

Pied Piper anti-semitic? No, it isn't.

The best retelling of the Pied Piper story is Pratchett's "The Amazing Maurice and his Educated Rodents". Think about...
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  #204  
Old 19.07.2016, 11:04
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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Exactly, Labour and the Left have been screaming "RACIST" at anyone and everyone for years. Boot's on the other foot and they don't know what to do. Maybe now they'll think of something else to shout at people they don't like.

whatever. Hamas and Hizb'ullah are extreme RIGHTwingers
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  #205  
Old 19.07.2016, 11:07
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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whatever. Hamas and Hizb'ullah are extreme RIGHTwingers
Yes, but in their favour, they're being oppressed by the Israelis.
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  #206  
Old 19.07.2016, 14:22
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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whatever. Hamas and Hizb'ullah are extreme RIGHTwingers
In what respect are they right wingers?

Because the combination national + socialist automatically makes national socialist?

Isn't the problem rather that people mistakenly assume that national socialism (always) comes from the right?
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  #207  
Old 19.07.2016, 17:16
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

Neil Kinnock: ‘I’m bloody angry. Only anger is keeping me from falling into despair’


"“People divide into those who are vain, and those who are not ... And Jeremy is a vain man.”"

But it looks as if Jeremy Corbyn is going to romp home in the leadership elections. The Tories will be pleased!
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  #208  
Old 19.07.2016, 18:39
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

some very revealing comments there

Quote:
Kinnock hadn’t planned to say anything. “I had absolutely no intention of speaking. My view was, this is for the MPs. But then Dennis Skinner spoke. And in my view gave an interpretation of history through which I lived that was seriously erratic. He said, ‘This PLP mustn’t think that it’s more important than the rest of the party.’ Well, the fact of the matter is, he’s been sitting in meetings since 1970, and he knows damn well that there’s never been the merest suggestion that a view should be taken because the PLP is more important. It’s taken because the PLP has a duty it can’t escape. It’s not about relative importance. And he knew that damn well.
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  #209  
Old 19.07.2016, 19:39
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

No doubt he's also bloody angry that the Brussels gravy train ride is finally over for him and his missus.
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  #210  
Old 19.07.2016, 23:27
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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No doubt he's also bloody angry that the Brussels gravy train ride is finally over for him and his missus.
But he no longer works for the EU.

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In 1995 he retired from the House of Commons to become a member of the European Commission and served as its vice president from 1999 to 2004. Kinnock was named a life peer in 2005.
https://www.britannica.com/biography...k-of-Bedwellty
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  #211  
Old 19.07.2016, 23:31
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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But he no longer works for the EU.
He managed to reduce the salaries of all the EU civil servants; not bad for an unelected beaurocrat
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  #212  
Old 20.07.2016, 00:59
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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Neil Kinnock: ‘I’m bloody angry. Only anger is keeping me from falling into despair’


"“People divide into those who are vain, and those who are not ... And Jeremy is a vain man.”"
It's actually a very well written article and the facts are all checkable. It also matches my memory of the history of the Labour Party. Found myself saying "Bloody hell! I remember that!" quite a few times.
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