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Old 09.11.2016, 12:50
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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Are you going to volunteer then to fix up the conflicts that other US leaders already fed into?


Its human nature to have conflicts. Conflicts are two-sided. Reconciliations also take two sides. Capitulating to a conflict doesn't necessary bring peace, it often only emboldens the other side to increase their aggressions. You need to be in the position of power to offer peace.

The power establishments that have driven a lot of these conflicts were hoping for Hillary to continue their bidding; the military industrial complex, the finance industry, oil money, multi-national corporations, etc. The only power establishment that supported Trump was Law Enforcement in the US.

The question here is the nature of the relationship between President Trump and these power establishments. If he is able to resist their greed, I think we have a chance for peace. If he gives in and becomes a puppet of these like all the other US Presidents, we'll likely see continuation of US interventions.

It's not quite a one-man show. Let's see, and give it a chance.
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  #2202  
Old 09.11.2016, 12:51
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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Ok so what I really don't understand is this:

I get why the filthy rich Republicans voted Republican, if only on principles. That's to be expected.

I get why the ultra conservative states voted Republican. They would probably rather vote for Putin as a next president than ever elect a woman.

But how in eff's name did very democratic states suddenly change direction and became republican? How in eff's name was it possible that out of seemingly nowhere, some arrogant, racist, misogynist multi-millionaire with daddy's money was able to convince the majority of the "average workers" that he knew what was best for them, all the while having no idea whatsoever about the life of such an average worker?

It is beyond me, seriously. And I'm really trying to understand.
Maybe you should stop viewing people you disagree with politically as cartoon cut-out stereotypes? When you complain about all the, "racist"s and "misogynist"s my impression is that you are projecting your own widespread use of stereotypes onto your political enemies.
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  #2203  
Old 09.11.2016, 12:52
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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Trump basically said all things to all people to win votes. So did Hillary but Trump's wild promises and claims were probably a step too far for anyone not psychologically imbalanced enough to either match or beat his rhetoric.

yep he just spouted what people wanted to hear, now those same people have to hold him to account, the USA (and the UK) are at a turning point, if they get away with not delivering then the next election is going to be an even bigger shit fest, the biggest liar wins.

I'm betting the wall turns into a wall of cameras, was never meant to be a brick wall and for added points, a wall of cameras on a satellite, in space, a surveillance wall.
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Old 09.11.2016, 12:53
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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its human nature to have conflicts. Conflicts are two-sided. Reconciliations also take two sides. Capitulating to a conflict doesn't necessary bring peace, it often only emboldens the other side to increase their aggressions. You need to be in the position of power to offer peace.

what a load of crap
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  #2205  
Old 09.11.2016, 12:53
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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Seriously, Trump has an opportunity to take the US off of a war footing. We all really ought to hope he succeeds.
"One side can unilaterally end a war: By losing it."
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  #2206  
Old 09.11.2016, 12:55
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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Can't resist the pun

Emotion Trumps Logic
I think that disregards the logic that voted against Clinton.
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  #2207  
Old 09.11.2016, 12:56
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

"Earlier this year Simpsons creator Matt Groening told The Guardian they used Trump because he was "the most absurd placeholder joke name that we could think of"."



Tom
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  #2208  
Old 09.11.2016, 12:56
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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yep he just spouted what people wanted to hear, now those same people have to hold him to account, the USA (and the UK) are at a turning point, if they get away with not delivering then the next election is going to be an even bigger shit fest, the biggest liar wins.

I'm betting the wall turns into a wall of cameras, was never meant to be a brick wall and for added points, a wall of cameras on a satellite, in space, a surveillance wall.
The wall is already being built, and Mexico is already paying for it.

Maybe somebody misunderstood which Mexican border Trump was referring to?

https://www.ft.com/content/c316294a-...e-647294649b28
  #2209  
Old 09.11.2016, 12:57
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

I think its funny that when the Trumps move into the White House residence, it will probably be like downsizing for them.

cheers
SC
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  #2210  
Old 09.11.2016, 12:59
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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"One side can unilaterally end a war: By losing it."
That's what Nixon did.

And probably the world is a better place for it.
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  #2211  
Old 09.11.2016, 13:03
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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Maybe you should stop viewing people you disagree with politically as cartoon cut-out stereotypes? When you complain about all the, "racist"s and "misogynist"s my impression is that you are projecting your own widespread use of stereotypes onto your political enemies.
That so? I have no political enemies, just FYI. I also am not American and couldn't have voted even if I had wanted to and of course I have zero intention, nor ability for that matter, to do anything about the outcome of this election.


But since you think it's my stereotypes that get in the way, then let me ask you this: what, if not racist, is the quote "I will ban Muslims from entering the country"? Ok correction, it's not racist cause Islam is not a race. Let's call it discriminatory.

And how about bragging about sexual assault? So that is just a minor thing to ignore? It doesn't show lack of respect for women and as such a certain level of misogyny or at the very least sexism? Really?

These are facts. These are things he said and did. He's not even denying any of it. There's no stereotyping here whatsoever.
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Old 09.11.2016, 13:06
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

Congratulations America!

Now after people will shake off their postelectoral shock, it's about time to see if promises will be delivered one by one as expected. It would be commendable to see the US restored to its previous American Dream's taunted era seeing growth of 4% or more, ability to negotiate in international politics, job creation and money collected for that infamous "wall" being built in closely undefined future. All that talk and jabber on CNN with lots of work ahead.
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  #2213  
Old 09.11.2016, 13:11
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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I think your wrong. Trump stumped on the mistakes of going to war. Between he and Hillary, he was the anti-war candidate. He repudiated his own party's warmongering stance. But I take it you did not understand that.
summary of the elections and what was wrong with the candidates.
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  #2214  
Old 09.11.2016, 13:11
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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Ok so what I really don't understand is this:

I get why the filthy rich Republicans voted Republican, if only on principles. That's to be expected.

I get why the ultra conservative states voted Republican. They would probably rather vote for Putin as a next president than ever elect a woman.

But how in eff's name did very democratic states suddenly change direction and became republican? How in eff's name was it possible that out of seemingly nowhere, some arrogant, racist, misogynist multi-millionaire with daddy's money was able to convince the majority of the "average workers" that he knew what was best for them, all the while having no idea whatsoever about the life of such an average worker?

It is beyond me, seriously. And I'm really trying to understand.
He did it by tapping into their anger and fear. That part of the population has been quite patient for a long time. They've sent their children off to war because college was too expensive. They avoided the dot com and real estate bubbles by not having enough savings to risk on investments, they drive old cars and don't see any investment happening in their community. They don't travel the world, nor do they particularly wish to. A trip to Disneyland, or Vegas, would please them. They may have visited Washington as part of a school trip. They see their America as on the wane. Donald's rage at the machine spoke straight to their discontent, so well that they ignored his wealth, they probably aren't even bothered that if Donald actually does anything about trade with China then Walmart will become more expensive. Clinton expressed a sort of hypothetical empathy, Donald expressed the kind of anger that leads people in a difficult situation to say and do silly things.
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Old 09.11.2016, 13:13
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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That's what Nixon Ford did.

And probably the world is a better place for it.
FTFY!

Tom
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  #2216  
Old 09.11.2016, 13:16
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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That so? I have no political enemies, just FYI. I also am not American and couldn't have voted even if I had wanted to and of course I have zero intention, nor ability for that matter, to do anything about the outcome of this election.


But since you think it's my stereotypes that get in the way, then let me ask you this: what, if not racist, is the quote "I will ban Muslims from entering the country"? Ok correction, it's not racist cause Islam is not a race. Let's call it discriminatory.

And how about bragging about sexual assault? So that is just a minor thing to ignore? It doesn't show lack of respect for women and as such a certain level of misogyny or at the very least sexism? Really?

These are facts. These are things he said and did. He's not even denying any of it. There's no stereotyping here whatsoever.
I understand yours (and many people's) dislike for these two comments. They are politically incorrect and offensive. Whether to base the decision for the PUSA on these two comments is however a bit narrow minded.


The banning of Muslims: this was a comment, made to an audience following an attack a year ago. It was also followed by "until we figure out what's going on". This has expanded to looking specifically at countries which harbor terrorists as a 'jumping' point to countries they want to attack. --this is a similar policy to many countries.


As for the sexual assault comment. Unfortunately, such vulgar comments are very common with a good majority of men AND women, in private conversation--with close friends. I even see a lot of it on EF---Vulgar? Distasteful? Sure, but depending on the audience and timing, vulgar and distasteful are sometimes entertaining and funny.


Two comments, agreed not PC, would not a reason for me to entirely disregard a PUSA candidate. If many of the Trump haters would take the time to look at his published positions (which I'm fairly sure a good majority hasn't) --you would find very little to honestly call him sexist or racist.
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Old 09.11.2016, 13:16
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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Clinton expressed a sort of hypothetical empathy, Donald expressed the kind of anger that leads people in a difficult situation to say and do silly things.
Clinton said something about a basket of deplorables.

And many of her supporters said far worse things. Of course Hillary can't be held accountable for things her supporters say, but you can't pretend it doesn't have an effect.

You know, stuff about the working class redneck having no future, deserving no future, etc etc. If you tell people things like that and still expect them to vote for you, you live in a very special kind of reality.
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Old 09.11.2016, 13:19
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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entire families, blacks, hispanics, Muslims - good solid Americans who have contributed so much to the USA - who woke up terrified of the future (where the emoticon with tears here) - 1000x times more than all my middle class well educated white friends- who have all been e-mailing and FBing about how to get out of the USA asap- and who have the money and the choice.

Personally I feel bereft, so does DH- totally. We've been through the vote on limiting immigration in CH in 2014 and the mess which ensued and still is, we've had the Brexit saga and the mess which ensued and still is- and now we wake up afraid of yet another monster with his finger on the nuclear button, joining Putin and Kim

Time to empty all the beers and wine and stok up that nuclear bunker perhaps

Scaremonging...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear_mongering


And what mess is in Switzerland since 2014??
I haven't seen any change since living here in 2009, in terms of "every day life", it is still the unpleasing feeling of being an invader, hardly tolerated. And I speak local language + look average local (ie i'm not brown/black, easily identifiable as possible foreigner).

Finger on the nuclear button, lol. Hillary probably would have one at home because it was more convenient...

https://youtu.be/u2UPvqpGPSM


Merkel has done more harm to "entire families, blacks, hispanics, Muslims " than you could possibly imagine by having an apparently positive attitude.

What matters is the result, not the mean or the "who".

So leave them a chance.


PS: you can also lock up in your bunker if you are scared, we'll visit you in 20 years
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Old 09.11.2016, 13:21
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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I understand yours (and many people's) dislike for these two comments. They are politically incorrect and offensive. Whether to base the decision for the PUSA on these two comments is however a bit narrow minded.



Two comments, agreed not PC, would not a reason for me to entirely disregard a PUSA candidate.
I hadn't seen this acronym before.

I guess we can say that Trump grabbed the PUSA.
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Old 09.11.2016, 13:23
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Re: Will Trump be the next US President?

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I hadn't seen this acronym before.

I guess we can say that Trump grabbed the PUSA.


hahaha, yeah I might have just made it up intending to be an initialism, but it doesn't have an ironic twist as an acronym as well :P


I think we used to use it to refer to the band from the 90s with some seriously catchy tunes!
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