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Old 16.11.2016, 16:51
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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Which brings us back to "why do some countries become dictatorships". At the moment, the U.S is unlikley to become a dictatorship.
The thing about the US is what we have seen in the election: It's a deeply divided country. It's pretty hard to make one statement that fits New York in the same way it does the Mid West. A lot of the red states seem to have all it takes to become a fascist state. And the police certainly already acts as if... but the US as a Union overall? No, unlikely. Won't help you if you live in the "wrong" part.

http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/844702/...lle-obama-post
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  #42  
Old 16.11.2016, 17:17
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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The thing about the US is what we have seen in the election: It's a deeply divided country. It's pretty hard to make one statement that fits New York in the same way it does the Mid West. A lot of the red states seem to have all it takes to become a fascist state. And the police certainly already acts as if... but the US as a Union overall? No, unlikely. Won't help you if you live in the "wrong" part.

http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/844702/...lle-obama-post
All countries are divided - The voters in Sarnen have other priorities than the ones in Geneva.

If racism in the Red states is enough to make them Facist, then Zimbabwe is über-Fascist.
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  #43  
Old 16.11.2016, 17:20
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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Frankly I'm kind of tired of all this hype. He was democratically elected, end of story.
For a given value of "democratically".
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If politicians are hypocrites people are hypocrites too.
Not really. Though most politicians are populists and therefore inevitably hypocritical.
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  #44  
Old 16.11.2016, 20:09
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I disagree. Robert Mugabe was once a freedom fighter who honestly worked for the good of his people. It's some decades ago, but he was never the spoilt brat that started off with the millions of his dad and all he achieved in life was to increase his inheritance significantly slower than an investment in the stock index would have...

THere are not that many dictators around that grew up as the rich kid getting whatever they wanted... except of: http://en.rocketnews24.com/2016/11/1...fatty-kim-iii/
Are you saying that Mugabe is better than Trump because Mugabe wasn't born into money?

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I never saw it, and I was working on an American based political forum at the time. You would have to have little idea of politics and history to make such a comparison. The differences between the two were very, very marked. I remember people at the time claiming that Hitler was left wing, which often happens when people only see politics as a scale from left to right, instead of it being a circle.

I had a great college tutor who demonstrated the political spectrum, and political history with two Newton's Cradles. The more one ball goes to the left, the further the ball on the right is thrown out. Then people become polarised, you begin to remove the centre balls, and eventually, one of the balls gets hit so hard that it does a 360 and hits to opposite extreme instead of the centre. It's difficult to explain in words, but in actions, it made perfect sense.

The second, parallel cradle, was outside influences of the day, poverty, disease, famine, religion, etc... Each of those could be swung to take one of the centre balls out of action, thus creating a bigger swing to the left or right.
You never heard of the moniker, "Bushitler"? Google it, the images are hilarious.

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The thing about the US is what we have seen in the election: It's a deeply divided country. It's pretty hard to make one statement that fits New York in the same way it does the Mid West. A lot of the red states seem to have all it takes to become a fascist state. And the police certainly already acts as if... but the US as a Union overall? No, unlikely. Won't help you if you live in the "wrong" part.

http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/844702/...lle-obama-post
Shorter version: "Those guys who dare vote for someone other than my preferred party are all fascists." Lazy thinking.

Last edited by 3Wishes; 16.11.2016 at 20:23. Reason: As before
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  #45  
Old 16.11.2016, 20:18
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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Shorter version: "Those guys who dare vote for someone other than my preferred party are all fascists." Lazy thinking.
The digital age has provoked a rise in the binary mind.
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  #46  
Old 16.11.2016, 21:33
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

All politicians are hypocrites, thats the nature of politics.
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  #47  
Old 16.11.2016, 22:44
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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Shorter version: "Those guys who dare vote for someone other than my preferred party are all fascists." Lazy thinking.
Thanks. I actually gave a link to the case of a major who thought it's cool to refer to Michelle Obama as "an ape in heels"... I was also referring to the several cases of police violence. You know, those videos where black guys get shot for no apparent reason by officers who later simply have to claim that they felt threatened...

But it seems you just like to see the points you want to anyway.
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Old 16.11.2016, 23:17
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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Shorter version: "Those guys who dare vote for someone other than my preferred party are all fascists." Lazy thinking.
Isn't oversimplification itself a form of lazy thinking?
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  #49  
Old 16.11.2016, 23:30
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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...and the alternative is??
Protest and not accept that we are going to let a tyrant prevail. It is questionable if Trump was FAIRLY elected.
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Old 17.11.2016, 00:31
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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You never heard of the moniker, "Bushitler"? Google it, the images are hilarious.
Honestly never heard it before your post. Steve Bell embodied my view of GWB in these...
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  #51  
Old 17.11.2016, 09:41
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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Protest and not accept that we are going to let a tyrant prevail. It is questionable if Trump was FAIRLY elected.
I don't want him to be president either, but per the constitutional process he was elected. Get over it and start building more support for a better candidate next time.
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Old 17.11.2016, 10:57
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

...
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  #53  
Old 17.11.2016, 11:06
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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Honestly never heard it before your post. Steve Bell embodied my view of GWB in these...
So apish cartoons of GWB are ok, but calling Ms. Obama "Ape in heels" isn't ?

Degrading comments/cartoons don't contribute to the disussion.
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Old 17.11.2016, 11:46
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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So apish cartoons of GWB are ok, but calling Ms. Obama "Ape in heels" isn't ?

Degrading comments/cartoons don't contribute to the disussion.
Generally, the higher up and more exposed somebody is, the more it is acceptable to make them them them the butt of jokes.

Humour is a leveller. It's the small guy's way to get even.

Thus we say things about people like Boris, May, Merkel, Obama and Trump that we probbaly wouldn't say about the guy next door.
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Old 17.11.2016, 11:51
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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Generally, the higher up and more exposed somebody is, the more it is acceptable to make them them them the butt of jokes.

Humour is a leveller. It's the small guy's way to get even.

Thus we say things about people like Boris, May, Merkel, Obama and Trump that we probbaly wouldn't say about the guy next door.
jokes are great, one of the last weapons of the weak.

But if a joke is racist/agesit/sexist - it misses the mark.
It's ok to laugh are Merkel for her policies, but not because she is a woman.
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  #56  
Old 17.11.2016, 11:57
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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jokes are great, one of the last weapons of the weak.

But if a joke is racist/agesit/sexist - it misses the mark.
It's ok to laugh are Merkel for her policies, but not because she is a woman.
Yup. So simply put:

- the Michelle Obama joke was pretty clearly a reference to her skin color. Let's just agree that's racist.
- the GWB joke was based on his rather unclear pronounciation and that the carricaturist believed that he is not the big leader, but the little monkey of the people behind them. Not the most politically correct joke ever, but clearly not racist, right?
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Old 17.11.2016, 12:01
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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jokes are great, one of the last weapons of the weak.

But if a joke is racist/agesit/sexist - it misses the mark.
It's ok to laugh are Merkel for her policies, but not because she is a woman.
Interestingly enough, it is commonly acceptable to poke fun at Trump's appearance, his skin color, his hair etc.


But it would be very unacceptable for low brow comments on the physical appearance of Clinton or another female.


Jokes seem to be generally unacceptable if they comment on an attribute of a group whom the PC crowd feels have been historically discriminated against.
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Old 17.11.2016, 12:10
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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Yup. So simply put:

- the Michelle Obama joke was pretty clearly a reference to her skin color. Let's just agree that's racist.
- the GWB joke was based on his rather unclear pronounciation and that the carricaturist believed that he is not the big leader, but the little monkey of the people behind them. Not the most politically correct joke ever, but clearly not racist, right?
not racist, but a crude personal attack: replace GWB as monkey with Hillary as the lapdog of Wall street, for example. would you find that fair ?
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Old 17.11.2016, 12:13
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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Generally, the higher up and more exposed somebody is, the more it is acceptable to make them them them the butt of jokes.

Humour is a leveller. It's the small guy's way to get even.

Thus we say things about people like Boris, May, Merkel, Obama and Trump that we probbaly wouldn't say about the guy next door.
I should note that humour and satire is at least an evolutionary step above snowflake drama queening. One takes wit, the other takes an absence of a brain.
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Old 17.11.2016, 12:20
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Re: Hypocrit politicians!

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not racist, but a crude personal attack: replace GWB as monkey with Hillary as the lapdog of Wall street, for example. would you find that fair ?
Yes. Totally. But then am I not some millenial in his safe space crying that "my" candidate did not win... I am just a tiny bit worried how bad Trump will screw up.
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