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Old 30.08.2006, 12:17
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[German] 4 niggley things

Heres a few to get us started:

1. What tense do I used for
"I have brought my book with me"
is it present or perfect in Germany ?

"Ich bringe das Buch mit" oder
"Ich habe das Buch mitgebracht"

2. What is the best way to ask:
"What kind/sort of flowers do you sell ?"
I have seen the word "Wofür" but I'm not sure of its usage.

3. Is "Haben Sie <etwas> ?" a correct (and conventional) form for a "do-you-sell" question in a shop ?

4. When indicating that you don't understand, is it more common to use :
"Ich verstehe nicht." (I do not understand ) or
"Ich habe nicht verstanden" (I didn't understand)

Thanks in advance
dave
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  #2  
Old 30.08.2006, 13:25
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Re: (German) 4 niggley things

1. "Ich habe das Buch mitgebracht" is correct. You would only use "Ich bringe das Buch" in the rare occasion when you are in the process of bringing it - i.e. you are walking towards someone and are telling him that you have the book with you

2. "Was für Blumen verkaufen sie?" - "Wofür" means "What ... for", i.e. "Wofür wird dieses Werkzeug benutzt?" - ("What is this tools used for?")

3. "Haben sie Blumen?" is correct. To be more precise you could ask "Verkaufen sie Blumen?"

4. "Das habe ich nicht verstanden" - Your two versions lack the object "Das" and in German it sounds strange without it.

By the way, the tenses in English are just as challenging. "I have been", "I was", etc is just as complicated!
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Old 30.08.2006, 15:31
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

Quote:
1. What tense do I used for
"I have brought my book with me"
is it present or perfect in Germany ?

"Ich bringe das Buch mit" oder
"Ich habe das Buch mitgebracht"
Your question was whether it was present or perfect? The answer is "present perfect". If it were past perfect then both verbs would be in the past - "I had brought my book with me", but your sentence indicates that something has "just happened" so it is kind of still in the now, even though it refers to the past, hence the term present perfect. Present perfect can also be called "perfect" and past perfect can also be called "pluperfect". Confused? Excellent

I agree with Wombat's comment except that "Ich bringe das Buch mit" could be used in other situations other than if you are walking towards someone with a book. This is called present continuous in English and would be "I am bringing", however present continuous doesn't exist in German, so we use "Ich bringe" instead. As well as potentially having a present continuous meaning it could also indicate a habitual action - "(Jeden Donnestag) bringe ich das Buch". More importantly it could also indicate a future action - "bringe ich das Buch" could indicate that you are going to bring it later.

Please note that this use indicating the future is not strictly correct. If you look in a grammar book you'll see that the future tense should be "Ich werde das Buch bringen". Unfortunately nobody seems to have told any native speakers that they are supposed to use werden in a situation like this, so you'll almost always here the future tense formed without werden in this case... For example - you'll almost always hear "Ich gehe" to mean I am going to go. Correct would be "Ich werde gehen", but you'll almost never hear it being spoken that way (in either High or Swiss German).

Hope you aren't more confused that when we started

Quote:
2. What is the best way to ask:
"What kind/sort of flowers do you sell ?"
I have seen the word "Wofür" but I'm not sure of its usage.
Agree with Wombat on this one - just wanted to expand a little. Just remember this little joke. A german walks up an Englishman and says "What for a dog have you?". The Englishman is puzzled and has no clue with the German means. But if we literally translate and have the same word order we get "Was für ein Hund haben Sie?" - In this case the "What for" or "Was für" means "what type of". Note that "was für" is two words. Wofür, Wobei, Woran are single words and are questions where the answer can also be paired as "Dafür, Dabei, Daran" - I'm guessing you'll get to these later on, but for the moment just remember "Was für" to be "what kind of". Remember the dog joke - it helps

Quote:
4. When indicating that you don't understand, is it more common to use :
"Ich verstehe nicht." (I do not understand ) or
"Ich habe nicht verstanden" (I didn't understand)
I agree with Wombat, but I would probably shorten it slightly to "Hab' ich nicht verstanden". If said quickly and naturally then the missing "das" doesn't sound bad.

By the way - the good news is that English and German tenses almost map exactly to each other - so once you learn the terminology to describe each tense you can apply those terms in both languages.
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Old 12.06.2007, 09:48
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

This language section is great! Thanks for the tips.

Quick question: DaveA said "Wofür, Wobei, Woran are single words and are questions where the answer can also be paired as "Dafür, Dabei, Daran"

I have heard these a lot...Can you tell me what they mean and how to use them in questions and answers?

And is "für was" the same as wofür?... I have got the impression (rightly or wrongly I don´t know! ) "für was" is like "why"...

Some enlightenment would be great on this as my "German 101" class at highschool didn´t prepare me for any of this!
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Old 12.06.2007, 11:17
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

Wofür? Wobei? Woran? are interrogative pronouns.
Für, Bei, An are prepositions.
Wofür, Wobei, Woran are also relative pronouns.

Here are analogical examples for all three word groups:

Wofür
brauchst du das Geld?
Für die Miete.
Er will die Miete bezahlen, dafür fehlt ihm aber das Geld.

Entschuldigung! Wobei störe ich dich?
Bei meiner Arbeit!
Er ist am arbeiten, dabei wird er leider gestört.

Woran arbeitest du?
An einer Lösung für das Computer-Problem.
Wir brauchen eine Lösung, woran aber schon gearbeitet wird.
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Old 22.06.2007, 01:09
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

Hi,

Didnt want to start a new thread, but i hope this gets seen...

Just a quick German sentence that has been vexing me..

Firstly, how would people here say, in German:

"I will be able to do it"

I have asked some people and have come up with:
  • Ich werde dann es koennen
  • Ich werde es koennen
Now the person I asked was German. However, they were unable to explain the grammar to me, which for me would help me understand this situation a bit better (although I happily accept it "just is" that way).

Could anyone help explain the lack of the verb "do" in this sentence.

Thanks
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Old 22.06.2007, 09:14
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

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Hi,

Didnt want to start a new thread, but i hope this gets seen...

Just a quick German sentence that has been vexing me..

Firstly, how would people here say, in German:

"I will be able to do it"

I have asked some people and have come up with:
  • Ich werde dann es koennen
  • Ich werde es koennen
Now the person I asked was German. However, they were unable to explain the grammar to me, which for me would help me understand this situation a bit better (although I happily accept it "just is" that way).

Could anyone help explain the lack of the verb "do" in this sentence.

Thanks
"Ich werde dann es koennen?" That ain't German in my book, and I was born & raised there (worked as a translator, too).

I will be able to do it ... I would translate it as "Ich kann es machen" or maybe "Ich kann es erledigen" when using office speak.

"Ich werde es können" is neither proper German nor something I can identify as a colloqualism.
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Old 22.06.2007, 09:19
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

"I will be able to do it"

translates to

"Ich werde es machen können".

It works for other verbs, too:

I will be able to repair it
I will be able to organise it

Ich werde es reparieren können.
Ich werde es organisieren können.

However the use of the future tense emphasises that you can do it because/despite of external circumstances (e.g. time management). If you're talking about your personal skill allowing you to do something, you would use the present tense.

Ich kann es machen
Ich kann es reparieren
Ich kann es organisieren
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Old 22.06.2007, 12:31
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

Thanks Nathu and tomcat, much appreciated.
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Old 03.07.2008, 23:50
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

Hi

I will be able to do it
Ich bin fähig das zu tun. Or with the future Ich werde fähig sein das zu tun.

Regards Dani
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Old 04.07.2008, 11:12
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

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Hi

I will be able to do it
Ich bin fähig das zu tun. Or with the future Ich werde fähig sein das zu tun.

Regards Dani
Nice translation, but it'll earn you a look...

In everyday street german, "Ich bin fähig ..." is usually used in a negative context, as a threat or when negative (unfähig/nicht fähig), to belittle.

Just thought I'd warn you.

Why use a complicated construct when you can use the verb können?

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Old 04.07.2008, 11:14
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

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Hi

I will be able to do it
Ich bin fähig das zu tun. Or with the future Ich werde fähig sein das zu tun.

Regards Dani
Also shouldn't sein be at the end or have a comma after it?
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Old 04.07.2008, 11:31
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

"Ich werde fähig sein, das zu tun" implies that the person talks about a skill that he has yet to acquire. That now he is not capable of it.

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Also shouldn't sein be at the end or have a comma after it?
Since the Great Linguistic Trainwr..., err latest German grammar reform, the infinitive comma isn't mandatory anymore, in virtually all cases.

No more rules for interpunction, isn't that exciting?
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Old 04.07.2008, 11:39
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

Ooh, good thread! I've got one which has been bugging me for ages...

If I want to tell someone who is offering to help that it's okay, I can manage (say, with the pushchair) I normally say, "Es geht schon, aber danke!"

To my mind it sounds a bit "mind your own business" so I am trying to find an alternative.

Any suggestions?
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Old 04.07.2008, 12:12
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Re: [German] 4 niggley things

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Ooh, good thread! I've got one which has been bugging me for ages...

If I want to tell someone who is offering to help that it's okay, I can manage (say, with the pushchair) I normally say, "Es geht schon, aber danke!"

To my mind it sounds a bit "mind your own business" so I am trying to find an alternative.

Any suggestions?
Nä, schguuet, ich chum alei zrecht.

But your High German sentence is perfect and polite.
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