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Old 13.04.2015, 17:13
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Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

Alas my time in Switzerland is coming to an end.

Here is the predicament I am in. I have a leased car and the lease only has 5 months left. The amount to give it back early is about the same as the lease payments I have left so it seems a huge waste for me to give Ford money for nothing when I need a car in the UK anyway.

So my understanding thus far:
  • To have Swiss plates one has to be a Swiss resident
  • As I have a C permit I am allowed to be outside the country for 6 months without losing my residency (and thus my Swiss plates!)

So if I go back to the UK with my car without deregistering and without an address as such in Switzerland, would this be ok?

What about the tax situation? I imagine under dual taxation that I wouldn't be liable for Swiss tax. Would I still have to pay into the account for tax every month as all C permit holder do? Or could I phone the tax office and explain the situation to them and stop paying that and complete a tax return come October (when I officially deregister)?
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Old 13.04.2015, 17:25
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

Interesting question. Problem is you would still be liable for Medical Insurance if you don't de-register? (which would cancel out any savings). You could perhaps rent a room from a friend- as an adress- but then again- that pesky medical insurance would be due and taxes too I'd imagine.

Would it not be easier to get someone to take over the lease- maybe a name change is possible with minor costs- check with the leasing company.
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Old 13.04.2015, 17:31
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

Donate it to EF for 5 months as the official chicken run vehicle.

We promise not to break it or get it too greasy.
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Old 13.04.2015, 17:34
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

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Interesting question. Problem is you would still be liable for Medical Insurance if you don't de-register?
That is very true and something I hadn't thought about. An extra 170CHF added onto the cost of the pleasure of having my car.

Still the car is only 250CHF per month and I already paid a 3000 CHF deposit on it when I got it. If I were to give it back and get one here I'd have to find a deposit from somewhere and probably pay more per month (I got a very good deal on this car but I doubt anyone would want to take over a lease for just 5 months)

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Interesting question. Problem is you would still be liable for Medical Insurance if you don't de-register? (which would cancel out any savings). You could perhaps rent a room from a friend- as an adress- but then again- that pesky medical insurance would be due and taxes too I'd imagine.

Would it not be easier to get someone to take over the lease- maybe a name change is possible with minor costs- check with the leasing company.
Will reply to the rest after your edit here. The taxes, I'd imagine, I'd get back due to dual taxation agreements between the UK and Switzerland.

There is no cost to transfer the lease to someone else. The cost is time. I only got my new contract last Friday and I start on the 27th so I have next to no time to get my affairs in order en suisse.
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Old 13.04.2015, 17:45
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

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To have Swiss plates one has to be a Swiss resident
Not true, my daughter lives in LA and has a motorbike registered here (and had a car as well).

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Would I still have to pay into the account for tax every month as all C permit holder do?
C permit holders do not normally pay into a tax account every month, but receive bills throughout the year. At least that was the case when I had B and C permits and was not taxed at source.

Tom
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Old 13.04.2015, 17:52
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

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Not true, my daughter lives in LA and has a motorbike registered here (and had a car as well).
Ok that may be the case. But a Swiss lease isn't valid for non-residents so it's academic.


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C permit holders do not normally pay into a tax account every month, but receive bills throughout the year. At least that was the case when I had B and C permits and was not taxed at source.

Tom
I get invoices every month (only got my C permit this year) so this may vary as per canton.
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Old 13.04.2015, 18:22
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

Yes I'd imagine you'd get your taxes back eventually- but if you haven't deregistered, you'd be in a 'sort of illegal situation' and it might take time- so you could be paying double tax for a while. I don't know.

Why not offer your lease here on EF and at the other place- even at a subsidised rate, you never know- someone may just be looking for a car now for all we know (don't worry, not me).
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Old 13.04.2015, 18:33
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

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Alas my time in Switzerland is coming to an end.

Here is the predicament I am in. I have a leased car and the lease only has 5 months left. The amount to give it back early is about the same as the lease payments I have left so it seems a huge waste for me to give Ford money for nothing when I need a car in the UK anyway.

So my understanding thus far:
  • To have Swiss plates one has to be a Swiss resident
  • As I have a C permit I am allowed to be outside the country for 6 months without losing my residency (and thus my Swiss plates!)

So if I go back to the UK with my car without deregistering and without an address as such in Switzerland, would this be ok?
I'm pretty sure that you could deregister in Switzerland and keep your plates for 5 months with no problem as long as you make sure that you can keep a mailing adddress in Switzerland. (...and pay your bills )

However, I see the real problem at the UK end. I don't know about the exact legal situation over there, but in many countries the use of foreign registered cars by local residents is either completely illegal or severely restricted.
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Old 13.04.2015, 18:42
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

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Yes I'd imagine you'd get your taxes back eventually- but if you haven't deregistered, you'd be in a 'sort of illegal situation' and it might take time- so you could be paying double tax for a while. I don't know.

Why not offer your lease here on EF and at the other place- even at a subsidised rate, you never know- someone may just be looking for a car now for all we know (don't worry, not me).
Well it's either illegal or not. As said I can be abroad for 6 months without deregistering. And yes I'm not entirely sure hence why I made the thread


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I'm pretty sure that you could deregister in Switzerland and keep your plates for 5 monsths with no problem as long as you make sure that you can keep a mailing adddress in Switzerland.

However, I see the real problem at the UK end. I don't know about the exact legal situation over there, but in many countries the use of foreign registered cars by local residents is either completely illegal or severely restricted.
I would have thought so as well but according the Neuch controle des habitants website i need to go to SCAN to fully deregister.

https://www.gov.uk/importing-vehicle...porary-imports

It should be fine as a temporary import. Plus if I'm still registered in CH then I'm only a UK resident for tax purposes.


Yeh it all seems a bit complicated. Will give Ford a call tomorrow to see how much to buy the car outright and put it up for sale. Will be the easiest option I feel.
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Old 13.04.2015, 18:49
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

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...The cost is time. I only got my new contract last Friday and I start on the 27th so I have next to no time to get my affairs in order en suisse.
Sorry, no helpful advice to offer, but congrats on the new job and good luck sorting it all out quickly.
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Old 13.04.2015, 19:43
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

I'm not familiar with the preconditions for the permit types.

With that said I would expect that in order to obtain and keep a permit legally you have to have your "Lebensmittelpunkt" in CH as a precondition, otherwise there's no reason for you to want one in the first place (from the standpoint of CH govt).

As a consequence you have to pay taxes.

Now, your UK employer may well hand you the equivalent of a Lohnausweis, but obviously his address alone (which won't be overlooked as the form is in english and probably doesn't conform to CH standard) will raise a ton of questions, from various sides of CH governent. UK on the other hand (no idea if that's a reasonable assumption) may take the standpoint that you registered and thus are liable for taxes there, too.

Of course CH may accept that you effectively left, I can't even begin to assess the likelihood for that, but nonetheless it seems you risk being taxed twice on the same income. And presumably that would cost you considerably more than a few thousand.

And yes, congrats on the new job
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Old 14.04.2015, 08:52
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Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

I don't have any advice either. But congrats on the job! Good luck!

I wonder if when you switched from B to C, the paperwork didn't follow and your taxes didn't adjust. We came here with C's and have no taxes taken out - this is the same in Bern and Zuerich.

We do pay them in one chunk.
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Old 14.04.2015, 08:55
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

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Alas my time in Switzerland is coming to an end.

Here is the predicament I am in. I have a leased car and the lease only has 5 months left. The amount to give it back early is about the same as the lease payments I have left so it seems a huge waste for me to give Ford money for nothing when I need a car in the UK anyway.

So my understanding thus far:
  • To have Swiss plates one has to be a Swiss resident
  • As I have a C permit I am allowed to be outside the country for 6 months without losing my residency (and thus my Swiss plates!)

So if I go back to the UK with my car without deregistering and without an address as such in Switzerland, would this be ok?

What about the tax situation? I imagine under dual taxation that I wouldn't be liable for Swiss tax. Would I still have to pay into the account for tax every month as all C permit holder do? Or could I phone the tax office and explain the situation to them and stop paying that and complete a tax return come October (when I officially deregister)?
You can keep Swiss plates for a year after reregistering. What Ford thinks is another matter.

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However, I see the real problem at the UK end. I don't know about the exact legal situation over there, but in many countries the use of foreign registered cars by local residents is either completely illegal or severely restricted.
It won't be an issue as Porsche won't be entitled to a UK license until he has lived there for 6 months, its part of the declaration on the form. Same in Malta so I assume its an EU rule. I think he can drive it for a year, just the same as taking up residence in CH, declare the car at the border & import personal goods.
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Old 14.04.2015, 10:11
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

To import a car as part of personal goods, you must have owned the car for over 6 months- and as it was leased, if he buys it now- it won't be possible and taxes due (no?). I was going to suggest that earlier, then remembered about the 6 months rule. It is actually amazing how quickly you get used to drive with the wheel on the 'wrong' side.
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Old 14.04.2015, 13:05
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Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

It's been registered in his name for more than 2 years..... He can use on ch plates for a year so can return the car after 6 months
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Old 14.04.2015, 17:01
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

A little update. I gave Ford a phone call to see what they say:
  • Terminate the lease early - Cost is 473CHF + Extra mileage (~163CHF) + any damage (sky is the limit with garage repairs)
  • Buy the car out or sell it to someone. Cost is approximately 15500CHF (seem a tad high for a 2012 ford focus with 28k KM but I've not checked autoscout yet)
  • I can transfer the lease but he says it's unlikely someone would take it for only 4 months
  • He says in theory they won't have any problem with me taking the car to the UK for 4 months as long as I, obviously, bring it back at the end and I have a address for mail in CH

I think I will go for the last option because as I said I need a car anyway! I've asked the garage how much they would want for it and if they are willing to buy it as well.
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Old 14.04.2015, 17:05
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

And you can bring it back full of KFC.
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Old 14.04.2015, 17:19
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

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And you can bring it back full of KFC.
You're late to the KFC joke Adrian. Mirfield has soaked up all the thanks from that
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Old 14.04.2015, 17:29
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

You've probably thought of this but I'll say it anyway.

Don't you think it might be right pain once you've settled in wherever you're going to then have to come back and finalise everything.

Personally I'd take the 473 chuf early termination hit, and get another car wherever I was going. Depending on what you're doing it may not be convenient to bring it back in 4 months and that your time and money spent bringing it back outweighs the early termination costs.
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Old 14.04.2015, 17:40
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Re: Leaving Switzerland but not really leaving Switzerland

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You've probably thought of this but I'll say it anyway.

Don't you think it might be right pain once you've settled in wherever you're going to then have to come back and finalise everything.

Personally I'd take the 473 chuf early termination hit, and get another car wherever I was going. Depending on what you're doing it may not be convenient to bring it back in 4 months and that your time and money spent bringing it back outweighs the early termination costs.
My ideal scenario would be selling the car on in all honesty. I'm waiting for the garage to tell me what price they'd be willing to part with it for. If I think it's reasonable I will have a jolly good stab at selling it.

That way I don't have to faff around with paying excess mileage and for the minor damage that happens to all cars over about 3 years.

Paying 500CHF and getting nothing in return (bar getting out of a contract) doesn't sit well with my Scottish sensibilities. I'd rather burn the cash than give it to Ford for the pleasure of taking their car back.
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