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Old 24.01.2015, 11:14
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Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

I have a an Italian seller that doesn't want to remove the Italian VAT on a product that I want to import to Switzerland. He says this doesn't apply for used goods, although this is a shop that sells items with warranty etc. Is he screwing me or what? I think he just wants to sell it to me VAT included and than not to declare it so he can make 20% more on the deal. I want the Italian VAT taken out and the item shipped to Switzerland where it will be imported properly.

Anyone has any experience?
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Old 24.01.2015, 12:05
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

It is the sellers decision.

Find another seller, you cannot force them to discount VAT.
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Old 24.01.2015, 12:10
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

There should be no VAT on used goods.

Move on anyway.

And he's probably still peeved about the new EU VAT rules too....
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Old 24.01.2015, 12:27
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

its the sellers decision. many people don't understand VAT. the invoice is the deciding evidence for any VAT audit. if on the invoice it appears with VAT it is sold with VAT even if it is the wrong VAT amount. That is still the VAT amount to declare.

I don't think there is VAT on used goods BTW but you may be well able to check that yourself on the government sites
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Old 24.01.2015, 13:27
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

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its the sellers decision. many people don't understand VAT. the invoice is the deciding evidence for any VAT audit. if on the invoice it appears with VAT it is sold with VAT even if it is the wrong VAT amount. That is still the VAT amount to declare.

I don't think there is VAT on used goods BTW but you may be well able to check that yourself on the government sites
In Italy there are so-called "margin schemes" for charging VAT on used goods; so far as I understand they charge VAT on the added value?
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Old 24.01.2015, 13:37
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

So I have no knowledge on the subject as regards Italy so mine is a question: is there anything similar to the UK where you're on a flat rate of VAT for low turnover businesses so you can't discount the VAT to customers?
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Old 24.01.2015, 13:41
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

Used good or not there will be a VAT on the final sale, especially if sold by a shop with an invoice. Margin schemes are for different sales not from retails shops from what I know. The problem is he doesn't want to remove the VAT even for brand new items. Well I'll find my business somewhere else

I am not asking for a discount, I am simply asking not to pay EU VAT so I can import it in Switzerland and pay the Swiss VAT. There should never be a problem with this.
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Old 24.01.2015, 13:47
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

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Used good or not there will be a VAT on the final sale, especially if sold by a shop with an invoice. Margin schemes are for different sales not from retails shops from what I know. The problem is he doesn't want to remove the VAT even for brand new items. Well I'll find my business somewhere else

I am not asking for a discount, I am simply asking not to pay EU VAT so I can import it in Switzerland and pay the Swiss VAT. There should never be a problem with this.
Although in my example from the UK the seller couldn't remove the VAT, so is this similar?
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Old 24.01.2015, 13:51
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

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Although in my example from the UK the seller couldn't remove the VAT, so is this similar?
Well in my case we are talking about a 35k EUR item so I am pretty sure he has enough turnover to pay VAT on each invoice.

I think he can hide the sale and pinch me for Italian VAT while not paying it himself later, it's Italy after all. By giving me -20% for VAT he shouldn't loosing a penny IF he is paying all his taxes
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Old 24.01.2015, 13:53
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

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Well in my case we are talking about a 35k EUR item so I am pretty sure he has enough turnover to pay VAT on each invoice.

I think he can hide the sale and pinch me for Italian VAT while not paying it himself later, it's Italy after all. By giving me -20% for VAT he shouldn't loosing a penny IF he is paying all his taxes

There you go then. There's no VAT refund for single purchases under €155.
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Old 24.01.2015, 13:56
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

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There you go then. There's no VAT refund for single purchases under €155.
Uhmmmm, 35k is 35,000 ! So well over 155 EUR
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Old 24.01.2015, 13:59
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

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Uhmmmm, 35k is 35,000 ! So well over 155 EUR
See what lack of sleep does to a man? See?

The only thing I can think of is maybe he wants to refund it after the fact so he's not liable later. Or he's lazy.
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Old 24.01.2015, 14:20
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

I had a face-to-face discussion with a watch reseller in Turin about a Rolex that began its life in Portugal and ended up in his stock. It was a watch without an owner that ever wore it.

When I asked about IVA and going to Switzerland, he told me that no IVA was being levied on the watch and I could not get 22% back. I do know that he will have a partita IVA but I still believe that margin schemes exist. KPMG would appear to agree: http://www.kpmg.com/global/en/issues...ges/italy.aspx (search for "second")
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Old 24.01.2015, 15:20
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Re: Italian seller doesn't want to remove Italian VAT

Clearly I don't know what you are buying....

But if it's a vehicle and he is selling on consignment for a customer then no VAT is due and thus he won't be able to deduct it from the price.

At least that is the case for other EU countries. I'd imagine it's the same for Italy.

ETA: An hour to late on this. SC has the same answer related to other goods not just vehicles.
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