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  #21  
Old 12.08.2015, 11:02
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

Was this paid for with a credit card?
If the seller has their credit card details, I'd be surprised if there wasn't some charge on his next statement.
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  #22  
Old 12.08.2015, 11:04
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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Was this paid for with a credit card?
If the seller has their credit card details, I'd be surprised if there wasn't some charge on his next statement.
Which can be promptly disputed in writing (if the credit card holder so desires). The seller's bank has to then provide proof of receipt of the parcel to the credit card company of the cardholder. If proof of receipt can't be provided, the transaction can be reversed.

Last edited by plumtree; 12.08.2015 at 11:05. Reason: minor edit
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  #23  
Old 12.08.2015, 11:10
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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Am I the only one that thinks a bit of common decency is called for. The OP ordered the part and the company shipped it. If the part goes back having effectively been refused it does come across as a bit of bad form.

If I was running the company I'd black list the OP - and if it was a Land Rover specialist - I'd go as far as contacting other specialist and informing them that the OP is a timewaster.

Why can't you take delivery of the part and sell it on Ricardo? Or simply keep it for when the clutch actually does fail - probably about this time next year?
I have no idea what prompts this constant moral posturing from people on the forums. The OP bought something, and now decides he doesn't want it, which is perfectly legal and well within his rights. The seller will have some small inconvenience, but do you really think they will lose any sleep over it, when it probably happens about 10 times a month? They factor these situations into their plans, it is is part and parcel of doing business and will not be the first or last time it happens.

That you even suggest the OP should accept the delivery and then go to the trouble of selling it on Ricardo is beyond laughable, bordering on the ludicrous.

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Was this paid for with a credit card?
If the seller has their credit card details, I'd be surprised if there wasn't some charge on his next statement.
Why would you be surprised about something that is not even remotely legal? Or do you inexplicably think that a seller can just stick random, uncontracted charges on a credit card?
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  #24  
Old 12.08.2015, 11:29
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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Nice work taking a simple matter of returning an item and making it a greek drama...

Contact the seller, tell him to return the part and ask for a refund minus shipping and a restocking fee.

What's the whole fuss about? And why is someone that simply wants to return something treated as an a-hole or a criminal? Timewaster? WTF?
The op is not an asshole or a timewaster - they are just asking for advice - it`s the fact that they are being advised to behave as an asshole/timewaster . . . . that`s the difference.
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  #25  
Old 12.08.2015, 11:33
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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I have no idea what prompts this constant moral posturing from people on the forums. The OP bought something, and now decides he doesn't want it, which is perfectly legal and well within his rights. The seller will have some small inconvenience, but do you really think they will lose any sleep over it, when it probably happens about 10 times a month? They factor these situations into their plans, it is is part and parcel of doing business and will not be the first or last time it happens.
The OPs original post does not indicate that they will contact the seller, explain the situation, ensure the seller is not out of pocket etc. It came across as simply: I ordered something, I no longer need it, I don't want to cover/pay any costs.

If the OP had said that then moral outrage is unlikely to have happened.

Last edited by dodgyken; 12.08.2015 at 11:45.
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  #26  
Old 12.08.2015, 12:18
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

No different to people who order clothes, discover it's the wrong size/colour or simply change their mind, and send it back. People have been doing that since mail order existed which pre-dates the internet.

Yes, for bulky goods I'd expect the seller to charge delivery and maybe a restocking fee if specified clearly on their webpage, but selling over the internet is a cheap way to do business and taking goods back, undamaged/used, is a standard part of that business.
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  #27  
Old 12.08.2015, 12:23
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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The OPs original post does not indicate that they will contact the seller, explain the situation, ensure the seller is not out of pocket etc. It came across as simply: I ordered something, I no longer need it, I don't want to cover/pay any costs.
But he didn't say anything about what he intended to do with the sender - why must so many replies assume ill intentions on his part?
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  #28  
Old 12.08.2015, 12:32
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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But he didn't say anything about what he intended to do with the sender - why must so many replies assume ill intentions on his part?
Because it is exactly the way those people (who post such replies assuming ill intention) think! Sad, but true unfortunately.
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  #29  
Old 12.08.2015, 14:42
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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Because it is exactly the way those people (who post such replies assuming ill intention) think! Sad, but true unfortunately.
You've not been a member long enough to realise that is exactly how the majority of people want things to go.

Along with:
Moving into a spotless flat - the moving out and leaving a mess/damaged and feel ripped off when the don't their deposit back.

Being a non-EU person desperate to move to Switzerland because they read an article about how fabulous it is.

Trying to sell an overpriced car.
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  #30  
Old 12.08.2015, 14:48
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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You've not been a member long enough to realise that is exactly how the majority of people want things to go.

Along with:
Moving into a spotless flat - the moving out and leaving a mess/damaged and feel ripped off when the don't their deposit back.

Being a non-EU person desperate to move to Switzerland because they read an article about how fabulous it is.

Trying to sell an overpriced car.
The overriding point is that the OP, regardless of whether he informs the seller or not, has done nothing "wrong". Sure he could show increased levels of perceived etiquette to the seller by forewarning them, but the seller will contact him anyway and it is certainly nothing he or the seller should lose sleep over. You are simply, like basher, being a complete drama llama / fuddy duddy about it.

Besides, I'm not sure that automatically assuming every new poster wants to rip someone off is a particularly great attitude either.

Last edited by Richdog; 12.08.2015 at 15:17.
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  #31  
Old 12.08.2015, 14:54
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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Besides, I'm not sure that automatically assuming every new poster wants to rip someone off is a particularly great attitude either.
I was following your example
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  #32  
Old 14.08.2015, 12:45
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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You've not been a member long enough to realise that is exactly how the majority of people want things to go.
Along with:
Moving into a spotless flat - the moving out and leaving a mess/damaged and feel ripped off when the don't their deposit back.
Being a non-EU person desperate to move to Switzerland because they read an article about how fabulous it is.
Trying to sell an overpriced car.
I sorry but I don't comprehend the actual meaning of this post due to the way it is written.
Who is a non-EU person desperate to move to Switzerland? What does an overpriced car have to do with this?

Last edited by plumtree; 14.08.2015 at 12:48. Reason: minor edit
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  #33  
Old 14.08.2015, 13:35
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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Am I the only one that thinks a bit of common decency is called for. The OP ordered the part and the company shipped it. If the part goes back having effectively been refused it does come across as a bit of bad form.

If I was running the company I'd black list the OP - and if it was a Land Rover specialist - I'd go as far as contacting other specialist and informing them that the OP is a timewaster.

Why can't you take delivery of the part and sell it on Ricardo? Or simply keep it for when the clutch actually does fail - probably about this time next year?

Exactly- surely by ordering the part- you enter into a contract with the seller. In Swiss law at least, you can't ask for a refund because you have changed your mind- only if the part or goods are faulty. As said- a bit of decency would not go amiss. At least contact them and discuss this and offer to pay postage!
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  #34  
Old 14.08.2015, 14:54
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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Exactly- surely by ordering the part- you enter into a contract with the seller. In Swiss law at least, you can't ask for a refund because you have changed your mind- only if the part or goods are faulty. As said- a bit of decency would not go amiss. At least contact them and discuss this and offer to pay postage!
Can you please link or quote me the section of Swiss law that states you cannot ask for a refund because you have not accepted a parcel (thus not taken ownership or possession of it) and changed your mind? Genuine question.
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Old 14.08.2015, 14:58
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

No I can't- this is just my take on this, that by ordering you are entering into a contract.

I will write now to the Consumer Association of which I am a member (Bon Savoir, in Romandie) and ask them - it is indeed a very interesting question. Certainly in Switzerland there is no right of refund for merely changing your mind.

Question sent.

Adrian- when I get clothes mail order- the contract is clear that I can return if I do not like it, or wrong size, etc- and that is clear from the start. However I do have to take receipt of the parcel, fill a return form, and PAY for postage.

Last edited by Odile; 14.08.2015 at 15:23.
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  #36  
Old 14.08.2015, 15:11
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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Exactly- surely by ordering the part- you enter into a contract with the seller. In Swiss law at least, you can't ask for a refund because you have changed your mind- only if the part or goods are faulty. As said- a bit of decency would not go amiss. At least contact them and discuss this and offer to pay postage!
In the EU, apparently UK as well, during two weeks you have the right to cancel simply because you changed your mind. The seller has to pay back the full amount of what you already paid (if any) within two weeks of your cancel.

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Can you please link or quote me the section of Swiss law that states you cannot ask for a refund because you have not accepted a parcel (thus not taken ownership or possession of it) and changed your mind? Genuine question.
In CH (or rather, under CH law) you have entered a valid and binding contract that you are to honor and have no right to cancel unless the seller explicitly gives that option. The EU grants an exception to that rule, for which they created and enacted some law. There's no such exception under CH law, and therefor there's no article to quote. Each contract party has to enable the respective partner to fulfill its duties, and by not accepting the parcel you break that duty (unless delivery by courier is excluded by the contract).

Though it's therefor impossible to quote such law for CH, there is indeed official info on that.

Last edited by Urs Max; 14.08.2015 at 15:23.
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  #37  
Old 14.08.2015, 15:17
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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No different to people who order clothes, discover it's the wrong size/colour or simply change their mind, and send it back. People have been doing that since mail order existed which pre-dates the internet.
Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel is different than what you are describing above.

I would have the decency to contact the seller in this situation. It's not like the OP was ordering a pair of shoes from Zalando.

But then again, the OP can do whatever he likes.
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Old 14.08.2015, 17:36
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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In CH (or rather, under CH law) you have entered a valid and binding contract that you are to honor and have no right to cancel unless the seller explicitly gives that option.
Thus the 'Buy Swiss!' brigade should not complain when we choose to make our online purchases in other countries, from companies with far more customer-friendly policies.

There is an inherent risk when purchasing online. The product may not be as represented, may not fit the need as imagined from the description, or the customer may simply not like it when seen in the flesh. That many Swiss online businesses have chosen to transfer all the risk to the customer is, IMO, shortsighted.

If I'm sitting on the fence on whether or not to make a purchase with a non-Swiss store I will probably take the leap, knowing that if I am not completely happy with the item I can return it, no loss except for postage. Several of my favorite companies even pay for return postage.

The smart retailers know that a return here or there is simply the cost of doing business, an investment in developing a loyal customer. Likely these businesses will more than make up for it in repeat purchases - and they know that good will generated adds to their reputation, bringing in new customers... and so on and so forth.

So I spend my discretionary income outside of Switzerland, with retailers who have a 'no questions asked' return policy.

Swiss retailers have chosen to do business differently. That's their right, and their look-out. But they shouldn't complain when customers choose to shop elsewhere.
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  #39  
Old 15.08.2015, 02:10
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

Sounds good at a glance, and broadly speaking I'm with you. And yet, I beg to differ as with everything, there can be too much of a good thing.

For instance, Zalando gives the right to return until 100 days, no questions asked. Reportedly 50% of all orders are returned, often requiring markdowns. Apparently a big number of orders (double digit percentage) are issued with the intent on returning them - after having worn the dress over the weekend.

So perhaps rules should be amended? if customer wants immediate delivery he has no right to cancel. The right only exists if delivery is delayed by a certain number of days, during those days. Or something along these lines.
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Old 15.08.2015, 03:04
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Re: Deliberately not taking receipt of a parcel

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For instance, Zalando gives the right to return until 100 days, no questions asked. Reportedly 50% of all orders are returned, often requiring markdowns. Apparently a big number of orders (double digit percentage) are issued with the intent on returning them - after having worn the dress over the weekend.
Na und?

Presumably Zalando did their market research and cost/benefit analysis before implementing their return policy.

And presumably they concluded that a liberal return policy was good for their business.

If 50% if orders are returned and Zalando is still offering the same policy one can only presume that they are still ahead of the game.
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