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  #21  
Old 26.12.2011, 20:19
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Re: Early Integration by Vinta - C Permit - Non-EU

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Hi,

I am also from Non-EU (from South Asia). I was able to get the C permit after 5 years of my stay in Zurich.

Please find below all the related information about applying for C Permit in Zurich Kanton.

Step 1: While filling the form for renewing the B permit, one must mention in the field "other/sonstiges/ Bemerkungen" that " Ich wohne Seit ........ in der schweiz und wollte unter Vinta für C bewilligung bewerben.

Step 2: The applicant will receive a letter from Migrationsamt Zürich with a list of all the required documents. Within permitted period the applicant has to send all the documents (with a covering letter ) to the address given by Migrationsamt Zürich.

The list generally contains following documents:

1) Certificate that shows the applicant german language skills (Niveau B1 if one is applying after 5 years and Niveau A2 if applying after 10 years) e.g. from TELC, Goethe etc.
2) Certificate showing that applicant is resident of kanton zürich. One can get this certificate from gemeinde.
3) Certificate that shows one is fully integrated in the swiss society e.g. letter from employer or from any verein (club) where one participates regularly.
4) No dues certificate (from gemeinde)
5) No criminal record (from Federal office in Bern)

You can find the additional information on following links:

Read page no 11 of übersicht Aufenthaltskategorien PDF (here it is mentioned that one can get C permit after 5 or 10 years)
http://www.ma.zh.ch/internet/sicherh...tPar-textimage

Link for general information on C permit
http://www.bfm.admin.ch/content/bfm/...willigung.html

Link for information on integration: (on this page you will find the link to VintA on right side)
http://www.bfm.admin.ch/content/bfm/...tegration.html

Link for criteria required for applying C Permit:
http://www.bfm.admin.ch/content/bfm/...19.html#a_0019

I hope this information will be helpful for you and you will be able to get the C permit soon.

Good luck
Excellent info with sound details. Thanks a lot. May I ask you about your permits during the stay. Had you spent all your 5 years on B permit or had been also on L for 2 years. I checked in Gemeinde but they were not clear on this details. According to them 5 years to be spend on B permit as an eligibility. Please shed some light on this darkness.

Secondly, does moving to a different Gemeinde or Kanton affect this process of applying to C permit.
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  #22  
Old 27.12.2011, 22:01
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Re: Early Integration by Vinta - C Permit - Non-EU

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Had you spent all your 5 years on B permit or had been also on L for 2 years. I checked in Gemeinde but they were not clear on this details. According to them 5 years to be spend on B permit as an eligibility. Please shed some light on this darkness.
......
Secondly, does moving to a different Gemeinde or Kanton affect this process of applying to C permit.
Unfortunately, I won't be able to provide any valuable information on the issue of L vs B permit and continuous stay restriction. All I can tell is that my 5 year stay was on B permit and I have been living in the same Gemeinde.

However, the documents I have read so far, I did not encounter any such restrictions of continuous stay or L vs B issues.

AFAIK, such restrictions do apply when applying for Swiss citizenship (after 12 years of continuous stay). e.g Zurich has the following rules*:

- Last 2 years in the same Gemeinde
- Last 5 years in Zurich Kanton

*These rules vary from Kanton to Kanton.

http://www.gaz.zh.ch/internet/justiz...rdernisse.html

Hope it helps.
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  #23  
Old 28.12.2011, 12:41
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

Thanks, it makes me clear. One has to spend 5 years on B permit, irrespective of the 2 years of L permit.

On moving to different Kantons, I will check it back with the Gemeinde.
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  #24  
Old 24.01.2012, 22:26
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

excellent post....was looking for info to check if time spent with L is counted towards C or not...this is first post which clearly answers this question
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  #25  
Old 25.01.2012, 23:11
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

Is there any condition that I have to be in same city for last 5 years
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  #26  
Old 28.01.2012, 01:26
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

Hello all,

As this topic seems to be one of the most popular ones, I will try to ask here and would be grateful for any comment.

Assume that I am a non-EU, married to non-EU and lived in Switzerland for 5 years, 4 on carte de legitimation and 1 year on B. The last year was in the canton ZH, first four in GE. My spouse lived with me for 2 years (1 on CL, 1 with B). She doesn't know German at all. The question is: am I entitled to apply for an early C-permit if I know German?

The early C-permit application rules say that the integration level is checked for all the family members (from http://www.ma.zh.ch/internet/sicherh...ewilligung.pdf , clause 5.1):

Bei der Prüfung des Gesuchs um vorzeitige Erteilung der Niederlassungsbewilligung wird der Integrationsgrad der Familienangehörigen berücksichtigt, die älter als zwölf Jahre sind (Art. 62 Abs. 2 VZAE, Art. 3 VIntA). Bei Familien (Ehepaare oder Eltern mit minderjährigen Kin- dern) wird das Gesuch nur bewilligt, wenn alle Familienangehörigen die Voraussetzungen für die vorzeitige Erteilung der Niederlassungsbewilligung erfüllen (VGr, 23. Februar 2011, VB. 2010.00530).

If my spouse doesn't qualify for the integration - am I allowed to submit an application for myself only?

Thank you in advance!
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  #27  
Old 28.01.2012, 13:09
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

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excellent post....was looking for info to check if time spent with L is counted towards C or not...this is first post which clearly answers this question
The law is set at the Federal Level (5 years uninterrupted residency with gainful activity, with no specific mention whether all 5 years should be spent on a B). The implementation, however, is at the Cantonal level, and they can ammend requirements at their discretion which can be based on their particular interpretation of federal law (hence they could require all 5 years on a B Permit if they so wish). I know of rejections due to 1 or 2 years being spent on an L. In my case, I spent 2 of my 5 years on an L before getting a C.

My belief is that certain Cantons (e.g., Suisse Romande) are more lenient in interpreting federal migration law, whilst others are not.
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  #28  
Old 09.02.2012, 14:28
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

Hi all!

Update on my VINTA C permit application.
FAIL

It is almost my 6th year in CH with B permit.. Migrationsamt rejected my VINTA application because my first 3 years in CH was on a "limited" workpermit. Meaning that I was only allowed to work for one employer. As of 2010, I received my unlimited work permit which allows me to work for anyone.

Migrationsamt claims that, they only start counting 5 years of continuious stay in CH AS OF UNLIMITED WORK PERMIT DATE in 2010! So in their eyes, i have been integrating into CH only about since 2 years.. on the other hand, I meet and exceed every requirement VINTA has for early C Permit. Although within VINTA, there is no such explanation towards counting years and how it depends on your work permit type. I assume this is how migration office in Zurich interprets VINTA

Obviously it is ridiculous i know.. changing work permit from limited to unlimited has nothing to do with how integrated I am. I have been living in Switzerland and among Swiss since the first day I got here.. even though my work permit was limited, I still had B permit and I still worked at a swiss company with swiss collegues..

I just sent my reaction in written to Migrationsamt claiming that their rejection has no logical ground and that is unfair compared to EU nationalss who anyway receive automatic C permits after 5 years, only because of the country issued their passports! ..
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  #29  
Old 16.02.2012, 21:27
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

Hi Baris,

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Hi all!

Update on my VINTA C permit application.
FAIL
What you mean is not really VINTA, its called: Vorzeitige Erteilung der Niederlassungsbewilligung auf Grund erfolgreicher Integration.

VINTA is:
Verordnung über die Integration von Ausländerinnen und Ausländer

anyway...i get the point...I checked the documents here:

http://www.ma.zh.ch/internet/sicherh...ewilligung.pdf

(sorry its in German)

Important points:

"Die Niederlassungsbewilligung kann nach einem ununterbrochenen Aufenthalt mit Aufenthaltsbewilligung während den letzten fünf Jahren erteilt werden, wenn eine erfolgreiche Integration vorliegt, namentlich wenn die betroffene Person über gute Kenntnisse einer Lan-
dessprache verfügt (Art. 34 Abs. 4 AuG)."

Important documents to submit:

Erforderliche Dokumente
Strafregisterauszug (kann über www.strafregister.admin.ch oder über eine Poststelle
bestellt werden).
Aktueller Betreibungsregisterauszug der Wohngemeinden der letzten drei Jahre.
Nachweis, dass der Gesuchsteller in den letzten fünf Jahren in der Schweiz durchge-
hend einer Erwerbstätigkeit nachgegangen ist.
Zertifikat, das dem Gesuchsteller bescheinigt, die deutsche Sprache in Niveau B1
(schriftlich und mündlich) zu beherrschen.
Nachweis, dass der Gesuchsteller während der gesamten Dauer des Aufenthaltes in
der Schweiz nie von der Sozialhilfe unterstützt werden musste.


So in short, did you submit all these documents? bear in mind the german level required in ZH is B1, not A2.


The law clearly states that you have to have an aufenthaltsbewilligung in this 5 years, which you had, its not mentioned that your work permi must be open, the papers they ask you to submit say that you had to employed in this time.

so get some lawyers... ->http://www.sgierpartner.ch/ they have a hotline (not free, but still cheap compared with the hourly rate of a lawyer)where you can tell them quickly your case send the docs and will get an answer.

hope this helps.

Chris
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  #30  
Old 16.02.2012, 22:45
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

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The law is set at the Federal Level (5 years uninterrupted residency with gainful activity, with no specific mention whether all 5 years should be spent on a B). The implementation, however, is at the Cantonal level, and they can ammend requirements at their discretion .
Nope, they can not.
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  #31  
Old 17.02.2012, 20:36
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

Given the above unfortunate case of 'baris' in which he could not make it by himself, regardless of the fact that all his requirements were satisfied, would it make sense to hire a lawyer in this case? My conjecture is that the decision makers at the Gemeinde will take it more seriously.



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Nope, they can not.
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  #32  
Old 18.02.2012, 09:08
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

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Nope, they can not.
I would agree with you in theory. In practice I would disagree.

I have seen several US and Canadian citizens who secured a C permit in 5 years without a language test in some cantons, whilst others with a language test in other Cantons. Some cantons also require 5 years on a B, others require 5 years since date of entry (regardless of Ls).

From my observation, French-speaking cantons tend to be more lenient when interpreting Federal Immigration Law.
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  #33  
Old 18.02.2012, 09:34
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

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I would agree with you in theory. In practice I would disagree.

I have seen several US and Canadian citizens who secured a C permit in 5 years without a language test in some cantons, whilst others with a language test in other Cantons. Some cantons also require 5 years on a B, others require 5 years since date of entry (regardless of Ls).

From my observation, French-speaking cantons tend to be more lenient when interpreting Federal Immigration Law.
The problem is both theory and practice disagree with you. There is no defined federal language requirement test for US and Canadian citizens...there is only a requirement for ascertaining "integration" - as they are going through the "normal" delivery process of a C permit. The cantons can therefore interpret "integration" as they like. Some will require a language test, some other not. Also for the normal delivery, there is no difference between L and B permits, so date of entry is what matters.

This has nothing to do with the early delivery of a C permit where there's no interpretation left to the cantons, the language test is mandatory, and L permits are excluded.

Your experience with US and Canadian citizens is irrelevant in this context.
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Last edited by Shorrick Mk2; 18.02.2012 at 09:53.
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  #34  
Old 18.02.2012, 09:38
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

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Given the above unfortunate case of 'baris' in which he could not make it by himself, regardless of the fact that all his requirements were satisfied, would it make sense to hire a lawyer in this case? My conjecture is that the decision makers at the Gemeinde will take it more seriously.
The requirements weren't satisfied. Early delivery of a C permit requires 5 years on a B permit (aufenthaltbewilligung). Normal delivery requires 10 years either on a B or on a L (kurzaufenthaltbewilligung).

Note the legal distinction is very clear between the two.
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  #35  
Old 18.02.2012, 09:47
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

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The requirements weren't satisfied. Early delivery of a C permit requires 5 years on a B permit (aufenthaltbewilligung).

Hi,

why not? he claims to have been almost 6 years on a B permit. AFAIK B permit == Aufenthaltsbewilligung.
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  #36  
Old 18.02.2012, 09:55
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

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The requirements weren't satisfied. Early delivery of a C permit requires 5 years on a B permit (aufenthaltbewilligung). Normal delivery requires 10 years either on a B or on a L (kurzaufenthaltbewilligung).

Note the legal distinction is very clear between the two.
Well, I have a B permit since September 2008 with an "Aufenthaltbewilligung" written on it, but this is apparently a STUDENT B permit (I as a PhD student, though was receiving a very descent salary for being employed as a research\teaching associate during all this period). So do you think it would be taken into the 5 years early delivery period for non-EU to get a C permit?


However, I am about to get a job in some investment company, so probably it will be changed to L permit, and thus I won;t be able to exploit this law. By the way, does the investment company decide for what type of permit (B or L) the work permit application is for, or the immigration office internally determines it?
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  #37  
Old 18.02.2012, 10:15
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

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my first 3 years in CH was on a "limited" workpermit. ..
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Hi,

why not? he claims to have been almost 6 years on a B permit. AFAIK B permit == Aufenthaltsbewilligung.
"Limited" permit = kurzaufenthaltsbewilligung. Art 32 AuG. Can also carry the B letter...

I should have rephrased my answer to "an unrestricted B permit" to be 100% accurate.
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Old 22.05.2012, 21:54
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Re: Early C Permit for a Non-EU National through VINTA

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Hi all!

Update on my VINTA C permit application.
FAIL

It is almost my 6th year in CH with B permit.. Migrationsamt rejected my VINTA application because my first 3 years in CH was on a "limited" workpermit. Meaning that I was only allowed to work for one employer. As of 2010, I received my unlimited work permit which allows me to work for anyone.

Migrationsamt claims that, they only start counting 5 years of continuious stay in CH AS OF UNLIMITED WORK PERMIT DATE in 2010! So in their eyes, i have been integrating into CH only about since 2 years.. on the other hand, I meet and exceed every requirement VINTA has for early C Permit. Although within VINTA, there is no such explanation towards counting years and how it depends on your work permit type. I assume this is how migration office in Zurich interprets VINTA

Obviously it is ridiculous i know.. changing work permit from limited to unlimited has nothing to do with how integrated I am. I have been living in Switzerland and among Swiss since the first day I got here.. even though my work permit was limited, I still had B permit and I still worked at a swiss company with swiss collegues..

I just sent my reaction in written to Migrationsamt claiming that their rejection has no logical ground and that is unfair compared to EU nationalss who anyway receive automatic C permits after 5 years, only because of the country issued their passports! ..
Hi,

Could you please tell us what happened to your case? What was the reaction of Migrationsamt to your letter?

Thanks indeed,
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  #39  
Old 15.07.2012, 15:08
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Re: Early Integration by Vinta - C Permit - Non-EU

Thanks
What if I have been partially on L permit, example: 3 on B, 2 on L, another 2 on B afterwards?


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Hi,

I am also from Non-EU (from South Asia). I was able to get the C permit after 5 years of my stay in Zurich.

Please find below all the related information about applying for C Permit in Zurich Kanton.

Step 1: While filling the form for renewing the B permit, one must mention in the field "other/sonstiges/ Bemerkungen" that " Ich wohne Seit ........ in der schweiz und wollte unter Vinta für C bewilligung bewerben.

Step 2: The applicant will receive a letter from Migrationsamt Zürich with a list of all the required documents. Within permitted period the applicant has to send all the documents (with a covering letter ) to the address given by Migrationsamt Zürich.

The list generally contains following documents:

1) Certificate that shows the applicant german language skills (Niveau B1 if one is applying after 5 years and Niveau A2 if applying after 10 years) e.g. from TELC, Goethe etc.
2) Certificate showing that applicant is resident of kanton zürich. One can get this certificate from gemeinde.
3) Certificate that shows one is fully integrated in the swiss society e.g. letter from employer or from any verein (club) where one participates regularly.
4) No dues certificate (from gemeinde)
5) No criminal record (from Federal office in Bern)

You can find the additional information on following links:

Read page no 11 of übersicht Aufenthaltskategorien PDF (here it is mentioned that one can get C permit after 5 or 10 years)
http://www.ma.zh.ch/internet/sicherh...tPar-textimage

Link for general information on C permit
http://www.bfm.admin.ch/content/bfm/...willigung.html

Link for information on integration: (on this page you will find the link to VintA on right side)
http://www.bfm.admin.ch/content/bfm/...tegration.html

Link for criteria required for applying C Permit:
http://www.bfm.admin.ch/content/bfm/...19.html#a_0019

I hope this information will be helpful for you and you will be able to get the C permit soon.

Good luck
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  #40  
Old 15.07.2012, 15:19
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Re: Early Integration by Vinta - C Permit - Non-EU

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Thanks
What if I have been partially on L permit, example: 3 on B, 2 on L, another 2 on B afterwards?
If I understood it correctly, the only count your B work permit years, and not any L permit or student visa.

But check more, I might be wrong.
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