Hello All,

ive been living in swiss frm last 1 and half year on L permit , my visa is to be extended , i guess to B permit sometimes next month, but i have no clue whether my spouse can work in swiss or not if am holding B permit(she is professionally qualified) can anybody advise me regarding this... .

Cheers

there's a certain assumption that it's a non-EU B?

next month you most probably won't get a B anyway due to quotas - but the renewal process will likely take the issuance into next year and you might. But for EU people, May 2007 is I believe a significant month.

I'm assuming you're not EU by your use of the world "swiss" instead of Switzerland - but you're welcome to ruin my guesstimate

To answer your question no, not necessarily. If she came at the same time as you then she should have the same permit as you, but if you are given an L then generally you do not have a *right* to bring your wife and you do not mention her permit so I am guessing she is just living with you without a permit. That said key is where you are from EU or non-EU.

In order for her to be employable she will need a permit of her own. I would suggest therefore that she applies for one. Then she will be able to work. It is a relatively simple process to apply for a permit for a spouse - ask the local town hall for details.

Here's my experience in canton Vaud: I'm from the EU (UK) and arrived here last year on a B-permit, my wife is non-EU (Canada) and applied for a permit before we came, but nothing happened until after we were here. Noone was able to tell us whether she would get one, or what type, but when it finally arrived it was a B-perimt valid for 5 years, so we were very happy.

Good luck getting yours sorted out, Dillon!

Actually we could have told you here what she would get quite easily...

And here is something interesting. You had a job and came with your wife on a B permit. ie entry was contemporaneous. In these circumstances the spouse be it male or female gets exactly the same permit as the working person. This is written in law. Except for one case which is most interesting. If the boot had have been on the other foot, meaning you were from Canada and your wife from the UK and you were still the one with employment, your wife's status as a UK citizen would have changed your permit rules to that of an EU citizen meaning you would get an EU B and not a normal B. I also take it that your wife got an EU B as well, as you are legally entitled to this.

sorry to hijack this thread but I need to ask "Richard - how the hell do you know so much stuff?"

The recent thread asking "how the EF has helped you" should be "How has Richard on the EF helped you?"

Hi Nicky,

Thanks a lot for the compliment you are of course most welcome to donate reputation points to me as well.

In answer to your question, when I came here life was not so easy as it is today for EUers and we had to fight along with all the others to get our way. The only way you could win some of these fights was to know what the law actually stated and then quote it to the person in the "town hall" when they said no way. This meant many nights of reading employment law, law on entry of foreign citizens, permits, duty on goods, tax law etc. In the end if sort leaves a mark on your forehead like Harry Potter and does not go away.

And even worse the Swiss had not got their act in gear with regards to the internet so I had to buy all the books. Beobachter books tend to be the easiest to read but you need a copy of Obligationsrecht and the Zivilgesetzbuch to be sure.

Hi,
I will be moving over next summer to Vaud.
Both hubby and I are from UK. I will be the one working initially, wishful thinking that i`ll find a job very quickly! So I assume I will get a b permit. I think that Richard said if your spouse and permit holder go to switzerland at the same time then spouse will get same permit. Does the B permit specifically say what you can and cannot do. ie if I am employed by someone else on by b permit will my hubby be able to set up a business SArl or sole trader? If he comes over at a later date will getting a permit be a problem.
I know the situation changes after My 2007 that`s really why we have decided to go then. I have phoned the bureau des etrangers in lausanne several times, also Berne and geneva UK consulates and have millions of bits of paper on the subject but still remained confused.
regards
jo

Wow, I'm also impressed by you, Richard. You know WAY more about this than the people at the Swiss Embassy in Canada or the folks in the immigration office (Office d'Etranger) in Lausanne did, from both of whom the only response we got was "We're not sure what your wife will receive, you'll have to wait and see." Maybe they haven't looked at the law books lately.

Lets assume first of all that you come over and get an EU B permit. And lets assume that you come over in the summer of next year. When your husband comes over in the later summer he too will get an EU B permit based on his right to join the family. This is especially covered in Swiss law that a B permit holder's family can join at a later date and covers the situation that you get sacked in your trial period.

After May 2007 nothing really changes apart from the EU B permits that have been issued are removed from the quota system and all future issued permits are not included in the quotas. What also changes is that the holder of such a permit should not be placed at any disadvantage in comparison to a Swiss citizen in any matters of employment. Many may say ah but that is the state today. Well nearly but not quite. It will effectively mean that if he chooses to become self-employed he will have a right to do it whereas today he needs to seek approval to do it, although he is allowed.

Now anyway irrespective of whether he comes from the EU or the most unliked country in the world (from a Swiss perspective) he has the right to form an SA. He cannot however do it alone and the use of straw men to get around the 2 or 3 people minimum who need to be on the board might be the only problem he has. He can then employ himself without any problem. Note also that an SA has a significant capital investment requirement but then again this is no doubt another thread so enough...

Being self employed though he will need to know a few things about his legal form of his business and whether he requires a permit to perform whatever the business is. Believe me when I say these permit requirements vary from kanton to kanton and from community to community. An example and I will probably get the translation wrong is that healer through natural methods needs no permit in Appenzel but this profession is banned in kanton Zurich.

IF you want to know more about what you can and cannot do and the different forms of a business open a new thread.

Here is where things don't make a lot of sense. If the non- EU spouse of a working EU B holder also gets a five year B, why do non-EU spouse of Swiss citizens only get 1 or 2 year Bs? Or have I just misunderstood everything?

No you have not. The reason is to be found in the Swiss treaty with the EU - if you care to read it that is. Clearly the non-EU spouse did not negotiate anything so well so they get what they are given

Hi,
thanks for the info. It is diffiult to get the correct information sometimes.When I phoned the swiss embassy london, they told me to contact Uk embassy berne for info about permits for Uk citizens. The when I phoned the the bureau des etrangers i was initially given the wrong info, when i questioned it the girl went to talk to her supervisor and came back with different info!
I have been told by them that when I come over my hubby will get a premit "regroupement familiale" but not be able to work etc until he applies for such a permit.
My big fear is I get over there, find a job , and then find he can`t stay and work. Weve both got good jobs in UK and I know I will not be able to get the same position. Its a bit scary and very uncertain, especially when there are kids to look after. When we were younger taking risks wern`t a problem, maybe I`m just getting old!


Jo

You mentioned that you have a good job in the UK. You also mentioned that you still have to find a job in Switzerland and that you are afraid that you won't find the same one. But why do you move at all? Or did you mention that before and I just missed it? Sorry, I am just a bit confused....

Hi,
Why move you ask?
we have been thinking of moving to Switzerland or france for several years now, but due to various factors its not been possible. i have lived and worked previously in lausanne and we both visit the country on a regular basis and love it. we also have some really good British and swiss friends in the region. Although we both have good jobs or jobs which we enjoy ( although mine isn`t particularly lucrative) , for both of us it is now is only really only a means to an end and we ultimately want to have our own business.

We don`t want to completely burn our bridges and will see how things pan out so will probably keep a house here in Scotland initially, just in case things don`t work out, eg kids find it too difficult to learn langauge and integrate.
Jo

Hi Jo,

Don't want to pee on your cornflakes but how old are the kids? This is important and what kind of business were you thinking of opening?

Richard

Hi, kids are presently 9 and 11 years old.
the eldest was only 16 months old when we moved to france for 18 months and has been having french lessons on and off ever since. the youngest has been having french and gaelic!! for 3 years. Hubby is in construction business so something like that I guess( he`s a civil engineer)
Joan

Well you are lucky that you are thinking of going to the French part of Switzerland. Your kids will have about 2 years to catch up before being streamed into the respective secondary school and given that they have a grounding in French that should not be too much of a problem. As for hubby what on earth is he going to do self employed? Sorry for asking but there are certain restrictions on what you can actually do. And to be frank I have no idea what the market is like for self employed civil engineers`!

I think it is not too easy for civil engineers to have their own company here. I have a friend who is Swiss and owns his own civil engineering company in Vaud (they build tunnels, bridges). He needed to buy another company (how he bought one I have no idea) from someone else who already has a reputation because he said it's very difficult to get projects without having a name...

Hi,
we are hoping to build chalets!!! he`s also a chartered builder in this country. We already have some contacts in this industry and would use local architects etc. so he will not really be using his qualifications , but more project manage.
Joan