Hello All,

I am a non EU citizen, currently working for Nestle, Vevey on an L permit and in my second year in Switzerland. My L permit has been renewed a second time and is due to expire in January 2008, and is tied to Nestec SA.

Recently i received a permanent job offer from another company in Zurich and decided to go ahead with it. Since this was quite a good company and they told me that there would not be any problems in getting the work permit, i had a degree of confidence and accepted the offer and resigned from Nestle, giving them a 3 months notice for the replacement and the knowledge transfer etc.

Now after around three weeks i received a call from my future employer in Zurich that my work permit was rejected in the canton of Zurich. They had applied it twice and it was rejected twice. The reason was that my L permit is only valid for employment with Nestle but that they would be willing to check my permission again in January 2008 after i have left switzerland.

This was a terrible blow as i have already resigned and would have to leave Switzerland. Does anyone know of my future possibilities here and if something can be done further?

I talked to the authorities in Vaud as well and they said that there was nothing that they could do, since i was here on an L permit which is valid for a 'short term' project only with Nestle. Hence i could only work with Nestle till January 2008.

Also wanted to highlight this so that others would be more careful while changing jobs.

Best Regards,
Ned

Thats a horrible thing to have happen but yes they are correct and you should have known this or at the very least your employer should have warned you when you handed your notice in, especially if you mentioned to them you found another job in _Switzerland_ and planned to stay - but where do you find a swiss that will warn you about anything till after the event You will have to leave Switzerland im afraid and get any employer to re-apply while you are outside on the grounds that nobody can be found in Switzerland or EU to feel this position blah blah blah. Love to see if anybody found a way around this

This of course applies to those without any permit requirements too. NEVER give in your notice until you have the new job offer in writing and have signed a contract. And if a permit is required see it first!

But we all feel for you Ned. I'm sure. Hopefully you are young enough and well-qualified, without too large a family and another position will be found soon - if not in Switzerland...

Hi Adfab. Lets put your recommendation in perspective.

If you are a non-EU wanting to change jobs and don't have a C permit nor a C permit spouse nor a Swiss spouse and also not an EU Spouse then you need to tread very carefully before changing jobs... The key advice is to ensure the permit is confirmed. However, irrespective of everything, you do need to remember that your employer can give you notice of 1 week the day after signing the contract of employment and still be within their rights - will cost them 1 weeks salary but you a lot of hassle...

So when you change jobs make sure you know why and what you are doing. In Switzerland it happens quite infrequently although staying 20 years with the same company offers only marginally more protection...

Richard, don't you think quotas might have played a role in this - Nestekjos mentioned clearly he was on a non-EU L permit rather than a EU L or a normal B.

so does it mean that the safest way is to stay put until the final permit arrives ? Since one has to surrender the old permit when changing jobs, can one continue to work for the current employer until the permit arrives and then give in notice ?

The other issue could be change of cantons; it is all very confusing.

the problem is with the L permit, you can't just simply change job because it is dependent on the actual job..the permit depends on quota and will also depend on the canton....
The same rule would apply even if you have a B permit...a good example, I had a B permit and before I could move to another canton and apply for work ( even if being married to a swiss) i still had to see if the canton would give me a permit to work....and changing branch is going to even trickier....

I am going through a similar situation. I already have a NON EU B permit since last year and I am about to change my job after having received an offer I couldnt refuse.

But this time I first checked it with Arbeitsamt to make sure that my work permit is transferrable. What I found out was that, my work permit was granted for 3 years provided that Im employed in my current employer and I am unable to look for a new job for the next 2 years until the current work permit expires. Even If I resigned, I would have to wait until 2009 to come back to Switzerland to look for a new job!!

There is no way around this! unless..
well I got the job and Im starting on July 1st. How did I do it?
I had a swiss girlfriend and we decided to marry on 12th of May. This is the only way to lift off the Arbeitsamt chains around your work permit.

Marriage with a swiss is the only way to get around this problem!
I do not see any other legal way.
Good luck!

that is not correct at all...if you are married to a Swiss national there is no problem.
----------

@danny: you're right. I checked it out. Then Its a common misconception that most employer has...

No it is not a common misconception it is a fact. However, as a spouse of a Swiss person you do not need to worry as it is more or less a rubber stamp - you are not in the quota system and once you have a work permit you are okay BUT the first time you apply for a job this is not the case...

Barish there are other ways to get around your problem such as marrying an EU citizen or leaving waiting 3 months and then coming back or working for an international organisation or marrying someone working there or taking a seat as a professor at a university or...

AFAIK this is something to do with your employer. Many employers actually do put chains around permit B holders - ABB is a classic example for non-EU permit B's. Most "normal" permit B's are transferrable only after 2 years. But if you have a job like I did where it involved cross-cantonal administration then chances are your permit would the most flexible.

I've changed jobs a number of times and have never had to hand in my permit. My permit B number is still the same as it ever was and this included changing cantons (working and living). If your permit is transferrable, your employer just needs to fill in some paperwork to let the arbeitsamt know they're employing a foreigner and you just need to update the company address on your permit.

This is for a transferrable permit. If your permit is not transferrable, then I guess you'll have to get a completely new one and give up the old.

And as I mentioned in my previous post, most B's are transferrable after 2 years..

Just for your information your "permit B number" is called a ZAR Number Zentralarbeitsregister. This number remains the same as long as you are in Switzerland irrespective of permit.

As you say *most* permits are transferable and if they are not then you are more than likely going to find you have no right to unemployment benefit...

Yes and no. He is registered to Nestle and requires their permission to move on. But even given he gets this permission then he will require a new permit application with the only advantage being his records within Switzerland are available meaning a marginally faster approval (or rejection...). There are options available to him but these are somewhat limited and the best bet now is to try to get Nestle to formally release him - something they might be willing to do if he cooperates fully with handover etc but this should be discussed early...

I guess the other situation I am aware of, though not 100% sure is that you come here on a b permit and after some time, say one year your job is not needed anymore. In that case you can take the letter from the company and apply for the change of employer.
Now because you didn't leave the company on your own and company asked to leave you but at the same time you have another company ready to offer you a job, it should not be a problem.

BTW, one question from my side. Who decides the these kind of issues:
1. Amt for Wirzschaft und Arbeit
2. Migrationsmt of Canton or
3. Migration office in Bern

Anybody any comments or experience?

Thanks
AP

from my experience, changing jobs is and getting new work permit is only related to Amt for Wirzschaft und Arbeit. Migrationsamt of the kanton you are living in has no function but just to renew your permit every year depending on your work permit conditions from Arbeitsamt.

If you are living in Switzerland with a B permit granted only due to your profession, than it is the Arbeitsamt whose decision will just trigger Migrationsamt to issue the permit papers.

But.. if you are married to a swiss and your reason for living in switzerland is your swiss partner, than the ball is on migrationsamt. Arbetisamt will have to issue a work permit because Migrationsamt tells them to do so since you are married to a swiss.

somebody tell me.. Am I wrong?

Yes! You have forgotten that there are actually two permits - one to reside and one to work. It is possible and not entirely uncommon to have the residence permit but not a work permit.

The first port of call is always the migrationsamt - logic states you can't work if you are not allowed to stay and they decide on the stay point. They will either tell the arbeitsamt to issue a permit or they will request advice ie is this position difficult to fill ie is there a case for issuing a permit. Upon fulfillment of the necessary conditions to reside in Switzerland they will issue a residence permit and then pass it on to the arbeitsamt for the issuance of a work permit. Given the fact that they have previously been involved in the application they will simply add their stamp. If the person had a residence permit already, even an L, and they are now applying for a work permit, then the deciding authority will indeed be the arbeitsamt.

Note however that the arbeitsamt is actually not involved in deciding in a number of cases. These are whenever the permit is outside of the quota. They still might need to add it to their records - in the case of a Swiss or EU spouse for example, but they will have little/no say in the decision making process.

All those requests with a C permit or an EFTA/Swiss spouse B permit requesting a change of employer are not arbeitsamt relevant.