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  #21  
Old 27.01.2015, 13:51
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Re: Cat food advice.

Mine never ate expensive food. I fed them Whiskas, Felix, the cheapy budget stuff etc. The dry food was the same and they lived to good ages.

The expensive stuff at the vets i only picked up in the sample bags.

They loved the canned tuna from the Migros. Also raw liver, mince and one used to nick fishfingers off my plate and gently peel the batter off!!

When Jimmy, sadly, had to go to his new home they got the vet round to give him a check up. He was 13 years old in perfect health and only needed his teeth cleaned. I hope he is now 15 and still in good health.
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  #22  
Old 29.01.2015, 17:14
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Re: Cat food advice.

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That is what several vets have told me, dry food is better for their teeth.
They look at the teeth of the cat and ask if I give dry food as they can see the cat does not have much tartar.
As for the price of one kilo purina in Coop : 4,75 Fr. approximately. In Germany : 2,70 Euro.
Well no offense, but most vets don't know jack shit when it comes to cat food. (Other than how much commission they make on the brands they promote in their clinics of course... )

And you might only spend €2,70 per kilo on Purina (I wonder where you manage to buy it at that price, because even at Zooplus it's not that cheap), but if your cat needs around 2 kilograms per week to feel satisfied and with another brand, which costs €5,- per kilo, your cat only needs 1 kilo per week to feel satisfied, it's actually not that cheap if you do the maths.
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Old 29.01.2015, 17:27
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Re: Cat food advice.

Well, Friskies and Felix are Purina brands. The cat eats a box every two or three weeks. When I look at the box, the daily portion advice for healthy cats is 70 grams. It seems he doesn't eat too much then. A fresh mouse now and then too.
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Old 29.01.2015, 17:41
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Re: Cat food advice.

A bird, a frog, a mouse, an odd handfull of fresh lamb mince, piece of boiled fish, and Landi cat food - very healthy cat.
Now she lives with son who buys "only the best" and is having fur problems, and a few other problems, and costing money at the vet.
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Old 29.01.2015, 17:45
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Re: Cat food advice.

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A bird, a frog, a mouse, an odd handfull of fresh lamb mince, piece of boiled fish, and Landi cat food - very healthy cat.
Now she lives with son who buys "only the best" and is having fur problems, and a few other problems, and costing money at the vet.
"Only the best" being what?
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  #26  
Old 29.01.2015, 17:50
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Re: Cat food advice.

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Well, Friskies and Felix are Purina brands. The cat eats a box every two or three weeks. When I look at the box, the daily portion advice for healthy cats is 70 grams. It seems he doesn't eat too much then. A fresh mouse now and then too.
I took the liberty of looking up the ingredients in Friskies:

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Ground yellow corn, corn gluten meal, chicken by-product meal, meat and bone meal, soybean meal, beef tallow preserved with mixed-tocopherols (form of Vitamin E), turkey by-product meal, powdered cellulose, animal liver flavor, soybean hulls, malt extract, phosphoric acid, calcium carbonate, salt, choline chloride, potassium chloride, dried cheese powder, parsley flakes, added color, taurine, zinc sulfate, Vitamin E supplement, ferrous sulfate, Yellow 6, manganese sulfate, niacin, Yellow 5, Red 40, Vitamin A supplement, calcium pantothenate, thiamine mononitrate, Blue 2, copper sulfate, riboflavin supplement, Vitamin B-12 supplement, pyridoxine hydrochloride, folic acid, Vitamin D-3 supplement, calcium iodate, biotin, menadione sodium bisulfite complex (source of Vitamin K activity), sodium selenite. E-6002
So the main ingredient in Friskies is actually corn. In fact: the first time they mention any meat at all is at the fourth place. And then it still doesn't mention anything about the actual share of meat in the whole product. It could just as easily be ground up bones with some flints of meat attached.
A cat is a carnivore, normally corn wouldn't make up for the biggest part of its diet. So why on earth would we feed something to a cat that doesn't correspond with its natural diet?

Now don't get me wrong. If you prefer to give your cat Friskies, for whatever reason (price, cat doesn't complain, convenience), by all means: do it. But don't pretend like it's quality food, just because your cat eats it or your vet tells you it's having a good effect on your cat's teeth.

If I decide to only serve €5,- supermarket pizzas for dinner from now on, first of all my boyfriend would love me, I would probably save loads of money on groceries, it would probably sustain us both and we would probably still be able to grow old on them, but that doesn't mean it would make a very healthy diet.
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  #27  
Old 29.01.2015, 17:57
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Re: Cat food advice.

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I took the liberty of looking up the ingredients in Friskies:

So the main ingredient in Friskies is actually corn. In fact: the first time they mention any meat at all is at the fourth place. And then it still doesn't mention anything about the actual share of meat in the whole product. It could just as easily be ground up bones with some flints of meat attached.
A cat is a carnivore, normally corn wouldn't make up for the biggest part of its diet. So why on earth would we feed something to a cat that doesn't correspond with its natural diet?

Now don't get me wrong. If you prefer to give your cat Friskies, for whatever reason (price, cat doesn't complain, convenience), by all means: do it. But don't pretend like it's quality food, just because your cat eats it or your vet tells you it's having a good effect on your cat's teeth.

If I decide to only serve €5,- supermarket pizzas for dinner from now on, first of all my boyfriend would love me, I would probably save loads of money on groceries, it would probably sustain us both and we would probably still be able to grow old on them, but that doesn't mean it would make a very healthy diet.
Exactly: Growing old with that kind of food can work out - but what are possible consequences?
As you say, feeding food which is inadequate for a human's/animal's needs doesn't mean that things will go south in the future, but IMO it definitely increases the risk of that happening. That is not a risk I would be willing to take with the health of my pets, but of course that's for every pet owner to decide for themselves.
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  #28  
Old 29.01.2015, 20:18
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Re: Cat food advice.

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Well no offense, but most vets don't know jack shit when it comes to cat food.
No offense back at you, but what makes you think you're better qualified to say what's good or bad for an animal to eat than a qualified veterinary surgeon? And in my not inconsiderable experience of them they're very rarely pushing the fad/science/medical diet food except in specific medical cases, like reduced liver function.

To sum up most vets' advice I've received over the years - the standard dry stuff is perfectly good, provided you vary it a bit and give wet food from time to time, especially for outdoor cats who supplement their diets with whatever takes their fancy and/or leftover raw and cooked meat/gristle/fat/skin, like ours get quite frequently.
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Old 29.01.2015, 20:48
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Re: Cat food advice.

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No offense back at you, but what makes you think you're better qualified to say what's good or bad for an animal to eat than a qualified veterinary surgeon? And in my not inconsiderable experience of them they're very rarely pushing the fad/science/medical diet food except in specific medical cases, like reduced liver function.

To sum up most vets' advice I've received over the years - the standard dry stuff is perfectly good, provided you vary it a bit and give wet food from time to time, especially for outdoor cats who supplement their diets with whatever takes their fancy and/or leftover raw and cooked meat/gristle/fat/skin, like ours get quite frequently.
I'm not, but I've read enough stuff from people that do know way more about this specific subject than a qualified veterinary surgeon to know that a remark such as "dry food is better for their teeth than wet food" simply doesn't stick. Just because they are qualified vets, doesn't mean they know all there is to know about every single subject related to animals.

Not saying at all that vets never know what the hell they're talking about and I'm sure they have many qualities, but when it comes to giving solid advice on food, my experience is that they aren't educated very much on the subject. And that's fine, their qualities lie elsewhere.

The same with many Swiss (and non-Swiss) vets still insisting on giving your beloved pet yearly shots, when there is proof that modern day vaccines often last way longer than one year and that it would actually be a lot better to test the blood for antibodies, instead of just pumping pets full with vaccines on a yearly basis.

Newsflash: it's not like qualified medical staff always act in the best interest of their customers. Sadly, financial gain also often plays a factor. No shame in being critical yourself and making your own educated decisions, instead of blindly believing whatever 'qualified' people will tell you.

But yeah whatever, if you feel comfortable with giving your cat Whiskas and Friskies, you should continue to do so. After all that I've read, I'm not, so I won't.
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Old 29.01.2015, 20:58
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Re: Cat food advice.

I believe that cats should eat what they would eat if they were in their natural habitat. Cats living outside don't find kibble in the bushes, but they chase mice/birds etc. So, in my opinion feeding raw is best, and if that's not possible, going with wet food is the next best option.

Vet surgeons might have more experience operating on animals, but how many hours of schooling are dedicated specifically to cat nutrition? Just a couple of hours probably won't be as thorough as a couple of months of research on the subject. Often pet owners spend weeks, if not months, thoroughly researching the subject as they want the best for their pets and are not often influenced by cat food companies in the way vets can be. Not to say that cat owners are more knowledgeable than their pet's doctors per se, but they (obviously) do spend more time with their cats than the vets do because normally vets treat not only cats but also dogs, rats etc.
For me to trust a vet with advice regarding pet nutrition, the vet would have to be open to discussion and listen to my views (even if he doesn't agree), not push "his" brand of kibble on me as the one and only best thing ever, and, especially, not imply that processed kibble is the only way for a cat to survive.
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  #31  
Old 29.01.2015, 22:40
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Re: Cat food advice.

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Vet surgeons might have more experience operating on animals, but how many hours of schooling are dedicated specifically to cat nutrition? Just a couple of hours probably won't be as thorough as a couple of months of research on the subject. Often pet owners spend weeks, if not months, thoroughly researching the subject as they want the best for their pets and are not often influenced by cat food companies in the way vets can be.
I think you may be confusing research with "reading everything you can find on the internet".
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  #32  
Old 30.01.2015, 14:41
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Re: Cat food advice.

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I think you may be confusing research with "reading everything you can find on the internet".
Isn`t that a pretty high-handed reply?
A person can spend hours in a library reading reference and other books, so why not the internet?
Because the internet is easier and quicker to access.
And who writes books? Anybody.
Who writes on internet? Anybody.
So attempting to do some research all depends on reading what others have written on a subject. And then one has to filter it, using common sense, trying something, trying something else. Listening to what others say, trying, eliminating, and watching the results.

Vets do study medicine. They do know what a nutritious diet consists of, according what they have studied. Do they really know what specific ingredients are in the various pet foods? Is meat real meat? Or ground down pink slime of crushed bones/organs of animals the cat/dog would never consume in a natural hunting life? Not to mention how an animal would ingest the E`s, F`s and other chemicals?

If all pets ate truly nutritious foods, would there be so many pet illnesses?
Without domestic pet illness, Dr Vet would again be relegated back to dealing with only wild or farm animals out in mud/barns - and not indoors all day dealing with and injecting furry cuddlies, who now also require chronic medication, like humans do?

Sorry, I do sound fanatical, I know. But I believe if one has pets, one could take the time to make them real food, not pour it out of a plastic bag or tin can?
A bit of steamed fresh fish mixed with wholewheat bread?
Fresh/raw meat with vegetables/rice/maize?
Eggs? Food scraps?

As a humourous aside here - I was having to buy some dry cat food for a family member (no I don`t try and influence them!) and was reading out loud the different flavours .... Lamb flavour? Beef flavour? Chicken flavour? when my 5yr old grand-daughter piped up "Don`t they have Mouse flavour?"
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  #33  
Old 30.01.2015, 14:43
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Re: Cat food advice.

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"Only the best" being what?
As "only the best" is interpreted these days ....... the most expensive!
In a bag or can of course.
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Old 09.02.2015, 14:39
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Re: Cat food advice.

Wow an incredible amount of feedback. Thank you all!

There seems to be still much debate on what is best for cats, even different vets have different views.

He seems happy with the dry food (purina) and wet food on occasion (even though certain flavours he doesn't touch at all).

I have noticed strange variations regarding the meat content in different wet food, I will definitely watch out for this in the future.

I would love to go "natural" and prepare him food myself. Perhaps slowly with time as he is very fussy and it could be costly and time consuming finding out what he likes. Though it is a challenge I am willing to accept
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Old 03.03.2015, 10:08
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Re: Cat food advice.

Yes. I'm trying to reduce the wet food from my cat. I brought her with me when I moved to Switzerland and after 5 months my cat got terrible food allergy, things that se never had before and now just with allergy control wet food by Hills I can control her skin problem. But doing this I create another: tartar and also future problem because of intensive eating of wet food.
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Old 17.03.2015, 23:13
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Re: Cat food advice.

Cats are obligate carnivores which mean they need to eat 100% meat. They have zero need for grains, fruits or vegetables. All types of cats in the wild eat raw meat. Domestic cats typically eat mice, small rabbits, rodents and birds. These prey animals contain about 70% water. Cats do not have a strong thirst drive and are not good about drinking water. Most if not all of their water should come from their food.

Whats wrong with dry food?
1. water content way too low
2. carbohydrates are too high
3. the protein is often plant based and not high enough animal based protein
4 the food is heavily processed with many unnecessary additives

Basically a dry fed cat is in a consistent state of dehydration and it is believed that many health issues that affect cats are caused by a dry diet such as: obesity, diabetes, kidney disease, food allergies, hairballs, IBD and crystals.

Its true that cats love dry food, but just like children like candy and mcdonnalds they shouldn't eat it everyday.

Basically all wet foods are better than dry foods because wet foods have less calories, higher protein and higher water content. However there is a big range in quality and price of wet food.

This is why I feed my cat a 100% raw meat diet and have for over a year now with amazing results. The biggest is his poop. He poops less, its smaller, drier and almost completely odorless.

I prepare all the food for one month and it costs me about 40.- franc a month. I buy all the meat at Coop and Migros. I am happy to share my experience with anyone who is interested in providing the best for your cat.

I am in no way judging those who feed only dry food. I fed my first cat dry food her whole life because I didn't know any better and didn't think to research what I was actually feeding.
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Old 18.03.2015, 17:20
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Re: Cat food advice.

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Cats are obligate carnivores which mean they
need to eat 100% meat.

Don't forget that they need minerals etc. like calcium etc. and especially taurine, amounts of the latter being extremely important for cats. Make sure you know how much taurine and other minerals your cat is getting from his diet and if you should add more.

Cats do not have a strong thirst drive and are not good about drinking water. Most if not all of their water should come from their food.

Agreed - adding a drinking fountain along with bowls of water in multiple locations instead of just one place can help them drink more, but this does not mean that cats should be fed solely dry food just because they have more opportunities to drink.

Whats wrong with dry food?
1. water content way too low
2. carbohydrates are too high
3. the protein is often plant based and not high enough animal based protein
4 the food is heavily processed with many unnecessary additives

Basically a dry fed cat is in a consistent state of dehydration and it is believed that many health issues that affect cats are caused by a dry diet such as: obesity, diabetes, kidney disease, food allergies, hairballs, IBD and crystals.

Hardly surprising, with the first (mostly couple) of ingredients in many dry food brands being plant-based How one can think that cats should eat that is beyond me.

Basically all wet foods are better than dry foods because wet foods have less calories, higher protein and higher water content. However there is a big range in quality and price of wet food.

not necessarily
thanks for your input
In a pet food store a while back I was looking at the different cat foods on offer. I decided to inquire about the availability of raw food shipping at the store. I then was advised that cats should have at least part of their diet consist of dry food, to make sure they clean their teeth. I then asked how clean our teeth would be if we ate cookies. Bones and proper consistency raw and wet food (cat needing to chew rather than gulp food that isn't dry) are what cleans cat's teeth - lions don't have kibble at their disposal to clean their teeth.

Last edited by glowjupiter; 18.03.2015 at 17:49.
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  #38  
Old 18.03.2015, 21:42
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Re: Cat food advice.

Glowjupiter,
Thanks for your response. I agree with all of your comments. Feeding raw is more complicated than just throwing down some meat. In fact an imbalanced raw diet that does not include the necessary supplements is very dangerous and you are right a cat without enough taurine for example can go blind and ultimately die. I have done extensitve research and consult with different vets to provide a balanced and complete diet.

My statement was a bit general in that all wet food is better than dry food. Of course quality can very greatly in both wet and dry food. But in general wet food is better than dry.

It's nice to meet others who are also concerned about pets nutrition :-) cheers. I share all of my experience feeding raw on my blog if you are interested.
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